Casting of Buttons, Redux

Well, it looks like Casting_Fool is lost in space. So we are about to put money down on another company (thanks Mach!) to have the casting done- either this week or next.

What colors does everyone want? Get your say in soon, because we order no later than next week.

Stu

What colors does everyone want?

Milky gray, so they look like the original buttons when unlit. (If the new casting people can pull that off well, that is.)

I'd want a Dark gray, so the buttons look black when the lights are off, and smoke when on.

Red for the wife's car. A bright yellow-green for mine. But I'm broke right now, so I couldn't buy them immediately, so don't make those colors specially just for me.

The four standard empeg lens colors, plus a smoke (in visible light) to match the VFD color when illuminated. I like the idea of having the colors being milky in daylight, but I am not sure how this would look / work in practice. Better diffusion through the buttons is highly desired.

Yeah, this would be cool, I'd like sets like this. Of course I haven't found original green or red lenses yet...

VW dash red please

(That'd possibly match the red used in Audi instrumentation too?)

VW red for me too
And the ones that look stock when unlit sound good to me too.
(Yellow would be nice, but I think I'm the only one with that choice )

What Paul Grzelak said.

I'd like to get them too. Audi/VW red as well.

Also, is there any way to get some silver/chrome ? I don't know if there's a way to do that on plastic... Of course I'd buy those in metal as well, would it be possible...

I did not follow this topic much. Shoudl I send money to somebody in addvance?

Definitely will be a red.

There is a process called electroforming that deposits a copper "strike" followed by a finish plate or nickel strike followed by chrome onto nonconductive parts. I'm not sure that it would hold up to repeated use however. I've experimented with the process a little by gold plating a pine cone, but the results were only marginal. In short, it's probably not a good idea to plate plastic for this application. You can probably get a jeweler to cast some solid metal buttons and knobs for you if you really want them.

Stu

No problem, glad that I could help.

I know we've discussed this but I'll throw it out here to see if anyone else is interested. I'd like the standard button colors with the smoke buttons to match the original but I'd like to have buttons with a phosphorescent tint (blue and blue green would work best but other colors are available) if its a viable option.

Also depending on what the caster says, a frosted effect may be a decent option also (via sand blasting after casting).

I'd also like to bring up the flexible button option here.

Finally, metal like finishes may be possible with something like this but the caster would have to decide if it's possible and worth the trouble. It's doubtful they would be illuminated if the powder was dense enough to give a metallic finish but it could, if it was only metal flaked. ( Hmm, frosted, glows in the dark, flexible with metal flake....if you can get a treble hook embedded in them I'll use them for fishing )

If any of these options are plausible, I would pay extra for them.

Thanks!

I'm sure you've heard it, but I'll say it again - THANKS! for doing this.

Just an idea, how about a poll to get started with? Unlike many other bulletin boards, I think the empeg owners would actually stick to their choices, understanding that if they check a color they would want, that they really shoould intend to buy it as well, lest you put a lot of work into something that doesn't get anywhere.

I'd like blood red as well If these become available, expect to see orders for light kits increase!

yeah, what Paul said. I like the smoked color. I have a set of green ones (thanks paul) that look great.

All the grey-scheme suggestions so far sound good to me, particularly the black-to-smoke one. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be possible to have the lit color match the green of the smoke lens, so I'm not worried about that.

Hi,
another idea that just came to my mind: Is it possible to mold buttons so that only the "surround" (border) is lit, and the rest is black or the original grey? But then still, one could paint its buttons by himself.

I'd like to get a set of red ones (GM red ) and a set of blue about the same darkness as the OE lens.
Oh translucent red and blue that is don't think I really needed to say that but just in case.

BMW red please.

I'd be in for a set of red buttons.

I would probably want 1 or 2 sets of smoke coloured.

<snore> <bzzz>...

Uh... Could someone repost the link to the pictures?

The buttons in question haven't been produced yet. Brian was producing them once upon a time.

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Could someone repost the link to the pictures?

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You me this?

Stu

Or perhaps this one? Amber, blue and smoke combinations...

Ahh, yes, thanks!!

The parts went out today for mold making. Thanks Paul (pgrzelak)!

Stu

I'd like a set of red, blue, smoke (VFD-Color when lit) and milky white (for the UV-LEDs) or what do you think would be the best for UV???
If available, original lens green and amber would be fine, too (if they're affordable )

cheers, Thomas

I'd like amber, to match my screen; milky or smoke would also be good.

Anything else that users can find in the dark would still be an improvement on the stock unlit buttons!

I just got off of the phone with the caster. He says he should be making the molds on Friday of this week and will be getting samples out next week. I'll post some images of them when they come in.

Stu

how hard would it be to get a glow from just the edges of the buttons and faint glow out the front?
ill try to draw up a picture of the idea

i am not a photochop guru. actually, i suck at it. but thats kind of my idea. not so blurry looking though.

