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#300659 - 22/09/2007 05:28 Re: Seeburg Wallbox -- Picture [Re: Cris]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Quote:
I'd like to develop something that would interface with my slimserver network in the house, say over WiFi


Is the empeg capable of sending commands to the slimserver via TCP/IP?

This could be the solution I am looking for! That was I could just hook up to the empeg for local output, or configure it to control any one of the slimserver devices, that would be an awesome end goal, and possibly the cheapest as no extra hardware would be needed

Cheers

Cris.

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#300660 - 22/09/2007 07:50 Re: Seeburg Wallbox -- Picture [Re: Cris]
andym
carpal tunnel

Registered: 17/01/2002
Posts: 3977
Loc: Manchester UK
Yep, shouldn't be a problem. However, if you're going to end up using a slimserver, why don't you just build something that runs on the server instead? Assuming you have a spare serial port on that?
_________________________
Cheers,

Andy M

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#300661 - 22/09/2007 09:52 Re: Seeburg Wallbox -- Picture [Re: andym]
julf
veteran

Registered: 01/10/2001
Posts: 1290
Loc: Amsterdam, The Netherlands
Quote:
However, if you're going to end up using a slimserver, why don't you just build something that runs on the server instead?


Maybe because (at least for me) the server is in the boiler room, and the Wallbox (and speakers) will be 2 floors and half a house away...

Wonder if the code cold be run on a Rio Receiver - hmm, wonder if it can do the serial I/O...

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#300662 - 22/09/2007 12:28 Re: Seeburg Wallbox -- Picture [Re: julf]
andym
carpal tunnel

Registered: 17/01/2002
Posts: 3977
Loc: Manchester UK
Quote:
Quote:
However, if you're going to end up using a slimserver, why don't you just build something that runs on the server instead?


Maybe because (at least for me) the server is in the boiler room, and the Wallbox (and speakers) will be 2 floors and half a house away...

Wonder if the code cold be run on a Rio Receiver - hmm, wonder if it can do the serial I/O...


The reason I mentioned it is because I know the layout of Cris' house. A rio reciever did cross my mind, I seem to remember reading somewhere that there is a serial port in there somewhere, and the built-in amp would probably come in very useful.
_________________________
Cheers,

Andy M

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#300663 - 23/09/2007 18:07 Re: Seeburg Wallbox -- Picture [Re: andym]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Quote:
The reason I mentioned it is because I know the layout of Cris' house. A rio reciever did cross my mind, I seem to remember reading somewhere that there is a serial port in there somewhere, and the built-in amp would probably come in very useful.


I think the best solution for my layout would be WiFi/wired TCP/IP control of a streaming device such as the Squeezebox. I say this because the system in my font room is hidden under the stairs, and a wireless platform would be perfect as I could place the wallbox where I like without worrying about getting the audio feed to the amp.

For the moment getting it to work with the empeg would be great

Cheers

Cris.

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#300664 - 27/09/2007 13:35 Rabbit Semiconductor Development Kit [Re: Cris]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
I have purchased a Rabbit Semiconductor 4010 Development Kit, they were on offer at their European Store. Quite reasonable really, I rang the local supplier and they told me that is 17 below cost to them.

I also have the commercial serial adaptor on it's way, I figured my skills in this area are seriously minimal so I needed an easy solution to check everything is working before I start my own development. I did try to contact the guys linked right at the start of this thread, but no joy as yet, he was using a Rabbit board to good effect it seems.

The empeg controlling the slimserver would of course be the ultimate solution for me

Cheers

Cris.

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#300665 - 04/10/2007 16:25 Seeburg Wallbox - Almost Ready [Re: Cris]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
After a mini spending spree on eBay I have several options on their way

I have one in really good condition on it's way from the states, and I have a couple of scrappers I am hoping to make good from here in the UK.

So, to my question. I am still no closer to understanding where I need to start with the empeg side of things, the lead can be made up no probs, but the drivers is still a real puzzle to me, can someone lend a hand here and build up a kernel for me?

Which serial port are you using Tom, the one on the back of the empeg itself or the sled?

Cheers

Cris.

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#300666 - 08/10/2007 00:43 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
Attached is the archive of my seeburg project. I've included a prebuilt v478 Hijack kernel with my wallbox driver patches, the wallbox app, and schematics for the seeburg interface.

-Techtom


--------------------- Readme.txt-------------------
Installation instructions.

I've included a prebuilt v478 kernel image so you don't need to build it from the source tree.

