DAB radio on empeg a reality?

Posted by: andym

DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 20/07/2004 10:32

I was leafing through the mountain of junk mail I get at work then I noticed a press-release heralding the arrival of a miniature dab module costing less than $40 (assuming it's ordered in bulk) needing 5v, I2C interface and an audio output stage. I've emailed the contact asking for more information. The interesting thing is that it does FM as well.

More info when I get it.
Posted by: boxer

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 20/07/2004 11:15

Put me down for No.2 in the bulk buy.
Posted by: frog51

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 20/07/2004 11:41

I have heard very little about DAB radio - I guess I would need to ask the following questions:

Are DAB broadcasts generally available now
What sort of stations use it
What is the audio quality

I'm sure these things have all been well publicised, but I have missed them
Posted by: CrackersMcCheese

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 20/07/2004 13:20

Depends on the area you live in. If you go here you can enter your postcode and see whats available.

In the Glasgow area there is a huge range - all the BBC stations and local stations are on DAB as well many national stations usually found an MW. Many stations are unique to DAB.

The quality is good enough I suppose, but I've yet to find one above 128kbps. Stations usually on MW sound a LOT better, but sometimes I find that FM is clearer. Thats another thing - DAB is only good if you get a clear signal. If you get a weak signal you totally lose the station - this doesn't happen with FM so its good that many radios have the FM tuner as well.

Some cool things are scrolling text for station info and lyrics etc. Well woth the £99 I paid 2 years back.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 20/07/2004 14:00

Yeah. Could be interesting. I'd want to get one to play about with even if I don't ever connect it to the empeg.
Posted by: boxer

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 06:57

this might also help.
Posted by: auser

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 09:03

sadly I'm not (yet) an empeg owner, but I'd be interested in such a rather cheap DAB solution. Can you share any Details such as Manufacturer, part no., bands (L, K)?
many thanks
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 09:08

Quote:
Manufacturer

Several, it's licenced technology, none of them speak English it seems...

Quote:

part no.



Haven't a clue yet

Quote:

bands (L, K)



One module will do L-Band in addition to others.

Still waiting on a reply from the company....
Posted by: auser

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 12:32

Quote:
Quote:
Manufacturer

Several, it's licenced technology, none of them speak English it seems...


niether do I. It's only reading and writing that I can (partially) cope with.

Is it possilbe, that Radioscape was the companie that sent you the
press release?

(edited to fix a dangling [quote] that was affecting HTML outside the post)
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 12:58

Yeah it's Radioscape. They really are taking the piss though, I've left two messages now and they've still not got back to me.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 13:40

Ahh... Radioscape. They did some of the first DAB modules. The Psion Wavefinder has one of their modules inside except all the brains were in the PC software.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 16:17

Quote:
Ahh... Radioscape. They did some of the first DAB modules. The Psion Wavefinder has one of their modules inside except all the brains were in the PC software.


Yeah I know, evil COM object. Easy to implement in VB a nightmare in anything else.

Heard back from the man, it turns out the minimum order is 100 which works out at approx $55 a module. Now I don't have $5500 laying around. I have ordered a sample module for £60, so we'll see what happens. We'd need a 100 confirmed orders before we could get the modules, so that probably scuppers it.
Posted by: Cris

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 16:43

I would have thought 100 orders would be made pretty quickly, if they do FM as well even people with no DAB coverage may be interested.

I don't really need a tuner module, but I'd get one just for the cool factor

Cheers

Cris.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 17:14

I'll see what I can do with the sample. Of course whatever I do software-wise would be external to the player software (ie a hijack userland program). We could utilise the serial port used on tuner connection but the audio is baseband so I'd unable to utilise the MPX input easily. You'd therefore need to use the aux in, although I thought I read somewhere that there is an I2S input available and there's an SP/DIF output on the module.

EDIT: Forgot to say the module they're supplying is L-Band capable.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 17:21

Doh about the minimum order quantity. I'd only want one or two and judging by the number of people wanting them in this list, it's not enough at the moment. Not without a complete product for the empeg anyway.

Yeah. There is a totally untested I2S input on the tuner connector but we've hardly any documentation on the pinout much less how to enable it. Hugo did hint at some of the pins and what they do but he couldn't remember. It may turn out to be totally unusable without motherboard modifications as well.

From what I remember there were a couple extra inputs on the DSP which aren't used but wiring into those might be a lot of hassle.

Hook it into the mic input and sled serial?
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 17:28

Quote:
Hook it into the mic input and sled serial?


Yeah I suppose, given the fact I already have a tuner I think I'd use the sled serial and the aux in.
Posted by: Cris

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 19:19

Can't it just be hacked into a pca tuner kit??? Or am really asking a stupid question here???

(He runs away with A Level in Electronics between his legs )

Cheers

Cris.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 19:28

Nope. Different interface.
Posted by: Cris

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 19:43

DOH!!!

Well I did only get a C, what did you expect!

Cris.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 21/07/2004 23:57

Which particular module is it? The RS200L?
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 22/07/2004 04:53

Yeah its the 200L, there is a 350L which is suitable for automotive applications but he couldn't quote on that.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 11/08/2004 19:16

Any attempts at interfacing the DAB module yet?
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 12/08/2004 18:53

I've not ordered it yet, it's been an expensive month. Besides, I'd be really surprised if I couldn't make it work....
Posted by: auser

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 25/08/2004 08:46

Hi Andym
regarding "expensive"
could you please let me know the approximate "prototype quantity price" ?
many thanks
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 25/08/2004 09:46

Quote:
Hi Andym
regarding "expensive"
could you please let me know the approximate "prototype quantity price" ?
many thanks


Well, radioscape were only interested in selling me an evaluation model because of who my employer was. The salesman also asked that I didn't give his details to anyone else, I can only assume he doesn't want to be bombarded by dozens of people all trying to buy one unit.