Thanks, I'll forward your idea to the caster.

Stu

I really like that idea, and I think that effect could probably be done with a layered approach.

You could do something like this:

Pour in a thin layer of mostly opaque resin, let that harden, and then fill up the rest of the mold with a more translucent mixture.

That would be awesome... But I think the tricky part might be getting exactly the right amount poured in for the first layer.

Heck, why not just do black for the first layer? Or some other opaque solid color?

That way, you'd have a back light sort of effect...

Ooh, ooh, I've been away. How much are these buttons?

I dont think they exist yet (and I havnt seen a price)...

Keep up the great work guys...you never know what color the next car's interior lighting will be.

I would also be up for a set of smoked buttons and the required leds.

Thanks

C.

Price is not yet determined, but they will be a little more than Brian's.

Stu

blue and smoke for me.

We recently received an e-mail from the plastics caster. In part it read:

The first half of the mold is poured and cured. I need to pour the second half. I hope to accomplish this tomorrow or Tuesday.

Hopefully we'll have something to test soon!

Stu

Put me down for a set of smoked...I've got these leds installed, but not able to see them yet.

Greetings!

Sorry to abduct your thread, but has anyone heard from Brian lately? He basically vanished, and no one seems to know if he is still around, etc.

Are you considering Green buttons?

I'm hoping for Darkstorm Dark Green color. But if you make one of each original empeg color, then how well does the original green match the Darkstorm Dark Green or Darkstorm Neon Green?

And are you trying to match the smoke buttons to the Darkstorm Smoke (because that's the only smoke ever created right? Or has Mach made one yet? And does Mach's match Darkstorm's?).

Oh, and lastly, how does one "get the glow" these days if Brian isn't shipping the LED packs and resistors? Is someone doing the installs because I swear I've seen people mention that their "empeg is off to get the glow."

Thanks! Remember, dark green!

Eutronix is doing the installs these days. You can either buy a kit and do it yourself, or add their installation service to your purchase.

Mach does have smoke. 3 shades infact! Here is a little comparison chart.

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Are you considering Green buttons?

I'm hoping for Darkstorm Dark Green color. But if you make one of each original empeg color, then how well does the original green match the Darkstorm Dark Green or Darkstorm Neon Green?

And are you trying to match the smoke buttons to the Darkstorm Smoke (because that's the only smoke ever created right? Or has Mach made one yet? And does Mach's match Darkstorm's?).

Oh, and lastly, how does one "get the glow" these days if Brian isn't shipping the LED packs and resistors? Is someone doing the installs because I swear I've seen people mention that their "empeg is off to get the glow."

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We sent in the original factory lenses in all 4 colors plus Darkstorm smoke to have color matched. These will be the intial offerings, but other materials and colors should follow. There may even be a custom color option.

Yes, Eutronix is making the electronics and offering the installation service for the light kits. I believe Mark Lord in Canada at least used to install them as well as Rob S in Europe.

Stu

We sent in the original factory lenses in all 4 colors plus Darkstorm smoke to have color matched.

What about the fact that the button LEDs glow white and the VFD glows green? Was that taken into account? For instance, Brian's smoke buttons are cool, but I've found that his green buttons are a better match for the smoke display.

I think it's actually cool-looking to have different colors for the buttons and for the display, but some folks might want them to be the same.

We've thought about it, but haven't really come up with a solution. We'll have to see what this caster's smoke material looks like when we get samples.

Stu

Stu,

Thanks for the updates, I appreciate it.

Kinda throwing the thread off topic a bit, but:
IF the new buttons come out, I want to be ready by having my lights already installed. Since you do the lights, would I get any benefit from having the light kit installed with the stock buttons? Or would it be a risk to spend the $110 and have the colored buttons not come to fruition?

Lastly, how long do you think it would take to get the buttons installed, round trip empeg shipping and all, from me in New Jersey? Thanks, and sorry for throwing off the thread (though it is kinda advertising for the other necessary component in the "lit button" kit).

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IF the new buttons come out, I want to be ready by having my lights already installed. Since you do the lights, would I get any benefit from having the light kit installed with the stock buttons? Or would it be a risk to spend the $110 and have the colored buttons not come to fruition?

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They better come out! We put a fair amount of money into the molds the caster is working on. Not much is gained from lighting the stock buttons and knobs unless holes are drilled to let out the light. It's up to you.

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how long do you think it would take to get the buttons installed, round trip empeg shipping and all, from me in New Jersey?

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10 business days roundtrip via UPS ground including 2 for installation.

Stu

I really, really, just need a set of matte black buttons. I do not plan on doing
any type of illumination modification- and I really just want a set of black buttons
to match my existing OEM lay-out. Can anyone hook it up?

The caster has said that he can do just about any color or material in small quantities, so black can probably be arranged.

