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#187156 - 29/10/2003 07:46 For all you Jamie Oliver lovers...
andy
carpal tunnel

Registered: 10/06/1999
Posts: 5759
Loc: Wivenhoe, Essex, UK
Looks like someone at Boots doesn't like Mr Oliver...

http://www.boots.com/shop/product_details.jsp?productid=1037997

(look carefully at the image)
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#187157 - 29/10/2003 07:52 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: andy]
JBjorgen
carpal tunnel

Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3501
Loc: Guadalajara, MX
*chuckles*
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#187158 - 29/10/2003 07:55 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: andy]
robricc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/10/2000
Posts: 4909
Loc: Orange County, NY USA
That is pretty funny!

We get this dude in the US on The Food Network.
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#187159 - 29/10/2003 08:18 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: andy]
boxer
pooh-bah

Registered: 16/04/2002
Posts: 2011
Loc: Yorkshire UK
Have Boots spotted what you spotted and changed it, or are my office and I remarkably unobservant?
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#187160 - 29/10/2003 08:21 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4148
Loc: Cambridge, England
Have Boots spotted what you spotted and changed it, or are my office and I remarkably unobservant?

LOL, they've changed it; it was reasonably unmissable when it was there...

Peter

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#187161 - 29/10/2003 08:21 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
Oh, wow, they actually did change it! That's remarkably quick.

I'm not really sure how to describe it. He had, shall we say, some poorly placed items in front of him that would have made it into Maxim Magazine's "Found Porn" section.
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#187162 - 29/10/2003 08:25 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: tonyc]
msaeger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 23/09/2000
Posts: 3608
Loc: Minnetonka, MN
Are you guys talking about this picture ?

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#187163 - 29/10/2003 08:31 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: msaeger]
andy
carpal tunnel

Registered: 10/06/1999
Posts: 5759
Loc: Wivenhoe, Essex, UK
No, this one:



Attachments
185896-ehero.jpg (280 downloads)

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#187164 - 29/10/2003 08:37 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: tonyc]
boxer
pooh-bah

Registered: 16/04/2002
Posts: 2011
Loc: Yorkshire UK
Oh, wow, they actually did change it! That's remarkably quick

Maybe, Boots are checking the BBS to see whether they can get the Karma in, ridiculously overpriced, for Christmas?

Just a small conspiracy theory!
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#187165 - 29/10/2003 08:58 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: robricc]
boxer
pooh-bah

Registered: 16/04/2002
Posts: 2011
Loc: Yorkshire UK
We get this dude in the US

But do Americans understand cheeky cockney chappies, or for that matter what has come to be called "Estuary English"

Personally, I think he has the most irritating use of an English accent since Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins and I don't believe it's his given tongue.


Edited by boxer (29/10/2003 08:59)
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#187166 - 29/10/2003 09:01 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: andy]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Damn, that is hilarious. and he's got a green J up his ass.

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#187167 - 29/10/2003 09:09 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
robricc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/10/2000
Posts: 4909
Loc: Orange County, NY USA
I generally think he's a dork. His accent doesn't strike me as odd though.
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#187168 - 29/10/2003 09:17 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
But do Americans understand cheeky cockney chappies, or for that matter what has come to be called "Estuary English"
I recognized the accent, even if I didn't have a name for it, but is there something specific about ``cheeky cockney chappies'' that you're referring to, or just a general notion of what they're like?
I think he has the most irritating use of an English accent since Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins and I don't believe it's his given tongue.
How is more irritating than anyone else using it? Is it because you believe it's an affected accent (rather than English not being his native language, which is what I would take your opinion to be from the latter part of that sentence)?
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#187169 - 29/10/2003 09:35 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: wfaulk]
boxer
pooh-bah

Registered: 16/04/2002
Posts: 2011
Loc: Yorkshire UK
The CCC was a feature of every British war film, and many others, probably from the war years until the end of the 50's.

English is his given tongue, but I don't believe that this particular accent is the tongue that he was given!

For the record, the way that I speak English is described as "received English", much as the way in which the BBC use it, in that it has no regional bias.
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#187170 - 29/10/2003 09:44 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
I'm starting to get the impression that English accents are chosen, not acquired. Is there any element of truth in that?
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#187171 - 29/10/2003 09:51 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: wfaulk]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4148
Loc: Cambridge, England
I'm starting to get the impression that English accents are chosen, not acquired. Is there any element of truth in that?
Some people choose to change their accent; if one does, one has to be very careful not to slip out of character or one looks like an idiot (if affecting a more upmarket accent, cf My Fair Lady) or a pretentious twit (if affecting a more downmarket accent, cf Jamie Oliver). In the particular case of upper-class twits affecting Cockney accents in order to appear "more in touch with the people" on television, there's a special word for it: Mockney.

