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#40672 - 07/10/2001 07:42 Cross Fading
Taym
pooh-bah

Registered: 18/06/2001
Posts: 2405
Loc: Roma, Italy
I just installed an "intelligent" Cross-Fader plugin for winamp. I really like it! So, how could I help proposing something like that for I the Great Empeg? Basically, what would you think of a Cross-fader effect between songs when listening, for example, in random order? It could be a simple "play mode" to be selected as an item of the "shuffle" menu, which in its turn may be renamed to something like "play mode". (maybe it's already like that in 2.0?). If anybody wants to try such a thing on winamp, it is called
SqrSoft_Advanced_Crossfading_Output.exe
and it's here .
Very simply, while song one fades out, song two fades in, and they merge perfectly with avery very nice effect.

Taym
_________________________
MK II BLUE/RED 12GB #923
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= Taym =
MK2a #040103216 * 100Gb *All/Colors* Radio * 3.0a11 * Hijack = taympeg

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#40673 - 07/10/2001 08:23 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
edwin
member

Registered: 26/09/2000
Posts: 194
Loc: Druten, The Netherlands
Yeah, I really love this plugin too!! I've used it several times on parties. Just my laptop, a mixing panel and some HK Audio speakers were all the things needed. Stop, skip, rewind, fast forward also cross fade very nicel.

ญญ______________
Edwin de Vaan
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[white]ญญ______________[/white]
Edwin de Vaan aka FLaSHmAStER

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#40674 - 07/10/2001 09:46 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
jwickis
addict

Registered: 24/08/2000
Posts: 658
Loc: India
Here's a previous post on cross fading

#695-Mk2/8 colors-12Gig w/Tuner- awaits v2.x & Voice Recog.

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#40675 - 07/10/2001 09:55 Re: Cross Fading [Re: jwickis]
Taym
pooh-bah

Registered: 18/06/2001
Posts: 2405
Loc: Roma, Italy
Ok, that thread seems to end up talking about the voladj plugin. If I am not mistaken nobody has written any crossfader, yet. However, I'd like to see it implemented in the v.2.0 official empeg sw, if possible. That's way too a nice feature, It really increases the pleasure of listening to music, in my opinion.

Taym
_________________________
MK II BLUE/RED 12GB #923
_________________________
= Taym =
MK2a #040103216 * 100Gb *All/Colors* Radio * 3.0a11 * Hijack = taympeg

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#40676 - 07/10/2001 12:27 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
jwickis
addict

Registered: 24/08/2000
Posts: 658
Loc: India
OK how about this thread then.

#695-Mk2/8 colors-12Gig w/Tuner- awaits v2.x & Voice Recog.

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#40677 - 07/10/2001 12:30 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
jwickis
addict

Registered: 24/08/2000
Posts: 658
Loc: India
.......or this discussion perhaps.

#695-Mk2/8 colors-12Gig w/Tuner- awaits v2.x & Voice Recog.

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#40678 - 07/10/2001 12:36 Re: Cross Fading [Re: jwickis]
Taym
pooh-bah

Registered: 18/06/2001
Posts: 2405
Loc: Roma, Italy
Thanks for the links to the previous threads. So, looking at the 2.0, it seems it will not be there, either. Or is it one of the feature not mentioned? :)

Taym
_________________________
MK II BLUE/RED 12GB #923
_________________________
= Taym =
MK2a #040103216 * 100Gb *All/Colors* Radio * 3.0a11 * Hijack = taympeg

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#40679 - 07/10/2001 12:57 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
jwickis
addict

Registered: 24/08/2000
Posts: 658
Loc: India
OK, sorry for the links, I also would like to see if someone could create a fader of some sort whether it's in a 2.x version or as an add-on..

#695-Mk2/8 colors-12Gig w/Tuner- awaits v2.x & Voice Recog.

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#40680 - 08/10/2001 09:27 Re: Cross Fading [Re: jwickis]
SE_Sport_Driver
carpal tunnel

Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
I love the plug-in and think this plug in would be great on the empeg! Maybe we can contact the author of it and see if he has any interest in making a version compatible with the empeg?

32GB Mk. II in a WRX
Detroit, MI USA
www.PfeifferBeer.com
_________________________
Brad B.

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#40681 - 08/10/2001 16:19 Re: Cross Fading [Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
jwickis
addict

Registered: 24/08/2000
Posts: 658
Loc: India
Talk about something to wow your friends and something that a HU CD/Cass. player couldn't. I already get them sometimes when I pause the radio using the pause button and tell them I can even pause a station sort of like a Tivo.

#695-Mk2/8 colors-12Gig w/Tuner- awaits v2.x & Voice Recog.

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#40682 - 09/10/2001 08:52 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5522
Loc: London, UK
No, crossfading between tracks is not going to be in v2.0. We wanted it to be, but other things became more important. Maybe it'll appear later in v2.x, but I'm not promising anything.


-- roger
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-- roger

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#40683 - 09/10/2001 16:04 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Roger]
SE_Sport_Driver
carpal tunnel

Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
I realize it isn't a priority, but thanks for keeping it in mind!