This isn't the best solution, but you could also paint them black.

Stu

In most cases, the smoke buttons look black (and match the fascia) if they are not backlit. In bright light, they have a slight reddish-brown tinge. These are based on Brian's buttons, but just saying that you may not need to have a special "black" casting.

Paul's right. In fact, Brian's Blue and Green buttons look very close to black as well (when unlit).

We've just been informed that sample castings will be shipped out to us tomorrow. I'll post pictures later.

Stu

COOOOOL!!!!

I'd love a set of buttons that appear dark/blackish when unlit, and amber when lit. that would be awesome!

How did the buttons turn out? Any idea when I'll be able to buy a set of smoke?

Thanks!

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How did the buttons turn out?

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I wish I knew . They should have been here by now. My efforts to contact the company have been fruitless this week. Hopefully I can get an explanation, although it likely is a family issue, which he has brought up before.

Really, I promise to post pictures when there is something to take a picture of. If he can get his act together, I don't see why we couldn't have smoke buttons available within 6 weeks.

Stu

Hopefully I can get an explanation, although it likely is a family issue, which he has brought up before.

Anyone else get the impression that creating replacement plastic parts for the empeg is something of a jinxed occupation ? Everyone who embarks on it seems to eventually dissappear into the ether in the end.

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Everyone who embarks on it seems to eventually dissappear into the ether in the end.

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He will eventually surface again. I just talked to him last week. But speaking of disappearing, has anyone looked the the Casting Fool and Son website lately? There is no longer any mention of their services!

Stu

Greetings!

Well, given the phone numbers being disconnected, I am assuming that he cancelled the ISP, or that it was cancelled for him. Given his medical status (the recent chlorine poisoning), I hope he is okay. We may never know, of course.

I have also not heard from Steve for almost two months now. I send him an email every few weeks, but I have heard nothing back.

Edit: By the way, has anyone ever heard from Brian at all? I know that he was getting too busy for the original button orders, but I have not seen him online for a very long time.

Well, given the phone numbers being disconnected, I am assuming that he cancelled the ISP, or that it was cancelled for him. Given his medical status (the recent chlorine poisoning), I hope he is okay. We may never know, of course.

I hope he returned the player that you lend to him before he dissapeared. Anything else wouldn't be very nice.

I have three sets of buttons and knobs in front of me. One is in a flexible material that is in a sort of very dark blue. This material feels like hard plastic except with some give.

The second is an off white hard plastic.

The third is a translucent red very close to the red lens color.

Overall the quality of his work is superb. The only problem I see with these samples is that they are too close to the originals in that none of the cavities are filled. This keeps light from dispersing as much as in Brian's sets. I'll post pictures soon.

Stu

Picture of red buttons and knobs from the top.

Stu

Picture of red buttons and knobs from the bottom.

Stu

Opaque buttons and knobs.

Stu

Awesome! when can we order some?

Did the caster give any indication if there was a way to improve the diffusion of light through the button? Those red translucent look great, but I would think they would show up as one very bright dot!

Sooo... where do we place the order? :-)

Oh, those off-white knobs look awesome. What's it like when they're backlit?

What's it like when they're backlit?

Ummm... probably as described next to the picture.

Main Entry: opaque
Pronunciation: O-'pAk
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin opacus
Date: 1641
1 : exhibiting opacity : blocking the passage of radiant energy and especially light



tanstaafl.

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Oh, those off-white knobs look awesome. What's it like when they're backlit?

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There kinda dim, but then they weren't intended to pass I light. You be the judge. I'm sure just about any color could be done. The internal structure of the knob shows through a bit, but that is the case with all of the materials. Perhaps he could fix that on the mold.

I took this without any lens installed.

Stu

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Did the caster give any indication if there was a way to improve the diffusion of light through the button?

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He said he could improve things, but didn't say how. He needs to at least fill in those cavities in the parts. Maybe the backsides could have some sort of diffusion partern applied to them, sort of like they use on car instrument panel overlays.

Here's what the red looks like lit up.

Stu

sweeeet. So with a little photoshop color adjustment....

Sweet. I'll definitely be ordering some sooner or later.

Cool! The Opaque looks the best because you don't actually see the LED.

You can't order yet and I don't know when exactly you will be able to. First I'd like to get the diffusion improved on the translucent ones as I'm sure some people are going to prefer that effect to the opaque variety. I'd also like to make sure he's got a good match with all the basic colors. Red seems good, but blue was way too dark, so we'll have to fix that first.

Stu

This might be a silly request, but could you post a picture of your molds? I'm still trying to figure out where I went wrong....

Okay, so the recent purchase of a new car (2 yr old Alfa Romeo Spider) plus the release of Alfa3 at virtually the same time (must be an omen) has renewed my interest in adding backlit buttons to my empeg. I would definitely be interested in a set of opaque buttons as well as a red set. Looks a good job there maczrool.