Peter (never had much of a Potteries accent, but regret losing what of it I had)

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#187172 - 29/10/2003 09:59 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: wfaulk]
boxer
pooh-bah

Registered: 16/04/2002
Posts: 2011
Loc: Yorkshire UK
Very much so, In truth, Scottish, Irish and Welsh ones too, if it serves a purpose.
A Jamie Oliver type accent with the addition of an antipodean tendency to turn every sentence into a question by raising half an octave at the end is an increasingly common and irritating part of English, here.

I'm not the only one, we've just had a programme called " grumpy Old Men" screened here, in which they picked upon just this.

Don't wish to sound a snob, but I speak in precisely the way that I was taught at school, and pre-school from my parents.

P.S. Listen to before and after interviews with Nigel Kennedy, the violinist - it'll give you the idea


Edited by boxer (29/10/2003 10:01)
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#187173 - 29/10/2003 10:12 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Why don't you brits just talk normal.

Actually, I'm currently trying to make the transition to a Mississippi accent so i can present myself as a higher class citizen.

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#187174 - 29/10/2003 10:18 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
I speak in precisely the way that I was taught at school
By which I assume you mean that schools actively teach non-accented pronunciation. That is a concept so out of the scope of US schools that it's hard to fathom.

I've lived in a city all my life, which means that most of the people I grew up with didn't have a very rural accent. Since working for the state, which, for whatever reason, seems to employ a lot of folks from the sticks, I amazed at the bright people who sound like they've jumped out of the pages of Lil' Abner.

I guess the point is that my reasonable lack of accent is almost solely due to non-school influence -- environment, a lot of TV, etc.
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#187175 - 29/10/2003 10:27 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: ]
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
Actually, I'm currently trying to make the transition to a Mississippi accent so i can present myself as a higher class citizen.
Haha. I find it funny that a Mississippi accent is an upgrade from a Louisiana accent. Is there some kind of "accent roadmap" you can show us to illustrate what your next step will be? Geographically it looks like you'd move on to an Alabama accent, but I actually consider Alabama more redneckish than Mississippi or Louisiana. Then again, I've never lived in either, and am just judging based on people I've met from those places (including relatives who were married into the family.)
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#187176 - 29/10/2003 10:33 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: tonyc]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4148
Loc: Cambridge, England
Haha. I find it funny that a Mississippi accent is an upgrade from a Louisiana accent.
I don't really know what a rural Louisiana accent sounds like, but surely a N'awlins accent is one of the US's very few distinctive local accents, and is something to cherish? Where in Louisiana do you come from, Yz33d?

Peter

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#187177 - 29/10/2003 10:34 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: wfaulk]
g_attrill
old hand

Registered: 14/04/2002
Posts: 1172
Loc: Hants, UK
I speak in precisely the way that I was taught at school


By which I assume you mean that schools actively teach non-accented pronunciation. That is a concept so out of the scope of US schools that it's hard to fathom.


It has been a while since pronunciation was taught at British schools, and only the top schools really do this sort of thing, and even then it is probably not taught as much as learnt by those who don't already speak that way.

My oldest aunt and uncle went to a private school and ended up speaking RP (and pronouncing off like "owf") and mum and youngest uncle went to a state school and ended up talking "normally"!

They realley shood teech proper speeling at british skools these days...

Gareth

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#187178 - 29/10/2003 10:41 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: boxer]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4148
Loc: Cambridge, England
For the record, the way that I speak English is described as "received English", much as the way in which the BBC use it, in that it has no regional bias.

[...]

Don't wish to sound a snob, but I speak in precisely the way that I was taught at school, and pre-school from my parents.
In Yorkshire? Or did you live in the Home Counties at that time? Was it a state school?

Peter (and his mixed-race parentage: dad comes from Yorkshire, mum comes from Surrey)

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#187179 - 29/10/2003 10:45 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: peter]
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
US's very few distinctive local accents
You're joking, yes? Maybe you've spent too much time on our West Coast, where nobody has a distinctive accent because they're all transplants. But in the Eastern and Central time zones, you'll find a plethora of distinctive accents (though one might argue some aren't worth preserving, like the Boston accent, which should be constitutionally outlawed.)

Come to think of it, the Boston accent is probably the Cockney accent of the United States.
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#187180 - 29/10/2003 11:39 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: tonyc]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3717
Come to think of it, the Boston accent is probably the Cockney accent of the United States.

