Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post

Posted by: loren

Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 25/06/2003 16:09

I'm holding in my hands a shrinkwrapped copy of Galaxies... the box is heavy! The servers go live at 7am PST tomorrow morning.

So how many of ya pre-ordered or are planning to play Galaxies?? It's presold more than any other game in LucasArts history... to which i say DUH!

Here's to hoping it pulls us out of our financial slump!
Posted by: ricin

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 25/06/2003 17:58

I'll be playing, at least just to see if I like it. Haven't ordered the game yet though. <goes to do that now>
Posted by: drakino

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 25/06/2003 19:49

Too used to dynamic MMORPGs now to go back to a static one. Plus I still don't trust Verant all that much, even though for some reason I did buy Planetside.
Posted by: ithoughti

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 25/06/2003 22:01

never heard of it.

does that answer your question?
Posted by: Tim

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 26/06/2003 07:38

I pre-ordered mine back in January. It will be delivered in less than three hours to my house, and I'm stuck at work for another 7.5 hours.

Our office administrator (secretary) called in sick today... coincidence?
Posted by: ricin

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 27/06/2003 23:49

Ok, I got the game in the mail today.

Of course, when I ordered it I quickly realized that I don't have a machine to play it on. All of my machines are running Linux, and the two that would be suitable to play the game on happen to be important machines (one's my main file server, and the other is my DNS, and MySQL server). So, I finally decided to make a Windows machine out of the Shuttle box I bought from Rob (thanks again Rob!), which has been sitting in my closet for a while. I promptly ordered new parts, and ~ $450 later I have a chip, video card, and RAM on it's way to me.

Until the stuff gets here (probably Monday or Tuesday) I get to stare at the box and read through all the stuff.

As a side note, a co-worker invited me to join a group already. They've had it all organized and everything for the past two months or so. Some people are WAY too into things. Not to say that I might not be in the future, but that's a little scary. Anyway, I told him I'll play the game for a few days or weeks and I'll join if I decide I like it and am going to continue playing.

On the bright side, now I'll have a machine prepared to handle Half-Life 2.
Posted by: mschrag

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 28/06/2003 15:08

I was on the 3rd round of beta and ended up cancelling my preorder I'll wait for a couple months to buy it and try it again. Honestly, I had REALLY high hopes and maybe I just set my expectations too high, but I found it all rather boring. I ended up doing a lot of running around and being killed by bunny rabbits ...
Posted by: loren

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 08:27

hahah. see, that's why i don't get that kind of game in the first place. ALL YOU DO is run around and trade stuff. I watched a friend of mine play Everquest with a buddy of his last week and it was one of the most boring things i've ever seen. They were calling each other on their cell phones trying to organize groups and such, and trading rings and swords... I dunno. Just not my cup of tea. I can understand the role playing to some point however. There is some subverted sense of community somewhere in there...
Posted by: Dignan

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 09:05

I agree. This is just a story about someone who is out of touch. I can understand an online community (really?! ), but it's too much time and not rewarding to me at least.

Then again, I'm not a fan of multiplayer games in general.
Posted by: Tim

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 09:11

I never played any MMORPG before (unless you count MUDs and MOOs). A few of my friends tried to get me into EverQuest and I just didnt see any fun in it at all.

I have no idea why I think SWG is so much fun. One of my friends (who likes EQ and is already not liking SWG) has a theory. He thinks you need to be hardcore into Star Wars. I guess that really does have something to do with it.

One of the things I like is the sense of community. There is a cantina that always has people in it - and active conversations. The players don't just stick their characters in there while they are away. The entertainers dance and play and bands are going and characters are dancing to the music and talking to each other at the same time. It really is a cool dynamic to witness. That helps the enjoyability. Probably a lot.

Another is the immense possibilities. Do you want your character to join the Rebellion/Empire/Smugglers/any other of a ton of factions? What profession does your character follow? Questions like that make all the 'running around and trade stuff' worth it. The running around is a big part (how else do you get from point A to point B?), but the trading part can be minor depending on the profession involved.