Question though, if I order a lighting kit from Eutronix is there anybody currently in the UK offering a fitting service?

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could you post a picture of your molds?

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I'll have to ask the caster about that. I have no idea what they look like.

Stu

woohoo! progress! thanks stu

Oops. When I said opaque I really mean't milky gray ones. Obviously, they're all opaque otherwise there'd be no point

I just talked over some more possibilities with the caster. He thinks that he can get buttons with transparent graphics molded into opaque parts using a stereo lithography process involving lasers (as discussed in this thread). If this is something you want it would help tremendously if you would decide on a design for the buttons and knobs, as we're only drawing up one set of files. Another possibility is to have a somewhat rubbery feeling material in the opaque areas surrounding the clear areas.

Also, does anyone know if there are CAD files for the knobs and buttons floating around? It would help a great deal when generating graphics of the appropriate size and shape.

Stu

Gidday you dewds,
OMG, would that push the price way up, make it all too hard, delay things, put it in the too hard basket, I wonder if it may be better to make it simple, as we have been keen on this for a long long time, you know, Simply a choice of the 3 original colors, would the majority be happy with that? I would be delighted with that.

How about this idea, I was thinking, is it easier just to make 1 type of buttons, like a Cloudy Clear, you know, Neutral color, make a lot of them, make it cheaper, then you can change the color of the LED's to whatever you like, with the LED or if you can't get a happy color LED, put in a white LED and a little baby color filter of lens like material. which we could just make ourselves with some scissors, or something, or make the buttons that take gells, and if you want a pattern, tattoo the prick on there, I don't need a pattern, I know what the buttons do.

I want da buttons, But The dollars man, the Santa is coming.

Gazz.
Outback Central Australia.

He's making clear for us for sure. Just as an option we could offer the fancier, more expensive variety with the graphics. We are just waiting for him to send us samples of some fo the other basic colors so that we can okay them and then we will put them up for sale on the site.

Stu

There seems to be some confusion here between Opaque, Transparent, and Translucent...

"Opaque" means that no light goes through it. Like a brick wall for example.

"Transparent" means that the light goes through it, and it doesn't diffuse the image. Like a window. It can however, allow for a color shift, or a decrease in brightness, so tinted glass is still considered transparent.

"Translucent" means that the light goes through it, but that the image is diffused. Like a shower door, or frosted glass for example.


So there ya go. Hope that clears things up a little bit. I don't blame anyone for not understanding the difference, simply because these are some of the most commonly misused words in existence. I just have an art background so I pay attention to this stuff. =P

As a side note, back when I used to work in the sign industry, we almost always used something we called "Milk Plex" as a substrate for backlit signage. Basically, it's acrylic sheet (Plexiglass, Acrylite, etc.) that looks kinda like milk. It's translucent, with very high diffusion, and very low opacity. It's perfect for almost all backlit applications, because you get a nice bright image, and the brightness is very consistent across the entire image. (Note also that the term "Milk Plex" is probably specific to the sign industry)

So, buttons with the properties of milk plex would be cool, but the downside would be that they would look white, even when not lit up.

What I think would probably work better, would be smoke or color tinted translucent buttons. Again, what we're looking for is high diffusion, and low opacity.

OK, enough rambling!

Those buttons look awesome! I want a set!

PLEASE the color of the original empeg face plate. I'd love 2 or 3 sets...

Thanks,

Donovan

So, buttons with the properties of milk plex would be cool, but the downside would be that they would look white, even when not lit up.

This is exactly what I'm talking about: Very high diffusion, low opacity.

I think it would be coolest to have milkplex-like buttons, but have the milky color be gray like the original buttons. Then you would get the same thing: high diffusion, low opacity, but have the color of the glow be a dimmer shade of gray instead of white. Heck, that's what you'd want anyway, having the buttons glow only dimly instead of brightly.

Heck, that's what you'd want anyway, having the buttons glow only dimly instead of brightly.

Actually, I disagree with this. I would rather have the buttons as bright as possible, and use the hijack button illumination settings to dim it down as needed. This way, you might be able to add more effects (metalized, colors, etc.) without losing too much illumination.

Opaque shiny black, translucent blood red, and translucent "matches-the-smoke-faceplate" are my top 3. I'll send the money ahead of time!

LOL, "if you build it, they will come".

Green, please, don't forget the green. A Darkstorm Dark Green or Darkstorm Neon Green compatible green. Mmmm, what I wouldn't do for a set of those. Or, rather, what I WOULD do!

A question about those pics with the lense off. The knob light seemed to light up the entire IR receiver and that whole area. Can you see that extreme light bleed when the lense (and fascia?) is on? If so, I might need a darker lense.

Remember, green. Green = money from me. Thanks for the hard work because the samples look great!