1) Flash kernel with v478_p_seeburg.zImage. I just ftp "put" v478_p_seeburg.zImage to /proc/empeg_kernel
2) ftp the wallbox app to the /empeg/bin directory on your empeg.
3) connect up to the serial port (without the seeburg adaptor) of your empeg and type the following commands:

q ; stops the player
# rw ; mounts the file system as read/write
# chmod a+rx /empeg/bin/wallbox ; enables the wallbox application to be executed
# mknod /dev/wallbox c 51 0 ; creates the wallbox device

4) to test the wallbox application, find the fid of one of your longer playlists (mine was a7d0) and type

# /empeg/bin/wallbox a7d0 &

5) the wallbox application should have started and read the playlist without errors
6) restart the player by typing:

# player

7) connect the seeburg serial port adaptor (see schematic) to your empeg.
8) insert a coin into your seeburg and select a song.
9) the wallbox application should detect the button press and queue the song from the playlist

10) once this is working, you can add an EXEC_ONCE command to your config.ini file. Make sure everything is working correcly BEFORE you add the EXEC_ONCE command to your config.ini file. If you forget to include the "&" at the end, the empeg will not start the player and you'll need to ftp a new config.ini to the empeg.

;@EXEC_ONCE /empeg/bin/wallbox a7d0 &


-Techtom


PS if you want to build your own kernel, just apply the driver.patch and time_h_477.patch to the latest
hijack kernel source tree.


Attachments
304285-Seeburg.zip (560 downloads)



Edited by techtom (08/10/2007 00:56)

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#300667 - 08/10/2007 00:49 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
Quote:
So, to my question. I am still no closer to understanding where I need to start with the empeg side of things, the lead can be made up no probs, but the drivers is still a real puzzle to me, can someone lend a hand here and build up a kernel for me?


The Seeburg.zip attachment in my previous post should have every thing you need. I don't know if it will work with a seeburg running on 50Hz. My advice to you is to get a small 100w 60hz inverter and run the seeburg off of that.

Quote:
Which serial port are you using Tom, the one on the back of the empeg itself or the sled?


The serial port on the back of the empeg.


Edited by techtom (08/10/2007 03:20)

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#300668 - 08/10/2007 13:14 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Thanks, this is great!

I have all the stuff together (inc a sort of working seeburg!) just need to find the time to put it all together now.

60Hz transformers are quite expensive I think, at least I haven't seen any readily available, so I'm going to try it at 50Hz 25v AC and see how I go on.

Update soon

Cheers

Cris.

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#300669 - 08/10/2007 16:34 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
Quote:

60Hz transformers are quite expensive I think, at least I haven't seen any readily available,


I was suggesting using a cheap $24 inverter like this one http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4965458. That would get you 120V @ 60hz. You can use any 50HZ transformer, as long as the ratio is correct. e.g you could use a 220V:48V @50Hz transformer connected to the output of the 120V inverter. You would get 24V @ 60hz.

Quote:

...I'm going to try it at 50Hz 25v AC and see how I go on.


Mount the filesystem RW before running the wallbox app. When the state machine fails, it dumps the 256 samples to a file called "badstate_7xx.bin" where the 700 number is the state that failed. Send me the bin file and I can see if it is an easy fix.

The format of the file is very simple. It's just 256 four byte words where the LSB is the state of the seeburg switch and the upper 31 bits are the accumulated count of system time ticks.

-Techtom

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#300670 - 08/10/2007 17:35 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Thanks for the tips

I will give it a go with the 230v to 25v @50Hz transformer I have and see how it works.

I have been messing around with the "scrap" wall boxes I got hold of and have got a working 3W1 like yours out of them so far. Well I say working I am having trouble with a leaf switch just to the left of the motor. It seems to be worn, and the adjustment is very fine, but I can get it to select what I want now

They really are amazing devices, it's all a bit like black magic how it works, but as I make my way around the mech I am starting to make sense of it all.

I also have all the parts for the serial lead, so in the next couple of days I should have the chance to get it all up ad running.

Thanks again, I'll post here when I get it hooked up and working (or not!)

Cheers

Cris.

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#300671 - 08/10/2007 20:28 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
I couldn't resist

I got out the soldering iron and hooked it all up. It kinda works too....

Code:
Starting bash.
empeg:/empeg/bin# rw
EXT2-fs warning: mounting unchecked fs, running e2fsck is recommended
empeg:/empeg/bin# /empeg/bin/wallbox 83b0 &
[1] 103
empeg:/empeg/bin#
Seeburg Wallbox Application Version 1.0 by Scott Swazey
Read 200 items from playlist 83b0

player
Timezone: Atlantic/South_Georgia
Hijack: intercepting config.ini

player.cpp : 564:empeg-car 3.00-alpha7 2004/02/13.
Prolux 4 empeg car - 2.1490 Feb 13 2004
Vcb: 0x4070e000
bad state 778, button 0, letter 0, ticks 18
Logged 256 samples to /bad_state_778.bin



Edit - Durr found file in root, find it attached.