It has some problems, but I think this game is some of the most fun I've had since Half-Life/TFC. Of course, I've been a Star Wars fan as long as I can remember
Posted by: wfaulk

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 09:36

While I understand the need for it, I have a problem paying $15 a month on top of the game itself in order to play it. And the game's useless by itself, so if I decide that I don't like the online stuff or it doesn't work for me or it's too much, then the $50 game purchase was wasted.

I see a few potential fixes for this.
  1. Don't charge for the online service or make it a lot less. $15 a month is really quite a bit, especially for someone who doesn't have a lot of free time. Maybe have an alternate per-hour charge. Or a per-hour charge with a monthly cap. Or go the Neverwinter Nights route where the servers are user-run but interactable, maybe with a connecting framework controlled by the developer.
  2. Don't charge for the game itself or make it a more nominal fee. AFAIK, it's useless by itself, so it doesn't make sense to me to charge for anything more than manufacturing and distribution costs. Making what I assume is a very large client downloadable might be out of the question, but a $5 or $10 charge at tle local shop is probably reasonable.
As it is, I have no interest in paying at least $65 just to see if I like the game, and then well more than that if I want to play it, even if just on weekends.

Of course, MMORPGs are probably cash cows for you guys, so all of this is probably just pissing in the wind.
Posted by: JeffS

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 09:46

I totally agree. I probably would have tried one of these games out if I didn't have to pay the huge entry fee. I realize that with a lot of them you get some free time to play, but honestly I'm not willing to shell out over $100 (since this is the sort of thing my wife and I could do together) and then find out that I'm not interested enough to keep playing. Actually I've been avidly anticipating SWG, but now that it's here I simply don't have the time to play.
Posted by: tonyc

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 11:01

There is some subverted sense of community somewhere in there...

Yeah, MMORPG's are, in my estimation, glorified MUD's with pretty graphics instead of text. The game itself is like 5% of the experience, the main thing people are after is interaction with other players. If people spent even half their MMORPG time interacting with real people and improving their real lives, I think the world would be a better place.

Of course, no disrespect is meant to those who play these games casually (or even to those who are similarly addicted,) but I've had several friends ruin their lives (or several years of them) with MUD's, and I see the same characteristics in many of these MMORPG games. I've had friends lose relationships, flunk out of school, lose jobs, and generally fsck up their lives to feed their online gaming addiction.

Then again, we humans are never short on ways to screw up our lives with addictions to all sorts of things, and maybe being addicted to a computer game and the pseudo-social contact that comes with it is more healthy than being an alcoholic or a gambling addict... But the effects can be just as bad, from what I've seen.
Posted by: loren

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 11:18

While I understand the need for it, I have a problem paying $15 a month on top of the game itself in order to play it. And the game's useless by itself, so if I decide that I don't like the online stuff or it doesn't work for me or it's too much, then the $50 game purchase was wasted.
A lot of people say this. And i agree it's a lot to pay unless you are really into it... i'd go for an hourly model rather than a monthy any day. BUT... in our defense... it costs a TON of money to have that many server running 24/7, with support, bandwidth, and admin costs on top of it. Add to that the fact that they are continually adding content. It's not just a static game, which is one thing about MMORPG's that i do find interesting. They are adding huge new features as the game progresses. Eventually you will be able to hop in your ship, fly up into space, and go to other planets as well as do full on space battles. People don't work for free, so the money to pay all the above mentioned developers, admins, support staff, etc, has to come from somewhere, and $50/game sure as hell won't cover it. You'd be amazed how LITTLE we make out of that amount in profit.

oh, and the first month is free, so it's $50 for the game and one free month. =]
Posted by: tonyc

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 11:24



"Illegal procedure. Improper quoting of a posted message. 5 yards, repeat first post."
Posted by: loren

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 11:45

LOL. yeah, Bitt does say he understands the need for it...

i got a little defensive... i'm just sick of hearing everyone say they don't wanna pay the montly fee... and they want all their music for free....hahah. =]
Posted by: Tim

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 11:47

In reply to:

Then again, we humans are never short on ways to screw up our lives with addictions to all sorts of things, and maybe being addicted to a computer game and the pseudo-social contact that comes with it is more healthy than being an alcoholic or a gambling addict...