Yeah stu will you be accepting pre-orders for these?

Amber would be nice

The knob light seemed to light up the entire IR receiver and that whole area.

That problem is an issue with any lense to a lesser or greater degree. The best solution is to search for the 'magic marker mod' where you should find somewhere a printable jpg that masks out this area in black. Print it onto a transparency and trim to fit with a sharp knife. Mount on the back of the lens with a couple of bits of sticky tape.

Green is definitely planned. It just wasn't in the initial batch of samples we got.

Yes, the bleeding is still visible, at least with the OEM blue lens and especially on the MAX setting. You might be able to fit some kind of shroud in there to block the light from leaking so much.

Oh, and thanks for the compliments!

Stu

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Yeah stu will you be accepting pre-orders for these?

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We weren't planning on doing preorders, but we may just forward orders to the caster and let him send them back to us or even set up drop shipping with him. Stay tuned.

Amber is also planned.

Stu

Still tuned!

We're still wating on the second set of samples to arrive. The caster's been a bit slow getting them out. A mold change is also needed to get some of the voids that exist in the OEM pieces filled. I'll post pictures as they are available.

Stu

any new news?

The caster is claiming he can get us a good supply of standard colors by the end of the year. He had to rework the mold to fill in some of the voids in the OEM parts and we still have to approve his dye mixes for green, blue, smoke, and orange. Samples of those were supposed to have gone out last week. He's not been very good on promises, so we'll see if we get things going by the first of the year.

Stu

Beginning of the year? That's cool. Are you going to be able to come up with facia colored buttons?

Fascia colored buttons are certainly possible. We may even be able to incorporate backlit graphics into opaque fascia colored buttons. The challange will be getting the specialized molds to take multiple dyes. It's really all on the caster and his willingness to cooperate.

Stu

It's really all on the caster and his willingness to cooperate.

Tell him we have ways of making him cooperate.

Fascia-colored buttons with backlit graphics (even just outlines) would be hella cool.

I'd love black buttons with translucent arrows on them (milky white as Tony has always described I believe), with the possibility of putting a coloured piece of plastic inside them to create the desired colour when they're lit. I'd probably be interested in a set of standards plus a set of 4 rounds (for use with Tim's Newface - I've definitely decided to get one whenever Tim shows up again)

Bruno

Well it looks like more delays. Not sure how long. The second set of samples is supposed to be overnighted here for tomorrow. However, it doesn't sound like we'll be able to evaluate anything but the color. We'll need a third set of samples to evaluate the new mold he's working on to make them more like Brian's rather then the more open OEM versions.

We'd go with another company, but this seems to be the only option plus we've sunk quite a bit into molds already.

Thanks for everyone's patience.

Stu

Appreciated for the update... i'm waiting very patiently... if you happen to get a set of amber test samples and they look decent, i'll buy em'..

We're supposed to be receiving a set. Actually we were supposed to have gotten them already. When they do come, they will be hollowed out like the OEMs rather than "filled in." We'll have to wait for another round of samples for those and I don't know what color they will be in.

Stu

Samples arrived. I'll post pictures when I can. They are only the knobs this time though.

Stu

Woo Hoo..

C.

Here's Amber. Remember that these are hollowed out like the OEM buttons, so the filled in ones will look different (better). As you can see, we only got the knobs.

Stu

Here's blue. Above disclaimers apply here too. This one has the lens installed since I have a blue one and thought it would be good to compare to the VFD.

Stu

Smoke. Appears too dark to me, especially if filled in instead of hollowed out.

Stu

Green. This one looks blue when lit even in person. The dye mix needs to be tweeked obviously.

Stu

Greetings!

They certainly look good. The form is just right. Now for the filling, hopefully with something to assist diffusion from the LEDs without blocking too much light.

Very cool. They look like the detail is coming out well. I hope the mold process gets easier.

Alvin

IMHO, I would say the 'green' is a better match for the standard blue lens!

Just an opinion

IMHO, I would say the 'green' is a better match for the standard blue lens!

I second that.

\\Kaare

Isn't the problem with the Color matches the LED's and not the dyes. You are using Blue LED's right?
I do not have the LED mod on my empeg so I'm not sure if the LED's are just so bright they look blue.
If everyone who has this mod has blue LED's then I would correct the dye, If not I'd leave them the way they are.

That is a very good point. Colour match is very inportant to me as I have an indiglo dash kit in my Pulsar, along with some A'pexi fuelling and boost controllers. The blue lens on my Empeg is a good match for all this stuff, but I don't want the buttons to be yet another shade of blue

I haven't got my LED mod yet, as I was waiting to get the new buttons first... now I'm a bit confuzled - what colour are the LEDs in the kit from eutronix?