I'd have to say the Brooklyn accent ("you godda problem wit dat?") is far more spiritually in tune with an English cockey accent then the standard Boston middle-class "pahk the cah in Hahvahd yahd" accent. (My father is from Brooklyn and my mother is from Boston. I grew up hearing both accents regularly.) There's a completely separate upscale Boston accent, famously spoken by JFK and there's also the "southie" Boston accent as heard from Matt Damon and Ben Affleck in "Good Will Hunting". Southies are in another world.

Probably my favorite of regional American accents has to be the Minnesota "ya sure, you betcha" Scandinavian-derived accent as heard in "Fargo". That's just absolutely addictive to speak, although I have to admire the Cajun dialect as well. I say "dialect" because they toss in French words more often than Jews from New York mix Yiddish into their regular speech. There's a Cajun DJ who plays Zydeco here early on Saturday mornings, and I can barely understand a word he says.

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#187181 - 29/10/2003 11:48 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: tonyc]
genixia
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/02/2002
Posts: 3411
though one might argue some aren't worth preserving, like the Boston accent, which should be constitutionally outlawed

Amen to that. I'm tempted to move in the next few years just so that my sone doesn't end up with it.
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#187182 - 29/10/2003 11:49 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: peter]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I live in Lafayette, which is about 2 hours west of New Orleans.

Believe it or not, I can sometimes hear a Baton Rouge accent and even a Broussard (small town by lafayette) accent. The differences between these are much more subtle than a N'awlins, NYC, or Boston accent, but they are still unique in their own way.

I think people just tend to talk like the people they have always been around, and in places where the same families have lived for generations it develops it's own characteristics and becomes known as an accent. In California, where everyone is a clone of a celebrity, everybody speaks plainly because it's a mixture of many different cultures - it seems like most people move to California, instead of having been born and raised in California along with their ancestors. Now that I think of it, I believe the definition of a cracker is someone who has no accent at all.

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#187183 - 29/10/2003 11:57 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: wfaulk]
boxer
pooh-bah

Registered: 16/04/2002
Posts: 2011
Loc: Yorkshire UK
By which I assume you mean that schools actively teach non-accented pronunciation

From 4 to 11, when I went to boarding school until I was 18, how you pronounced English was, as important to the curriculum as how you wrote it.
If you arrived at boarding school with a trace of a regional accent, your parents were advised to send you for elocution lessons - I felt really sorry for all those guys from Kenya and Rhodesia etc. who had to go to classes when they could usefully be smoking in a hedgrow!
Mrs.Boxer and the Boxette still go into apoplexies when I say: "Have you got a tahl, I want to take a shah"
Yes, I am a man of Kent, Peter, who has lived in Yorkshire since '72, regrettably, you are as likely to hear estuary English in Leeds or Harrogate, as in the SE, these days.


Edited by boxer (29/10/2003 12:03)
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#187184 - 29/10/2003 12:05 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: andy]
boxer
pooh-bah

Registered: 16/04/2002
Posts: 2011
Loc: Yorkshire UK
Have I been putting back too much pop, or has the picture on the Boots site returned to the original "porn" one?
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#187185 - 29/10/2003 12:08 Re: For all you Jamie Oliver lovers... [Re: DWallach]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
I say "dialect" because they toss in French words more often than Jews from New York mix Yiddish into their regular speech.
Technically, that would be a creole.

Peter's right, though, that most US accents are simple accents with simple vowel changes and minor consonant clippings. Very few places have accents as outstanding as those found across Britain because only a few places in the US are not a melting pot of other people from the US. New Orleans is a good one because it's easy to pinpoint to New Orleans. The ones in Boston and New York are hard to nail down because there are so many different ones all competing and they get jumbled up as the people in those cities get jumbled up.

But there are other outstanding ones. The outer banks of North Carolina and Virginia have a few folks who might as well be speaking another language. It's much closer to Elizabethan English than, well, anything. It's bizarre. You've got the ``eh''-people of southeastern Canada. You've got the northern New England accent, which is close to some of the Boston ones, but different. You've got the upper-crust Georgia accent (think white-suited planation owners and Foghorn Leghorn). You've got Smoky Mountain dwellers -- old mountain folk. But I'd say there few distinctive accents west of the Mississippi (with the notable exception of the already-mentioned Minnesota accent), except for fairly new things, like the second- and third-generation Latinos who have a thick Latino accent but speak no Spanish.

I guess there are more than I thought. But I guess foreigners aren't really exposed to those. Little reason for a tourist trip to the Deep South.
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