32GB Mk. II in a WRX
Detroit, MI USA
www.PfeifferBeer.com
_________________________
Brad B.

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#40684 - 09/10/2001 18:58 Re: Cross Fading [Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7057
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
Hmm... I'm totally hypothesizing here but it seems to me that now that the product is EOL, this feature, which has been requested many times, might actually happen. Since automatic crossfading doesn't really exist in other commercial audio products (does it???) it wouldn't be a feature that would sell many Empegs/RioCars. Windows Media, WAV, improved tuner, bookmarking, new shuffle modes are all big features that had commercial/marketing impact, so I think that's why they were worked on first.

So the way I'm thinking, now that the product is EOL, I can see this being worked on as a "background task" if the developers want to sneak something cool in. Obviously for 2.0, WMV and WAV support were priorities, as were improved tuner support, the bookmarking, shuffle modes, etc. What other major features could they need to put in? Okay voice recognition should be a priority. then what? I think this is a good candidate to be one of the first major features to make its way into a post-2.0 build. The theoretical discussion of how it would work has already happened in another thread on this BBS, and I think the developers even chimed in at one point. So let's hope this gets close to the top of the list as the 2.0 baseline stabilizes and the developers look for something new and fun to throw into the player's bag of tricks.

-Tony
MkII #554
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- Tony C
my empeg stuff

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#40685 - 10/10/2001 11:07 Re: Cross Fading [Re: tonyc]
rmitz
member

Registered: 09/06/1999
Posts: 106
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA, USA
Nah, that's not the way to go. A plugin architecture will allow other people to do these interesting projects--that's really where they should spend the time. Now that v2.0's nearly out...here's hoping.

Fly me to the moon...
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Fly me to the moon...

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#40686 - 10/10/2001 12:10 Re: Cross Fading [Re: rmitz]
SE_Sport_Driver
carpal tunnel

Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
Various Audio Plug-Ins that would rock:

1. Cross fade
2. Compression
3. Noise Cancellation via Mic Input (would cancel out road noise)
4. Reverb Settings (I actually hate these)
5. Funky effects for dance music?

32GB Mk. II in a WRX
Detroit, MI USA
www.PfeifferBeer.com
_________________________
Brad B.

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#40687 - 10/10/2001 14:09 Re: Cross Fading [Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
mcomb
pooh-bah

Registered: 31/08/1999
Posts: 1649
Loc: San Carlos, CA
6. Volume adjustment via Mic input (more outside noise == more volume)

-Mike

_________________________
EmpMenuX - ext3 filesystem - Empeg iTunes integration

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#40688 - 10/10/2001 15:40 Re: Cross Fading [Re: rmitz]
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7057
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
Yeah but a plugin architecture adds no value in and of itself. No features are added, though the door is left open for features to be added by 3rd party developers.

The dev team has not shown much interest in implementing a plugin architecture, it's rather complicated to do. The 2.0 redesign doesn't include this plugin architecture, and I doubt they'd do another re-design to accomodate this. I would personally LOVE it and would probably try to develop some fun audio and vis plugins with it, but it didn't seem that was the direction they wanted to go. Any Empeg developers who want to chime in on this feel free. Actually, fix v2.0 and THEN chime in. :)

I defintely lobbied on this board for the plugin architecture but why would they do it now if they didn't do it when they went to the drawing board for an entirely new design?

-Tony
MkII #554
_________________________
- Tony C
my empeg stuff

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#40689 - 10/10/2001 18:42 Re: Cross Fading [Re: tonyc]
Taym
pooh-bah

Registered: 18/06/2001
Posts: 2405
Loc: Roma, Italy
Well, since empeg sw development is continuing, and since that is due to its deployment in the future secret product(s), I think it would make sense for empeg ppl as well to implement a plug in architecture, which would boost third party partecipation to the success of the product(s) themselves, making everybody happy. Winamp is a remarcable example of how powerful a plugin architecture is in creating a successful community around a piece of software, and how that makes the sw itself successful. I would strongly recommend empeg team to go on the plug-in architecture path, if they're interested in one of their fan's opinion .
Just wanted to add my voice to your lobbying.

Taym
_________________________
MK II BLUE/RED 12GB #923
_________________________
= Taym =
MK2a #040103216 * 100Gb *All/Colors* Radio * 3.0a11 * Hijack = taympeg

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#40690 - 11/10/2001 07:08 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
Dearing
addict

Registered: 22/07/1999
Posts: 453
Loc: Florida
Exactly! How cool would it be for a 3rd-party development like Voladj to make it into another Sonic|Blue product? I imagine RJLov would be more flattered than insulted if SB used his code in the Rio Receiver, for example. If they open the architecture for plugins, they may indeed make money off of it (ok, maybe not lots of money, but new features are still cool enough to sell units, no matter who codes them).
Jason

_~= Dearing =~_
"WAY too happy about having #99."
_________________________
_~= Dearing =~_
Gettin' back into it thanks to slimrio!