My empeg is the little splash of blue at the bottom

One normally uses white LEDs and let the color of the buttons/knob (or possibly a colored insert) make the color. Looking at Eutronix' page for the LED kit, at least the surface mount (knob) LEDs are white, and I see no reason that the 3mm ones shouldn't be as well.

/Michael

My kit from Stu had white leds in it.

Our kits come with white unless you request otherwise by special order. White through-hole LEDs tend to have a blue halo around them, which might be what you see in the pictures.

Stu

Forgive me, but do you have a guess on when these might be available, and even a rough idea of the price?

I'm asking because - it's been so cold here lately I haven't even kept the empeg in the car, just listening to NPR on the way to work and back instead. It would be a good time for me to send the empeg to you for the LED's to be added. But I don't want to do it and have to wait half a year for the buttons.

Hope it doesn't sound like I'm whining! Just trying to get an idea of how and when I want to get it all done.

Greetings!

If you know you will install the button hack - 100% certain, I would recommend you get the electronics fitted / display board modified. Even if it is months before the castings are available.

The reason: once the castings are available, I am certain a lot of people will want to get this hack done. All of them at once. If you can get the electronics done early, it is less likely you will need to wait in queue later on. All you would need would be to have the castings shipped to you, and you fit the buttons yourself.

I'm really sorry it's taking so long. The caster is just not very reliable as far as meeting deadlines or following through on promises. He's all we could find though and even though he's taking his sweet time, it should come out well in the end. So, given the way he operates, I just can't make estimates. As for price, I don't know what our final costs will be yet, but it won't be more than $35 for a set and hopefully much less.

Paul does have a good point about the installations, but it's your call.

Stu

Greetings!

At least he is more reliable than the last person. He vanished completely. I never did find out what happened to him, if he is still in business or even if he is still alive for that matter. (He had been ill from chlorine gas poisoning for a while.)

That's "casting_fool", right? Doesn't he have one of your players, still?

Greetings!

I had tried contacting him for a while afterward, but when the phone numbers were disconnected and the web site terminated, I stopped. Yes, he had one of my primary players. I have long since upgraded a spare to replace it, so I am not very concerned. Mildly annoyed, vaguely curious, but not enough to really invest the time and effort to find out more...

It seems that working with plastics is a hazardous trade...

Additional:

Interesting! His web site is back, with a 2004 update! I have just tried sending him email.

He's started posting again in the yahoo casting forum. He goes by the name alumicaster. Let me know if I can help.

Any updates on this? Got my lightkit but need buttons now. ;-)

thanks,

No definite word on availability. Supposedly, some more samples should be ready to ship, this time with the OEM cavities filled in and hopefully some better color matching. It seems to me like this caster has taken on more business than he can handle, as he never even comes close to delivering on promises, but it's him or nobody unfortunately. Castingfool is in operation to a limited extent, but still not fully operational from what I understand. We've tried to contact him, but haven't been able to reach him yet.

Sorry for the delay.
Stu

Wow, looks like casting is a stressful business.

Some thoughts on the past month's posts (since I've been purposely forgetting about the BBS for weeks on end hoping the buttons will be ready by the time I return).

About the blue and "green" samples. Could you offer the "blue" as "dark blue" and the "green" as "neon blue"? But, if that prevents a true rich green from coming out, forget I said anything.

Paul's logic on getting the lights before the buttons has me in a bind. I've been pondering it for months now... I want to beat the rush for led installs once the buttons hit, but I don't want to buy the led's and have no buttons come out. So, I ask:

(not being a jerk) Not when, but will these buttons be released? I don't mind wating 3 to 6 to 9 months, as long as a set of green ones is eventually available. Any reasonable chance the whole deal may go sour?

Thanks again. I'll probably just send in for the led's, but I'd love to be sure.

Worst case, if buttons never come out, you could always use them with 303's fascia. Or modify the stock buttons (drilling, laser holes, etc.).

This is moot, though. There will be buttons again. Eventually. Someday. As to estimated delivery time, I have no idea.

That's the spirit!! (though you already have three sets of 'em... or wait, did I read that some vendor kept one of your lusciously over equipped empegs? not to hijack the thread...)

Eutronix, here comes my empeg! A $110 investment in the future!

Cool! You will not regret your decision.

As to the player, more to follow on that regard. Contact has been re-established, and I hope to get that player back. (I had long since replaced it, so it would be a spare now...)

We've given the caster a stern warning that we will break all ties with him if he doesn't start producing by February 16, 2004. He seemed to take it seriously. Only time will tell for sure. Also, Castingfool has stated once again that he is working on samples for us.

We still have all of the electronics for the light kits at the best prices around, so if you want to avoid the rush, we encourage that.

Again, I'm sorry for the delays. It's getting a bit embarrassing.

More updates as info becomes available.

Stu

All the button news in one day...

...And that does not even count the other discussions and efforts behind the scenes...

More updates as info becomes available.