One of the guys I was talking about in my previous post (addicted to EQ) was really addicted. It worked out best for him. He use to be a hardcore drinker and pot smoker. He figured out that if he skipped drinking and smoking, he could survive on less sleep and feel better at work, ie, more time to play EQ.

He quit the game (and has no desire to start back up), but still doesn't drink or smoke. Given that isn't a very popular scenario, but it has happened.
Posted by: TheRhino

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 11:49

I think the MMORPGs that are based off of films, games, etc. will do well compared to the others. For instance, there will be MMORPGs based on Marvel Comics, Lord Of The Rings, and Warcraft coming out in the near future. Those will do better than the unique stand-alone games ( sans Everquest), such as Planetside, Asheron's Call, etc.

Loren, is SWG a better online experience than Battlefield 1942? I know they are different genres, but I wonder which one will be occupying most of your time...
Posted by: JeffS

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 11:57

i'm just sick of hearing everyone say they don't wanna pay the montly fee...
I think actually he was saying he didn't want to pay the monthly fee and for the box. I have 0 problem with the monthly fee, but it's the initial startup cost that's kept me out of the game. I just don't like feeling "double billed". Even with the free month of play time, it's still hard to swallow a $100 entry fee (for two people) for something that costs $30 a month to play.

From what I've heard, though, these games aren't the easiest way to make a buck. I hope it works out for you guys, but I think ultimately it will. A lot of people have been looking forward to this one.
Posted by: wfaulk

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:01

Bitt does say he understands the need for it.
Actually, I think what Tony meant is that you quoted be but responded to his post.

Regardless, yeah -- I do understand, and the mutable content is cool, but it's hard to pay $50 for a game and then have to pay more on top of that. Obviously, the recurring fee covers the continuous costs, and the folks reaping those benefits should pay for that. It seems to me that it might work better if the game were distributed for free, LucasArts figured what the average number of months someone would play is and then prorate the cost of the game across that many months and forget about the free months thing. I think you'd have more people play if they could just pay $20 up front instead of $50.

But I'm not privy to LA's finances or sales numbers, so what do I know?
Posted by: tonyc

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:04

Actually, I think what Tony meant is that you quoted be but responded to his post.
Stuffy nose, Bitt?
Posted by: tfabris

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:13

One of the guys I was talking about in my previous post (addicted to EQ) was really addicted. It worked out best for him. He use to be a hardcore drinker and pot smoker. He figured out that if he skipped drinking and smoking, he could survive on less sleep and feel better at work, ie, more time to play EQ.
A year or two ago, I remember a comment in a PC gamer column saying "I'm thinking about giving up my EverCrack addiction for a heroin addiction. At least the heroin addiction doesn't show up on your monthly credit card statement."

The back page article of the last Game Developer magazine was on this topic as well. There's going to be some cases of litigation where SOE gets sued because of the addicted-to-everquest problem. No joke.
Posted by: tonyc

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:14

He quit the game (and has no desire to start back up), but still doesn't drink or smoke. Given that isn't a very popular scenario, but it has happened.
So if marijuana is the gateway drug, maybe Everquest is the gateway at the other end, to come off your addiction. Hey, they could market that...

"Everquest: It's the first step... the next 11 are up to you."
Posted by: tonyc

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:18

There's going to be some cases of litigation where SOE gets sued because of the addicted-to-everquest problem. No joke.
Ah, yes. Let's blame the game makers...

