Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?)

Posted by: Bernz

Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 08/06/2006 03:20

My headlights-on voltage is around +11V. The sense line for night dimming is listed at +12V to activate. Night dimming does not work for me. Am I right to suspect that the voltage is not quite high enough to activate the sensor?

At some point, I am probably going to wire something up to work around this (opto-coupler gating constant-power to headlight sense wire, controlled by car's headlight voltage), but in the mean time, can anyone confirm/refute this interpretation of the problem?
Posted by: tfabris

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 08/06/2006 03:22

I can't imagine it would be THAT picky. Just to be sure, you already checked all this, right?
Posted by: Bernz

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 08/06/2006 03:27

Wow, awesome response time! Actually, although I'd read a good deal of the FAQ, I hadn't yet got to the dimmer-related stuff, and I hadn't thought to check there yet. So, I will definitely go over all that stuff first. Thanks for the tip!
Posted by: Shonky

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 12/06/2006 01:07

Is it 11V DC though? Some newer cars (e.g. VW) have a PWM signal for dimmer since the signal passed to the stereo is more than just on off. i.e. the dash brightness control also controls the brightness of the factory stereo's backlighting. The empeg doesn't have this. It simply has an on/off setting.

If you've measured it with a multimeter on DC a switching signal it could quite rightly measure 11V. A poor man's check for a switching signal is to put the multimeter on AC volts. If it reads non-zero then it's likely it's a pulsing signal.
Posted by: tfabris

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 12/06/2006 01:10

The empeg should properly handle a PWM signal, though. And I'm still pretty sure that it'd stil work with 11v.
Posted by: Shonky

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 12/06/2006 01:27

Quote:
The empeg should properly handle a PWM signal, though. And I'm still pretty sure that it'd stil work with 11v.


Why would it handle a PWM signal properly? It's not designed to. It samples a signal at a particular rate (probably fairly slowly). At best it will probably alternate between active and inactive depending on whether it's sampled with the signal high or low.

I agree though that 11VDC should be heaps to be detected.
Posted by: Shonky

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 12/06/2006 01:31

I think I know what the problem might be. The empeg has no definition of dimmer line active or not really. Rather it just stores two seperate dimmer settings for each state of the dimmer line. I would guess you have both set to 100% so it appears the dimmer isn't working.

You need to adjust the dimmer from the menu, while the dimmer line is actually active.

Just realised that that's what Tony linked to in the FAQ. Thought I'd post it anyway.
Posted by: tfabris

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 12/06/2006 01:38

Quote:
Why would it handle a PWM signal properly? It's not designed to.

I remember that being something they compensated for in software, during the betas for the 1.0 software. It's possible to handle that sort of thing in software.
Posted by: Shonky

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 12/06/2006 01:44

Quote:
Quote:
Why would it handle a PWM signal properly? It's not designed to.

I remember that being something they compensated for in software, during the betas for the 1.0 software. It's possible to handle that sort of thing in software.

Not really that easy in software. It's merely a digital input to the processor. At best you could have some kind of filtering/averaging and detect that if x out of every y samples or higher are active, then consider the input active. Creates a delay in detection of at best x samples and up to y samples and also doesn't cover the case where the sample rate and the PWM rate conincide (by some factor).
Posted by: mlord

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 12/06/2006 11:12

Quote:
The empeg should properly handle a PWM signal, though.


Nope. The software is just a simple on/off detection, at present. Dunno about the hardware side, though.
Posted by: drakino

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 13/06/2006 13:48

I'd have to double check my wiring, but I believe my empeg is hooked up to a PWM signal for the sensing, as the stock stereo paid attention to that line as a dimmer indicator along with the rest of the dash. The installer may have found a solid 12v line though in the dash and used it, it's been a couple years since I saw the spagetti mess of wiring.
Posted by: Bernz

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 13/06/2006 22:52

Quote:
I think I know what the problem might be. The empeg has no definition of dimmer line active or not really. Rather it just stores two seperate dimmer settings for each state of the dimmer line. I would guess you have both set to 100% so it appears the dimmer isn't working.

You need to adjust the dimmer from the menu, while the dimmer line is actually active.

Just realised that that's what Tony linked to in the FAQ. Thought I'd post it anyway.


Yep, I'm pretty sure that was the problem, because I hadn't changed the dimmer setting yet before assuming there was a problem. I will hook it back up and post back with results.

In the meantime, I thought it would be cool to build a PWM-driver whose frequency is controlled by a photocell for automatic variable dimming, but I kinda figured the sense line was tied to software... ah well.
Posted by: altman

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 20/06/2006 19:02

ISTR it does handle a PWM signal; the player software requires no high levels on the line for a certain time (a second? half a second?) to decide it's actually low.

Hugo
Posted by: mlord

Re: Headlight sense night dimming problem (voltage too low?) - 20/06/2006 19:14

Quote:
ISTR it does handle a PWM signal; the player software requires no high levels on the line for a certain time (a second? half a second?) to decide it's actually low.


Okay, so this may work for an "active low" sense, but maybe not not the other way round.

A similar method is used by Hijack for the button_LED dimmer sense.

Cheers