memory board progress
Posted by: pca
memory board progress - 30/05/2005 07:41
Hi.
I am building memory boards at this very moment, and the first 35 will ship over the next week or so. The remainder have been delayed by the PCB company cocking it up again, producing the 15 outstanding boards (delayed by a previous cockup) as 1.6mm thick rather than the correct 0.8mm. So they have to redo them, which will take another one to two weeks.
pca
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 11:43
Are you hand soldering them? Or having it done by the board company? Or using a toaster oven?
Inquiring minds want to know!
Cheers
Posted by: pca
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 12:14
Hand built with love and care. Also solder and flux. And a soldering iron.
I was going to get them made by an outside company, but for various reasons this didn't happen this time around. Each one takes about 20 minutes to do, so I'm aiming for about 8 per day so as not to interfere with my other work.
pca
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 14:48
Quote:
Each one takes about 20 minutes to do
[soldering god at work]
Posted by: bonzi
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 15:41
Quote:
[soldering god at work]
Do you think that mere mortals would be able to install it? I mean, somebody moderately skilled with soldering iron (not me 
), but without surface mount experience?
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 15:48
Yes, the board I have here looks much easier to install than I had thought. The throughholes (for soldering in) are HUGE, making them really easy to line up and get a moderate size soldering tip inside of.
Cheers
Posted by: bonzi
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 19:18
Thanks - one of the guys at work will then be able to help me.
Posted by: FireFox31
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 19:54
Will these boards be shipped directly to the installer of our choice if we specified one durring our order? Might be easier on you to send a bunch to the same place all at once. Thanks, I'm looking forward to it.
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 21:29
Heh.. So I'm sitting down here tonight to solder on the RAM chips for my own memory board (from PCA), and.. which way 'round do the chips go?
???????????
Cheers
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 30/05/2005 21:49
Quote:
Heh.. So I'm sitting down here tonight to solder on the RAM chips for my own memory board (from PCA), and.. which way 'round do the chips go?
Well, to answer my own question, I've traced the RAS lines on the expansion board, and it appears the RAM chips should get installed oriented with pin-1 towards the top (longest edge) of the expansion board.
Cheers
Wasn't there an Installation Guide in .pdf being talked about?
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 31/05/2005 01:43
I think so, but it probably doesn't exist yet. And I'm actually below that level here.. I get to solder on my own RAM chips. Most of the boards come with the chips already on, courtesy of Patrick.
Anyway, I've put 48MB onto my board, at the rate of about one chip every 20 minutes (as opposed to 64MB every 20 minutes by you know who. Now to doctor it into one of the Mk2a's kicking around here..
Cheers
Posted by: SonicSnoop
Re: memory board progress - 31/05/2005 02:04
I would love to learn to solder but am not brave enough to take the chances learning on my empeg and memory
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 31/05/2005 11:21
Now the big question..
I've populated only 48MB on my memory board, and would like to (continue to) use the existing 16MB of Mk2a memory as bank-0.
Any reason why this should not work (I expect it to, just haven't got that far yet).
And what are those dip switches for again?
Cheers
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 31/05/2005 11:52
Again answering my own questions:
PCA wrote:
Quote:
The board adds 4 identical banks of 16MB, and duplicates the bank0 set currently present on a MK2A. Obviously, this isn't going to work all that well. The idea is that each bank can be disabled by means of a switch on the memory board, so in the case of a MK2A you would turn off the first bank. This would still give you 64M, as the original memory would be used.
And elsewhere I found that RA3 needs to be jumpered over from the main board to enable the final 16MB (to 64MB). The other RA{0,1,2} lines appear to already be present from the test pads.
Now to hook it up, with photos along the way..
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 31/05/2005 17:14
Okay, I attached the board, got it partially working, fiddled with it for hours, and have now removed it again. Removal was suprisingly easy!
It seems trickier than first thought, to get good connections between the memory board and the main board.
Time for attempt number two.
Cheers
Posted by: cushman
Re: memory board progress - 31/05/2005 17:38
Have any pics of the memory board attached to the main board?