While I am very sympathetic to the addiciton, I am sickened by the fact that a case like this could make it to trial. What's next? Suing the makers of beanie babies for the thousands of old widowed ladies who are addicted to collecting beanie babies? How about antique dealers? Oh, I know, I should sue Ben and Jerry because their ice cream is so fscking good that I've bought 3 pints in the last week and a half!

Let's make sure that everything in the world is mediocre, so that nobody gets addicted to it. I love this country.
Posted by: Tim

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:29

There's going to be some cases of litigation where SOE gets sued because of the addicted-to-everquest problem. No joke.

How in the hell is that going to work? "Your Honor, they made a good game, and I'm so fundamentally weak-willed due to my own ignorance and obsessions, that they owe me money."

I had a slight glimmer of hope a few months back after a couple of overweight girls tried to sue McDonald's and the judge threw the case out. He said something to the effect of we make our own decisions and need to be accountable for them, nobody forced the girls to eat there. For a while I thought I was the only one who still believed that.
Posted by: tfabris

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:33

I don't recall the text of the article, but I think it was an extreme case where the user allegedly committed suicide right after logging off of EQ.
Posted by: tonyc

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:44

but I think it was an extreme case where the user allegedly committed suicide right after logging off of EQ.
I am neither a lawyer nor a legal historian, but haven't most or all of the "Someone made a (song | book | movie | game) and made me do something" cases been thrown out or adjudicated in favor of the authors of the (s | b | m | g) and not in favor of the tragically deceased?
Posted by: JeffS

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:52

I can see it now:

We’ve detected that you have spent too much time playing our game so you will now be logged off for the rest of the month in order to preserve your health. Please find some other healthy activity to engage in such as reading a book or riding a bicycle so that you can spend your time wisely until you are allowed to log in again. We are sorry for any inconvenience this might be to your gaming experience and we look forward to providing you gaming service in the future.
Posted by: tfabris

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 12:56

Don't laugh, one of the suggestions in that GD article was quite similar to that.
Posted by: peter

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 13:09

While I am very sympathetic to the addiciton, I am sickened by the fact that a case like this could make it to trial. What's next? Suing the makers of beanie babies for the thousands of old widowed ladies who are addicted to collecting beanie babies? How about antique dealers? Oh, I know, I should sue Ben and Jerry because their ice cream is so fscking good that I've bought 3 pints in the last week and a half!
I guess there's a fine line between knowing one's target demographic and taking advantage of vulnerable minorities...

Peter
Posted by: Tim

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 13:09

I love it when the ignorant masses cause rules/laws to be put into effect that affect people who are smart enough to make decisions on their own.
Posted by: peter

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 13:17

I love it when the ignorant masses cause rules/laws to be put into effect that affect people who are smart enough to make decisions on their own.
Perhaps the question is, is there a level of usage that in itself forms evidence that the user isn't smart enough to make decisions entirely on their own? A friend of mine at university was (at least IMO) addicted to gaming, but it's not obvious to me whether or not there's clear blue water between him and that faction of Empeg who've been heard to leave the pub at the end of the night saying "See you on shooting-people-game server such-and-such in half an hour".

Maybe one definition could be that you're gaming too much if it's starting to interfere with your drinking...

Peter
Posted by: tonyc

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 13:23

Maybe one definition could be that you're gaming too much if it's starting to interfere with your drinking...
...and that was the moment at which peter realized his calling in life, and founded the Cambridge Gaming Pub, where alcoholic game addicts could continue feeding both addictions without compromising one or the other.
Posted by: loren

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 13:33

wow, that sucks. the board just ate my half page response. argh. no time to retype... maybe later. but to summarize:

Rhino: BF1942, hands down. i like my playtime to be completely inaffectual to the next time i want to play, and i like to be able to get in and out whenever i feel like it.

Bitt: Other revenue models have been hammered over, but no one wants to take the risk and be the one to fail at it. LucasArts especially, we can't afford to at this point... and we don't have a past of huge risk taking.