I've hesitated to go into this, based on the various postings here saying that buttons were just about to show up. But here goes. In my company we're using various plastic shells that we get done at a subcontractor. I know for a fact that i can get the buttons done there in a matter of days. I just thought that it was silly to have two manufactors of buttoms for the Empeg, the market ain't that big after all :-)

I don't know for how much longer we should wait for the caster. In my book I would have given up allready.

Give me some feedback, is this something i should continue to work on ?

Cheers

Kaare

In reply to:

---

In my book I would have given up allready.

---

It isn't quite as simple as that. We have invested money in molds that we do not wish to throw away. We may or may not be able to use these molds with another caster. Not only that, but specialty casters are rather hard to come by, so we've had to put up with these delays. I tried not to make any outright gueses as to availability but rather pass along the (seemingly) empty promises of the caster himself. Like I said he's out of here by the 16th if he doesn't make something useful by then.

Nevertheless, go ahead and see what you can come up with. You speak of shells, but from my experience a "shell" of a button will not diffuse the light properly, or at least not in a pleasing manner. Can you have them made as a solid piece with only a hole for the shaft and LEDs?

Stu

It isn't quite as simple as that. We have invested money in molds that we do not wish to throw away. We may or may not be able to use these molds with another caster. Not only that, but specialty casters are rather hard to come by, so we've had to put up with these delays. I tried not to make any outright gueses as to availability but rather pass along the (seemingly) empty promises of the caster himself. Like I said he's out of here by the 16th if he doesn't make something useful by then.

I hear you.

Nevertheless, go ahead and see what you can come up with. You speak of shells, but from my experience a "shell" of a button will not diffuse the light properly, or at least not in a pleasing manner. Can you have them made as a solid piece with only a hole for the shaft and LEDs?

I might not have expressed myself clearly. I'm in the mobile business, we're producing a mobile terminal for the transport industri in Europe. The housing of the terminal, what i call a shell (might be wrong) is made in a two piece design. If you look at the picture of the terminal, there is a yellow button in the lower right corner. That button is also made in clear plastic, so that the LED that we mount underneeth can shine through the plastic. It isn't shown on our website yet, as the clear button is on our newest model with a color tft screen presented to the market in the next month. What i want to say with this, is that we've gained a fair share of experience over the last 6 month with clear plastic moldings. I know what you're talking about, as i've seen bad examples on clear moldings that didn't spread the light properly. Our caster though has a lot of experience in this field, and did a perfect job the first time we asked for a clear button. I've used them since 1997 and have been satisfied all along.

I will not go further with this untill i hear news from you and your caster. I see no point in having two suppliers of clear buttons for the Empeg. I will only into this if your caster fails to present buttons within whatever timeframe you give him.

Basicly thats what i want to point out.

Cheers

Kaare

I haven't been following this (large) thread too closely, but will these buttons be fluorescent in UV light?


Thanks,
Aragon

Yeah, we'll do UV reactive once we get the five standard colors going. We received a big bag of the new "filled in" buttons and knobs. He went overboard with the filling of the buttons and left no room for the LEDs! He assures me that it's just a matter of removing whatever amount of fill in the molds is required. The knobs are just about right though. Red looks to be the perfect color with amber being a bit too dark, smoke being opaque, blue being a bit too light, and green being a little too light as well. It looks like blue, red, and amber will be first out. I'll post pictures of the samples later.

Stu

Kewl. I think the fluorescent buttons will look the best - they should solve the diffusion issue... (just my guess)

Latest samples below:



Color looks almost perfect in person.

Stu

Amber/orange:



Stu

Green:



Definitely needs some adjustment.

Stu

Blue:



Looks too light in person.

Stu

No smoke to post as it basically came out black. The next batch should be lighter.

Stu

Looking good Stu. Looks like lighting a fire under the caster did the trick...

Yeah man, the fire of our eager $$$ to buy these buttons. I'm psyched.

The green is getting better from the previous one. I'd beg for a rich, darker green, but I'll be glad for whatever comes up. Thanks again for managing this process.

Now that I have the glow (Thanks Stu!) I need me some red buttons! Only looking at the red I think it tooks pretty good! I am excited for when we can get buttons back in production.

Thanks for posting photos, i'm sure i speak for myself and a handful of friends who dont post to or read this bbs, will all be happy to get ahold of whatever the final shades are!

Anything?

Sorry, no. His latest excuse is that he bought out another company and didn't have time to tend to his (paying) customers. Not sure what to make of that.

Stu

I think there's some kind of an ancient voodoo zombie curse surrounding button casting. At this point, how many people have tried to get a full production run going only to have it fizzle at the end?

The closest we ever had was Brian, and he made some fantastic sets and then mysteriously disappeared...

What's his phone number

Haha, or his address. I'm sure the people awaiting buttons would gladly go to his place and cast them FOR him. Just show me where to pour the green plasticy goop and I'll sit there day and night cranking them out like a mindless drone.