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#40691 - 11/10/2001 10:33 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Dearing]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 30548
Loc: Seattle, WA
If dynamic range compression appeared in any of the empeg team's products, I think that they'd probably use an algorithm of their own rather than Richard's code.

Don't get me wrong, his code is great, it's just that there's probably more efficient places to put the code than shoehorning it into the kernel. It'd probably be better if it were in the player software.

___________
Tony Fabris
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Tony Fabris

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#40692 - 11/10/2001 14:07 Re: Cross Fading [Re: tfabris]
smu
old hand

Registered: 30/07/2000
Posts: 879
Loc: Germany (Ruhrgebiet)
Hi Tony

Don't get me wrong, his code is great, it's just that there's probably more efficient places to put the code than shoehorning it into the kernel. It'd probably be better if it were in the player software.

That is exactly where the plugin architecture would come in handy: The code could be moved from the kernel to the player (a plugin module for the player).

cu,
sven



proud MkII owner (12GB blue/green/smoked, was #080000113 is #090001010)
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proud owner of MkII 40GB & MkIIa 60GB both lit by God and HiJacked by Lord

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#40693 - 12/10/2001 06:08 Re: Cross Fading [Re: smu]
Dearing
addict

Registered: 22/07/1999
Posts: 453
Loc: Florida
Yeah.

_~= Dearing =~_
"WAY too happy about having #99."
_________________________
_~= Dearing =~_
Gettin' back into it thanks to slimrio!

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#40694 - 12/10/2001 07:51 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Dearing]
Terminator
old hand

Registered: 12/01/2000
Posts: 1079
Loc: Dallas, TX
uh huh


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#40695 - 12/10/2001 07:52 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Dearing]
Terminator
old hand

Registered: 12/01/2000
Posts: 1079
Loc: Dallas, TX
ok


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#40696 - 12/10/2001 12:10 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Terminator]
Dearing
addict

Registered: 22/07/1999
Posts: 453
Loc: Florida
yep.

_~= Dearing =~_
"WAY too happy about having #99."
_________________________
_~= Dearing =~_
Gettin' back into it thanks to slimrio!

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#40697 - 15/10/2001 07:49 Re: Cross Fading [Re: smu]
altman
carpal tunnel

Registered: 19/05/1999
Posts: 3449
Loc: Palo Alto, CA
We already have a plugin architecture; it's just compile-time not run-time. There are problems with run-time plugins (eg .so's) which hinder us from adding such support - mainly memory use due to symbol tables.

The reason why it hasn't appeared is due to a couple of factors:

1. We're not going to cripple the products by adding a plugin interface (ie, we won't add it if we can't find a way to do it without sacrificing the "normal user" experience - and that includes having to reduce caching space)

2. We're unlikely to do it without a "proper" way to manage plug-ins, eg emplode control. Without this, the number of plugin users would probably only be about 20 people and wouldn't justify the work involved.

Plugins are nice in winamp, etc, but they don't operate under the same restrictions as we do. If we can add them neatly & cleanly, we will do so. This is not saying that it'll never happen, but it takes programmer time, and there are much higher priority tasks to complete first.

Hugo



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#40698 - 15/10/2001 08:51 Plug-in architecture, was Re: Cross Fading [Re: altman]
tms13
old hand

Registered: 30/07/2001
Posts: 1115
Loc: Lochcarron and Edinburgh
In reply to:

We already have a plugin architecture; it's just compile-time not run-time. There are problems with run-time plugins (eg .so's) which hinder us from adding such support - mainly memory use due to symbol tables.




/me wonders...

Perhaps a halfway compromise could eliminate the symbols by linking at install time? There'd have to be a link editor on disk (unless this stuff was done it the upgrade host) and enough of a compiler back-end to write an object file (*.o) containing the array of plugin descriptors (one entry per module), but no extra memory overhead at run-time.

That would eliminate the need to do run-time loading of modules - unless we really expect to add and remove plugins without restarting the player...

--
Toby Speight - 040103385
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Toby Speight
030103016 (80GB Mk2a, blue)
030102806 (0GB Mk2a, blue)

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#40699 - 27/03/2003 15:59 Re: Cross Fading [Re: Taym]
SE_Sport_Driver
carpal tunnel

Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
I just wanted to cheer for empeg ver. 3.0!
_________________________
Brad B.

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#40700 - 28/03/2003 13:49 Re: Cross Fading [Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
justinlarsen
old hand

Registered: 31/12/2001
Posts: 1109
Loc: Petaluma, CA
wooooohoooooo!!! CHEER!!! life is good!
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---- Justin Larsen

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#40701 - 08/04/2003 10:52 Re: Cross Fading [Re: mcomb]
MinerTwoFour
journeyman

Registered: 10/02/2003
Posts: 78
Loc: St. Louis, MO
Regarding an older post, how about a feature that automatically adjusts the volume to counteract road and engine noise at higher speeds? GM has implemented this in many of its vehicles.

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