Jeff and Tony: Yup, cutting off addicted players has definitely come up on our message boards many times. Social responsability is something that has been discussed believe it or not.
Posted by: JeffS

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 13:52

Actually, what I’ve though would be a totally cool idea for an online game is to have components for people who don’t want to commit a lot of time, but would still be interested in the online competition. Something like being able to purchase the “shop running” module of the game, but not actually being able to log in and play the “action” portion of the game. So you could get up in the morning, check the markets online, set prices, order/ manufacture new stuff, etc. and then log off and go to work. You’d only have to interact with the game-world a few minutes each day, but you’d be competing with other players across the world. But what would set this apart from a simple “business simulation” is that the “action” players would really be buying and selling from your shop, thus providing a real economy and not just a simulation. That way you can get gamers who have little time at their disposal involved at (hopefully) a scaled down price (say $5 a month). Maybe the “shop running” idea is a little boring, but maybe you see where I’m going.

Another cool thing to add in would be a “weapons design” component where all weapons have to be designed before they are “produced” and players could sell custom designs. To pull this off you’d have to come up with a very complex “science” of weapon design that somehow forces tradeoffs and makes the “Ultimate Weapon” something of an unattainable holy grail. It’d really only be the engineering types who’d find this type of interaction interesting, but it would be yet another way to compete without spending gobs of time online. Again, users could just pay for the limited design part of the game without having to actually do any of the “action” stuff.

Of course, I could be totally off the mark here. It’s probably more likely that just about anyone who wants to play a computer game is more interested in blowing stuff up than designing a new cool weapon or running an online shop. Probably why I’m not in the gaming industry!
Posted by: drakino

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 30/06/2003 14:40

I saw this type of addiction hit a few people, one in an extreme way. Most games allow you to see how much time you have spent playing the game. A person that used to work with me picked up Dark Ages of Camelot, and began playing the free trial (30 days). At the end of that time, he looked at the played time, and it totaled 20 days. Mind you, thats not 20 days in that 30 days he logged in, that was 480 hours played in the game. He had used his vacation time for the year to take off from work, and spent it all in game.

In one month, he managed to play a MMORPG more then I ever have. And I started playing Everquest in 1999, quit it for a while, then moved on to DAoC and now Shadowbane. I still don't think I match his time, though I might finally be close after 4 years.
Posted by: wfaulk

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 07/07/2003 14:17

They are adding huge new features as the game progresses. Eventually you will be able to hop in your ship, fly up into space, and go to other planets as well as do full on space battles.
I was just reading this review of SW:G, and his biggest complaint by far was the lack of content. I assume that that's being taken care of by the developers. What I want to know is if they intended for it to be quite small to begin with and then expand, and, if so, why? I can understand adding new stuff as the game progresses, but from that guy's review, it sounded like it was way too small.

I may have to check it out anyway, assuming I get a new computer in the near future.
Posted by: Tim

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 08/07/2003 14:08

I was just reading this review of SW:G, and his biggest complaint by far was the lack of content.

I guess it depends on your definition of content. His was based on EQ. SWG uses different 'content'. Others are having this same problem, check out this thread on the SWG forums for more on the lack of content. Some people agree, others don't.

If the link reports the server is too busy, keep trying. Their forums get hammered constantly.
Posted by: wfaulk

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 08/07/2003 14:14

The impression I get from all of this is that they're currently in ``setup'' mode, where there's not really a lot to do, but there soon will be. I'm not sure what my feelings on that are.
Posted by: Tim

Re: Obligatory Star Wars: Galaxies post - 08/07/2003 14:50

A lot of people have the same impression. Those forums are spammed with people complaining about the game (bugs, price, lack of 'content', etc), but I have only run into one person in the game who wasn't happy, and he was just asking if there was anything to do besides missions.

I have nothing to compare it to since I've never played a MMORPG, but I'm having a blast with it so far.