Hm, or maybe I could CARVE buttons out of bricks of plastic. Shape them, sand them down, buff them out, coat them all nice! Why, to make one set, it would only take... 5 months!

I was just thinking if we all started telephoning the guy, from all over the world, "Where? you want buttons in Central Australia?"
:-) it's only a couple of dollars for the phone call

Well, you can find his number on his website at: http://www.scmodelworks.com/

Stu

*bump* ???

So, should we email this guy en-masse and see if we can gee him up? Nothing nasty, just a general "er... what's happening with our buttons?!"

Did it a few weeks ago, he didn't know anything about the buttons at all, and my second mail with details wasn't answered anymore.

Update (a sad one). He no longer wishes to work with us due to our "pushey" nature and the difficulty of producing quality pieces. He has stated he will finish the inital batch we ordered and no more and also return the mold to us. Anyone got any other ideas? If he told you he didn't know anything about the buttons, then he's lying.

Sorry guys we tried. There's got to be another caster out there willing to take this on. We were told that an aluminum injection mold could be made for about $1800. Seems a bit much for this application though.

Stu

Wow, that's a drag. It seems a crime that this guy has Stu's money and is just failing to deliver the product.

Apparently, the only way to get stuff from manufacturers is to be their WORST nightmare, hounding them constantly. Because they overbook themselves, and the only work that gets done is for the guy who shouts the loudest.

But if he's got Stu's money, then he should just return it. Better Business Bureau anyone?

I am not sure the BBB will be of any help in this. If the guy agreed to fill the existing order but nothing beyond that, all he has really done is wasted everyone's time. Especially if the order he is fulfilling covers the costs Stu has invested. I am not in a position to judge that.

Stu - if you want us (the board) to show him what pushy really is, or talk with the BBB, his suppliers, etc., just say the word... <intensely evil, almost malicious, grin>

Meanwhile, CastingFool has disappeared again, so that option is certainly out. This isn't over yet, though. There will be more translucent buttons...

I just sent a PM to _hardcore_ (Kaare). He had mentioned that he might be able to make the buttons previously, but did not want to get in the way of what was already in progress. I am also starting to look for yet another caster...

Sorry guys we tried. There's got to be another caster out there willing to take this on.

Wait, I've figured it out. We need to gather up all of the button castings Brian Mihulka ever did and put them together in a chest, then spill the blood of Brian's first born son over them. Only then can the curse be lifted.

Problem is, I hear there's still one button out there, and it was inadvertently taken by a maiden who didn't know the source of its power. We must comb the seas for it...




"But why is the rum gone?"

Dam, I had a feeling this would happen again,

I just want to say next time around, I am not really all that fussed about getting the Button colors exact,
If we could just get a clear or smoke button made up
Having just one color button might make it all the more simple to find a caster willing to do it,
I want blue but I might investigate the possibility of putting in Blue LED's

Gazz

We've begun proceedings to collect.

Stu

Any news on _hardcore_ or other casters? I was going to start sending out emails but didn't want to overlap your efforts.

I found these guys this evening but I'll hold off contacting them until I hear back.

http://www.matrixenterprises.com/

FireFox31 is also looking as well...

I'm very interested in seeking out new casters because I feel like I owe this community (and would love a set of buttons, no doubt). I just haven't sat down to scour the internet yet.

I know "grand schemes" aren't the best, but to avoid duplicating work (and to prevent some caster in Wichita, Kansas from receiving multiple seperate offers for "a very specialized casting project"), maybe we can work together. I'll start a new thread for the process. If anyone knows of casters, post them to the thread. Then, we can each contact some of them, following through and seeing if they'll do the work and what their prices are.

Stu, did you mention that you were receiving the mold for the buttons from your last caster? Maybe I'm out of line for asking, but if we found a caster who could use it, would you sell that mold to us so we could use it? That should recover your investment and put your hard work of designing, communicating, proofing, etc all to work. Interested?

Ok, I'm off to another thread.

I did mention that we would be receiving the mold. But this guy has turned out to be such a deadbeat, I don't know if it will ever show.

Stu

Stu, that sounds promising. I hope they come through.

If you have any information about the mold and if you have a moment to do so, could you please post it in the "Buttons - Specifics" thread over in the Projects forum? If we know specifics about it (what material it is, what machine it fits in, what plastics it works with, what process it's good for, etc), then we will have a chance of finding a caster who can use it.


In other news, I did a 5 minute search of the internet which turned up a (spammy?) "directory" of plastic casters, one of which is under 2 hours from my house. This local caster mentioned that they can accomodate small orders, so they are on my list to call once I know the specifics of what I'm asking for. It seems ideal to have a local company do the work, so if they try to vanish, I could appear on their doorstep and meet them face to face.