So I am happy that it seems to work ok, just the 50Hz problem I think

Cheers

Cris.


Attachments
304306-bad_state_778.bin (505 downloads)


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#300672 - 08/10/2007 21:39 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
You didn't say what button you pressed and doesn't look right quite right. For even letters (A,C,E,G,J) it should send the # of pulses followed by a long low. then it will stay high for 200ms and then it will pulse the letter pair (AB=1, CD=2, etc) followed by all high. (see attached image of your bad_state_778 and button A02)

For even letters (B,D,F,H,K) it will send 10 + # pulses followed by 200ms high and then the pulse of the letter pair as above.

In your case, it means the contacts are dirty or broken.

-Techtom


Attachments
304309-Bad788.PNG (960 downloads)



Edited by techtom (08/10/2007 22:04)

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#300673 - 08/10/2007 21:56 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 30588
Loc: Seattle, WA
Shouldn't it debounce?
_________________________
Tony Fabris

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#300674 - 08/10/2007 21:58 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
If you have access to a linux host you can convert the bad_state.bin file into a format that excel can read. Use the following command:

# od -td4 -w4 bad_state_778.bin > bad_state_778.txt

Open the .txt file in excel. Do not double click to open it. You must choose the File->Open command in Excel to open bad_state_778.txt. Choose Fixed width and you should have a spread sheet with two columns (not all the data in one).

Open the attached spread and copy the second column of bad_state778.txt into Column "B" of the attached spread sheet. Look at the top chart to see if the data is correct.

Based on the state 778 and the tick count (18), 50Hz will not work with the current wallbox application. I can probably write a 50hz version, but I will need the "bad_state_7xx.bin" for the following Buttons A1,B2,E5,F5,J10,K10. Don't send them to me until you've plotted them using the attached spread sheet to confirm that they are correct. Your current wallbox is clearly broken... Sorry

-Techtom


Attachments
304314-WallboxDecoder.xls (1090 downloads)


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#300675 - 08/10/2007 22:01 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: tfabris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
Quote:
Shouldn't it debounce?

Yes, it does. But this not a debounce problem. The waveform is wrong.

The driver is just a 10ms sampler. When the CTS line goes low, the driver collects the state of the CTS pin every 10ms for the next 2.56 seconds. The wallbox app tries to convert the samples into pulses and the pulses into buttons. If the app can't, it just writes out the samples, untouched. Plotting the samples from a 50Hz wallbox, should show the correct waveform, but with longer pulses. The app can't convert it to a button, but the plot should still be correct.

-Techtom


Edited by techtom (08/10/2007 22:13)

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#300676 - 09/10/2007 03:23 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 30588
Loc: Seattle, WA
Quote:
Yes, it does. But this not a debounce problem. The waveform is wrong.

Ah, *that* makes perfect sense. Carry on!
_________________________
Tony Fabris

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#300677 - 09/10/2007 04:32 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Quote:
Your current wallbox is clearly broken... Sorry


Well I don't find that hard to believe, I will get some contact cleaner etc... and give it another go. That was for button A1.

How many times should the selector be going round? It only goes round once per selection at the moment, maybe I'll try and take a video when I get home tonight. As I said the box is in a pretty bad way, but seems to function as it should on the most part.

Cheers

Cris.

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#300678 - 09/10/2007 05:40 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
Quote:
Quote:
Your current wallbox is clearly broken... Sorry


Well I don't find that hard to believe, I will get some contact cleaner etc... and give it another go. That was for button A1.


Hmm it doesn't look anything like A1. See the attached comparison of J10 and A01.

Quote:

How many times should the selector be going round? It only goes round once per selection at the moment


one complete rotatation of the pulsing dial. The coin counter will advance one step for each selection.

Quote:

As I said the box is in a pretty bad way, but seems to function as it should on the most part.


The motor may be running, but it's not pulsing correctly. Have you been able to load up one of the bad_state_7xx.bin file into excel? Collect bin files for A01 & J10 and compare them to the attache logic analyzer file.

-Techtom


Attachments
304327-buttonsJ10andA01.PNG (593 downloads)


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#300679 - 09/10/2007 09:40 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
When I get home I'll post a picture of the pulse wheel, I think it may be starting from the wrong posistion.

I don't have linux here (apart from a clarckconnect server could try it on that) so I haven't been able to get the files into excel, I'll try that later, but it is very interesting to see your results. I am thinking it may be something to do with the wiring behind the selection buttons, the mech seems to have been adjusted sometime in the past and that could be effecting the switch contact ???