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 31/05/2005 18:25
Yes, I have pics.. I'll put them up later, once I get this thing working.
I've soldered it back on again now, but bank2 is failing..
-ml
Posted by: mlord
A sample installation.. with photos - 31/05/2005 23:15
Okay, I have 48MB total RAM out of a possible 64MB in my Mk2a.
Here is
my story, with photos.
Cheers
Posted by: mlord
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 01/06/2005 01:09
My initial attempt at soldering on the memory expansion went well enough, but was a complete failure in the end. The problem was all of those pre-soldered pads that exist on the mainboard. I was clever enough to desolder many of them (with copper braid + flux) beforehand, but not all of them.
It is necessary to desolder all of the pads (on the main board) that will lie underneath the memory expansion board, as otherwise they will cause a gap between the two boards, preventing good signal connections later on.
Absolutely critical, and just enough fuss to turn an easy installation job into one that requires considerably more care and skill than imagined earlier.
Soldering on the expansion board is dead simple by comparism.
EDIT: So, I had to remove the installed memory board and start over. Fortunately, this proved MUCH easier than it looked. I just used a nice solder-sucker device to desolder all of the through-holes, and the board slipped off with no fuss. What a shocker!
After that, I spent an hour removing all of the solder from all of the pads on the main board that would fall anywhere beneath the expansion board. Except I missed a couple in the top right (photos).. but they didn't matter too much in the end. This rework made a huge difference, as the player then instantly reported 48MB working RAM.
The remaining 16MB is not working yet (well, half of it is..), but you'll have to tour the photo link above to see why..
Cheers
Posted by: JBjorgen
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 01/06/2005 02:45
It looks like for a 32meg upgrade, it'd be easier/cheaper just to stack them. For 64meg, I'm sure this is a better solution.
Posted by: mlord
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 01/06/2005 09:18
Well, for +32MB or +48MB (or any Mk2 upgrade), these boards are rather good -- Patrick is selling them pre-populated, so finishing them off is just a matter of desolding the mainboard pads and then attaching the new board + the RAS3 line.
But yes, for a +16MB upgrade, just stacking the chips was easier for me.
Cheers
Posted by: andym
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 01/06/2005 11:36
For me soldering the RAS line was the biggest PITA. Everything else was quite straightforward.
Posted by: bonzi
Re: memory board progress - 01/06/2005 13:15
Quote:
Thanks - one of the guys at work will then be able to help me.
Hm, on the second thought, after the rest of Mark's posts, perhaps I should leave this to RobS, regradless of inconvenience of shipping... 
Posted by: FireFox31
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 01/06/2005 23:06
Awesome install pics, Mark. But, how can there be
"ZERO gap between the two boards"? Won't there be shorts between traces and solder? I'm comfortable using computer hardware, but I'm always nervous about components touching.
<edit>Oh, and what kind of
dock is that? Hm......
Posted by: mlord
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 01/06/2005 23:20
Quote:
Won't there be shorts between traces and solder?
The bottom of Patrick's mem card is all nicely solder-masked, meaning it has a coat of that translucent green insulation goo all over it. So there's nothing on the underside to short out on anything, unless one scratches it.
And there's nothing unmasked on the bottom of the empeg main board either, except for the test pads.
Cheers
Posted by: frog51
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 02/06/2005 09:21
Still worrying about that one - I have my stacked RAM, but no RAS line, as I buggered up the soldering once and too scared to try again. I am hoping to bribe someone with a steady hand at Amersfoort to finish the job for me.
Posted by: mlord
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 02/06/2005 11:52
Lots of flux (LOTS OF FLUX), a microscopic blob of solder on the iron, and the briefest of touches against the wire/pin.
Posted by: frog51
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 02/06/2005 13:46
Absolutely - I actually found an old chip to practice on, and I had no problem with soldering at the RAM end (after reading your and Genixia's comments about Lots Of Flux
) but can I get a connection to pin 124 on the StrongARM without touching 123 or 125?
Can I 'eck as like! Even with the smallest soldering iron and bit I could find, and a helping hands tool, and a magnifying glass. I just can't seem to get a small enough blob of solder.