On the subject of the unit, I'm currently awaiting delivery. It should be here some time this week or early next week. If there was sufficient interest I can organise a bulk purchase of 100 units which would work out at about the same price as the original tuner. Bear in mind this thing will do FM as well. It's also far more integrated than patricks tuner so there aren't as many discreet components required. On the downside, it's bigger and currently incompatable with the existing tuner functionality in the player.
Posted by: ngchol

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 25/08/2004 15:55

Please add me to the list! A DAB/FM module is just what I've been waiting for...
Posted by: auser

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 27/08/2004 11:49

Quote:

... were only interested in selling me an evaluation model because of who my employer was.


ok. before i go and try if they are intrested to sell eval-boards
to small european companies, I'd take one off those 100's below.
Quote:

... can organise a bulk purchase of 100 units..
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 03/09/2004 09:40

Look what arrived in the post this morning...

Posted by: Nobbie

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 20/09/2004 09:20

I'd be intersted in tohis too, but i fear it'd not get ported into the empeg software as development is finished to my knowledge. Maybe it could be incorporated into hi-jack?
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 20/09/2004 10:18

Without help from the empeg guy this project would be completely separate to the player software and would require hijack to function.

I'm currently too busy to really get started on the this right away. Things should quieten down in December.
Posted by: Nobbie

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 09/11/2004 10:09

Not wanting to sound pushy but has anyone had any joy with this yet, or not.
It should really be in the wish list for hi-Jack i know.
Just wishing.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 09/11/2004 10:38

I'm not really in the mood to work on it, come to think of it, I'm not really in the mood to do anything at the moment.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 28/12/2004 15:45

I got given a Roberts Gemini 15 DAB radio for xmas and I had a look inside and it's got a little detachable DAB module as well. It's not made by Radioscape however so I still need to go find more info on it.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 28/12/2004 17:44

If I ever where to think about going into production I wondered wether cannibalising a suitable radio might be the way to get round the minimum order quantity problem with the DAB modules.
Posted by: andy

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 28/12/2004 17:48

The Matsui tuner that I bought is down to £49.99 in Dixons now. Haven't opened it up far enough to identify the module yet though.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 29/12/2004 11:56

Quote:
The Matsui tuner that I bought is down to £49.99 in Dixons now. Haven't opened it up far enough to identify the module yet though.


I'd be very interested to see wether it was a Radioscape one or not.
Posted by: andy

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 31/12/2004 15:21

It isn't a Radioscape module, it is a Frontier Silicon Chorus FS1010-A. To call it a module is a little grand, as it is a single small chip.

http://www.ensigma.com/News/Release/index.asp?ID=21

The Matsui tuner has three separate boards inside it. One with the power and amp, another with the display and a third with the dab module and everything else.

Here is the board with the DAB module on:



There are some more shots of the internals here http://www.norman.cx/photos/default.asp_Q_ST_E_1_A_F_E_20041231
Posted by: boxer

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 04/01/2005 08:12

Quote:
The Matsui tuner that I bought is down to £49.99 in Dixons now

£29.99, if you're also buying a music centre. The youth that I was speaking too scratched his spiky haircut and looked confused, when I asked if the offer stood if you were buying a music centre which already had DAB radio!
It's still £59.99 in Currys.
Posted by: andy

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 27/04/2005 13:58

While the Matsui doesn't have a Radioscape module, I can confirm that the portal 1 DAB portable that ASDA are selling for £39 does contain a RS201. The module is even socketed to the main board, making it easily removable.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 27/04/2005 17:34

That could possibly sort out supply of the module, problem is, there's three models of every module they make with differing control options. They are a parallel interface, an i2c interface (what I've got) and a simple interface whereby you connect 5 buttons, a rotary encoder and an LCD directly to the module. I'd imagine they're using the LCD one.

Looks like a trip to ASDA tonight methinks.
Posted by: andy

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 27/04/2005 17:58

That sounds about right, there is very, very little on their own board apart from the LCD, rotary encoder, buttons and amps.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 27/04/2005 19:04

Yeah, quick cheap and easy as there's almost no development required to get them to market. Of course, you could always build one of those modules in thicko LCD mode into a DIN-sized unit along with a small amp and use it in conjunction with the empeg. It'd be dead easy.
Posted by: tman

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 27/04/2005 19:09

The hacky method would be to make a PIC/AVR/whatever pretend to be a LCD. It is probably a HD44780 based interface using the standard charset which means you could grab the details fairly easily and then display them on the empeg VFD.
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 27/04/2005 19:50

Interesting idea, like a low-level screen scrape.
Posted by: furtive

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 02/12/2005 14:47

Quote:
Things should quieten down in December


boing!
Posted by: andym

Re: DAB radio on empeg a reality? - 05/12/2005 22:11

Funnily enough my Picaxe dev kit arrived a couple of weeks ago and I've already got an i2c RTC chip working with it. So really all I need now is an aerial and a bit of patience.

Fingers crossed for a quiet December!