Cheers

Cris.

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#300680 - 09/10/2007 14:31 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
I have made a short video to show you the problem I have with this Seeburg unit, you can download it [REMOVED].

I think I am on top of the problem, and can see why the previous files looked so wrong. I will do some more fiddling...

Cheers

Cris.


Edited by Cris (09/10/2007 21:00)

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#300681 - 09/10/2007 15:50 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
I have made a change to the position of the pulse arm a little bit, it looks like it had slipped somehow, it seems to be operating much better.

I have dropped the data into the Excel document and it looks much better, I am getting some strange results with the other selctions, but I think I have a few more adjustments to make.

Does this look more like it?

Cheers

Cris.


Attachments
304354-304314-WallboxDecoder.xls (1122 downloads)


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#300682 - 09/10/2007 16:12 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
Quote:

I have dropped the data into the Excel document and it looks much better, I am getting some strange results with the other selctions, but I think I have a few more adjustments to make.

Does this look more like it?


Yes, it looks perfect. Now collect the the bad_state_7xx.bin files for the following buttons: A1,B2,E5,F6,J10,K10 and put them in a zip file. I'll take a look creating a version for 50Hz.

BTW B2 will look like 12 pulses and then 1 pulse. K10 will look like 20 pulses then 5 pulses.

-Techtom


Edited by techtom (09/10/2007 16:15)

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#300683 - 09/10/2007 16:30 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Here is what I have so far.

I am finding that 2 lots of samples are being taken for J10 nad K10, with number of ticks being 16, 17 or 18 (it seems to be random?).

Any ideas what's going on? I was thinking that the sample period may not be long enough so it starts the process again, for example K10 seems only to show the last 5 pulses.

Code:
bad state 778, button 0, letter 0, ticks 16
Logged 256 samples to /bad_state_778.bin
bad state 778, button 0, letter 0, ticks 18
Logged 256 samples to /bad_state_778.bin


Above is what is output when K10 is selected, the numbers of ticks changes but there are always 2 files, sometime the state is 770.

Cheers

Cris.

WOOT - 1000th post


Attachments
304356-Samples.zip (472 downloads)



Edited by Cris (09/10/2007 21:02)

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#300684 - 10/10/2007 00:13 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
techtom
journeyman

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 51
Loc: Southern California
Quote:
I am finding that 2 lots of samples are being taken for J10 and K10

Any ideas what's going on? I was thinking that the sample period may not be long enough so it starts the process again.


Yes, you are correct. It's is taking longer than 2.56 seconds to send K10 on your wallbox. The worst case pulse time on your 50Hz wallbox is about 114.5 msec. My 60Hz wallbox worst case pulse time is 76.5ms. I would have expected the worst case pulse time of a 50Hz box to be 60/50*76.5ms = 92ms. Your box seems slow, you might want to try another wallbox, or try a slighly higer voltage, say 28-30V. Do the lights look nice and bright? Can you measure the AC voltage at the imput terminals when the motor is running?

-Techtom

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#300685 - 10/10/2007 04:52 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Quote:
Can you measure the AC voltage at the imput terminals when the motor is running?


Yea, it holds at 25v. The lights are nice and bright and are not effected by the motor running. The transformer I am using is pretty beefy, it does also have a 30v output, but I didn't want to stress the components too much.

The other boxes are not currently in a working state, this was the best of the bunch, but maybe I should give it up as a bad job?

I have a 200 selection unit on it's way. This is in much better condition, but hasn't turned up here due to the postal strike. MAybe I should wait for that to turn up.

Cheers

Cris.

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#300686 - 10/10/2007 05:10 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: techtom]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Quote:
or try a slighly higer voltage, say 28-30V


Ok this is interesting.

I timed the pulse arm at 25v to be just over 4 seconds, at 30v it's 5.4 seconds !!! Weird !!!

The light also look overly bright at 30v, so I don't think that it a very good idea. Worth a try though

Cheers

Cris.

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#300687 - 10/10/2007 13:52 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: Cris]
larry818
old hand

Registered: 01/10/2002
Posts: 956
Loc: Fullerton, Calif.
Just curious, do you have a real transformer or some kind of chopping supply?

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#300688 - 10/10/2007 15:26 Re: Seeburg Wallbox - Release 1.0 [Re: larry818]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1896
Loc: Leeds, UK
Not really sure what you are asking.

It's just a normal transformer, not in a case or anything, I am not sure what it is rated at but it seems to hold up just fine under the load of the seeburg.

When I says it's beefy it must weight 4kgs+

I can take a picture if you think that may have something to do with it???

Cheers

Cris.

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