So I have bought a bottle of Highland Park whisky specifically as a reward for someone who has the skill and 5 minutes of their time...they won't get the whisky until afterwards, obviously.
Posted by: andym
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 02/06/2005 16:47
I was rather naughty in the end and simply lifted the pin off the board, soldered it and encased it in snot (rubbery silicone glue stuff).
Posted by: maczrool
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 02/06/2005 21:12
What I find works in addition to large amounts of flux is to apply a very small amount of solder to the tip of the iron, then some of the solder onto the RAS line. This intermediary step helps to further diminish the amount of solder at the eventual joint at the Strong Arm pin. Then hold the end of the wire to the proper pin and briefly touch the iron to the end of the wire where the solder is.
I just think it's easier to transfer a small amount of solder from the tip of the iron onto the RAS wire then to take it directly to the wire and pin.
Stu
Posted by: mlord
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 02/06/2005 22:44
Update:
My modded player developed stability issues -- random crashes and the like.
My theory is mechanical issues -- the memory expansion card adds a lot of stiffness to the main board, and when the main board is subsequently screwed back into the stainless steel enclosure, it wants to bend to match the enclosure screw posts (flat?). This puts stress on the connections between the two boards, and I think something just "gave" in the end.
So, I've put enough hours into this for now, and tonight I disassembled the player and removed the memory card again. Not quite as clean a removal this time around -- destroyed several of the test pads, but they're not really important or needed for anything other than the (removed) memory card, so no big deal.
Back to 16MB for now, but I do still have a couple of pairs of chips to do the stacking method with eventually.
Cheers
Posted by: schofiel
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 04/06/2005 20:31
Quote:
steady hand
and Quote:
Amersfoort
Doh! 
Posted by: pca
Re: memory board progress - 06/06/2005 13:34
The first 10-15 boards should ship by the end of the week. Most of the rest will go out next week, with a bit of luck. I'm waiting for some antistatic bags to turn up, and finishing the manual.
pca
I can't wait!
Posted by: SE_Sport_Driver
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 09/06/2005 00:05
Any more updates Mark?
Posted by: mlord
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 09/06/2005 01:39
Quote:
Any more updates Mark?
Err. not since I removed the memory board in the end (post above).
Of course, now I suppose I should find a new home for the memory board I have here (with chips).
Cheers
Were these sent out? I was very early in the queue...
Posted by: pca
Re: memory board progress - 20/06/2005 14:49
By the end of tomorrow, the first 25 boards will have shipped. There will be a slight delay for the next twenty-five.
pca
Thank you, thank you! I hope I didn't come off as complaining about any delays or doubtful about any progress. Just curious.
Posted by: mtempsch
Re: memory board progress - 23/06/2005 09:11
Quote:
By the end of tomorrow, the first 25 boards will have shipped. There will be a slight delay for the next twenty-five.
pca
Just picked mine up at the post office Will start disassembling the player tonight...
Posted by: mlord
Re: A sample installation.. with photos - 23/06/2005 12:39
Quote:
My modded player developed stability issues -- random crashes and the like.
Patrick has since emailed me about this, and he said that the culprit may be insufficient current flow from the power/ground test pads. To remedy this, he is recommending additional short jumper wires from another location of the main board to the memory board. Apparently Hugo's Mk2 player needed those, and works well now with 64MB + Mk2a_bootloader + latest Hijack.
I'm not redoing mine until I hear how others make out with their upgrades. Also, Patrick said something about finishing up the installation manual soon (if not already), which ought to help.
Cheers
Posted by: schofiel
Re: memory board progress - 23/06/2005 14:44
Quote:
Will start disassembling the player tonight...
Carefully... 
Posted by: mtempsch
Re: memory board progress - 23/06/2005 15:15
Quote:
Quote:
Will start disassembling the player tonight...
Carefully... : smirk:
lyou mean no blowtorch, 5-pound hammer and chisel? Awww.... spoilsport!
Got to say that helping to rip out the kitchen - everything, down to raw floor/walls/roof - at a friends house last summer was serious fun 
. Not everyday you get to really live out your destructive urges. Better yet was that the old cabinets were fairly sturdy, none of the pressboard crap of today...
Since there appears to be a need for some extra wiring for power anyway, I'll take it very slow (and carefully ) until Patrick says something 'official'.
Posted by: schofiel
Re: memory board progress - 23/06/2005 15:26
The manual with revised wiring description are being written at this very moment.
Posted by: mtempsch
Re: memory board progress - 23/06/2005 16:03
Quote:
The manual with revised wiring description are being written at this very moment.
Great!
BTW, any chance to pick up a new rotary encoder at the meet? The current one occasionally glitches and jumps the wrong way - often envigorating , but sometimes slightly embarrasing 
Posted by: schofiel
Re: memory board progress - 23/06/2005 16:31
Yup - I would suggest someone start a thread with a list of "parts wanted" for Amersfoort, and I'll make sure I have the bits ready. Gotta go!
Quote:
Just picked mine up at the post office Will start disassembling the player tonight...
Mine must be caught up in Customs... I was order #3 and it's not here. Let's hope I'm not on a terrorist watch list!
Posted by: mtempsch
Re: memory board progress - 25/06/2005 18:35
Quote:
Mine must be caught up in Customs... I was order #3 and it's not here. Let's hope I'm not on a terrorist watch list!
You bet you are Odd electronics, association with the Hijack guy, obvious suspect Then again, Mark has previously expressed some negativity towards the USPS, so if that's what Patrick used, it might just be normal incompetence and not malice 
My progress so far: I got he mainboard out - eventually, that center screw just wouldn't budge! Ended up doing stuff that Rob shouldn't know about 
Had to reassemble and check that everyhing still worked; all OK. All the pads that'll be under the board are cleaned off with desoldering braid and the boards are completely flat against each other. Now just waiting for the commandments to be handed down before proceeding... Only thing that concerns me is getting that last RAS line in place...
Posted by: caseyse
Re: memory board progress - 25/06/2005 21:52
Rec'd 2 of my 3 boards today. I'm going to upgrade one of my mk2 units first, once instructions are available. These are very nice looking boards. Thank you for your time and effort on these Patrick
Also, thank you Mark for the expanded memory kernel
Posted by: mlord
Re: memory board progress - 25/06/2005 23:40
In addition to the RAS line, you'll also need to run extra (SHORT!) power and ground signals from the capacitors on the main board just above the main board memory chips over to the capacitors on the memory board. One set of power and ground should do it, I'd think.
Failure to do this may result in all sorts of weird memory errors, or having things appear to work, and then fail when operating at a different temperature.
Cheers
Posted by: FireFox31
Re: memory board progress - 26/06/2005 23:34
I just found the postal notice saying they tried to deliver my memory board on Saturday. Now I can go pick it up when I ship out buttons in the morning!
But then my only lit player goes to Eutronix for the upgrade. I will be back in the dark ages.
Posted by: alex25
Re: memory board progress - 28/06/2005 13:15
Any news on the manual for the memory board? Am I right that it is not yet available? (At least I have not found it)
I've got the board yesterday and can't wait to upgrade the player. I don't need a full featured, colored manual. I'm happy with a simple step by step installation guide.
Posted by: schofiel
Re: memory board progress - 28/06/2005 15:06
Only a little while before it's ready.
Posted by: Defiler
Re: memory board progress - 28/06/2005 16:13
Rockin'. Picked up my two boards from the post office today.
Posted by: Glen_L
Re: memory board progress - 18/07/2005 13:02
Patrick,
Any update on when the next batch might be ready?
Posted by: Glen_L
Re: memory board progress - 23/08/2005 14:26
Bump...is the second batch still on hold? I've held off ordering a larger hard drive and installing 3.0a11 until I have the memory board installed. I believe I was #32 in the queue.
Posted by: pupvogel
Re: memory board progress - 23/08/2005 14:35
i guess we'll just have to wait...
i have order #2 - pca's last reply in july was they'll go out soon.
too bad there's a great deal of flexibility in the word 'soon'...
well i don't complain as i have no idea yet how i get those boards into my empegs...i really don't think i should do that myself...