Animation Cel Buying Advice

Do we have any animation/comic collectors in the house???

I've found a Cel of Johnny Bravo and Scooby Doo that I really want, but I have not idea what is a good price and if it will make a good investment long term.

Any thoughts???

Cheers

Cris.

I've never been an animation collector, but I've worked in the comics collector arena. You should never buy such things as an investment. They aren't going to increase in value significantly, unless Johnny Bravo becomes some stellar animation star, which is wildly unlikely. In fact, the only reason that original Scooby-Doo cels would be worth much is more because they weren't sold off in large quanitites like cels these days often are.

That being said, you should collect things because you like them. That in itself usually, in fact, presupposes that you aren't likely to resell them anyway.

I'd guess that it's overpriced, but not by a lot. The WB store around here sold cels and they were often about as expensive as that, and they were for original well-established characters. Keep in mind that they say they have 150 of them, so they can't be guaranteeing that you'll get the one that's pictured, unless they're not really selling cels but repro lithographs or something. (I think they are, since they say they're hand-painted. Then again, they claim that the Thomas Kinkade paintings they sell are hand-painted, but they're repros spot-touched by assembly liners. It's also possible that they're cels in the notion that they're painted on acetate, but not used for production, though I think that's also not the case.) It's also worth pointing out that it's probably got a repro background, unless JB is non-traditionally animated, which I doubt.

To sum up, I don't honestly know what a good price would be, but it's definitely not a good financial investment. Once you figure out how much you want to spend, buy it because you like it, not because you think one day it'll be worth more. After all, remember that the reason that such things become valuable is because people like them, and the fact that you like it is a much more sound criterion for that than some obscure intellectualized judgement.

Was the empeg an investment? Mine wasn't bought at full price from empeg towers

You want it buy it

I don't envisage making money on any Animation Cel I buy, I was just wondering if there are do's and don'ts. It's allot of money to spend on an item like that.

I'm a big closet Johnny Bravo fan, so it's worth it to me, but maybe I'll wait for the one that really jumps out at me.

Cheers

Cris.

You gotta remember that they said they have 150 of them. Now, if they're nice, they'll have hand-picked nice frames, but that's bound to be at least ten seconds of animation, so it's possible that you might get one with JB half out of frame. I've definitely seen cels for sale like that, though usually only old ones where that's all they've got.

Good point!!!

I think that particular Cel has not been used in production, so each 150 are the same, just finished by hand, and signed.

I've found a Gallery in London that has one, so maybe I'll nip in there next time I'm down, if it leaps out at me I'll know its the one. They want £425!!! A bit more than I want to pay!

I have my heart set on a Signed Production Cel, so I'll keep hunting for one of them if this one doesn't work out.

Cheers

Cris.

IMO, if it's not a real production cel then it's worth very little, certainly as an investment.

Yea, I suppose it could be a colour photocopy finished by hand for all I know.

I think'll still take a look, they have loads of other cool stuff at the gallery by the looks of it.

Cheers

Cris,

www.cartoon-factory.com has real production Johnny Bravo cels for $300. They also have that same "cel" that you linked to for $525 ($425 without a frame), leading me to believe that it's definitely not a production cel -- not even intended for production.

Careful, you could end up with a piece of Scratchy's arm!

Rob

Careful, you could end up with a piece of Scratchy's arm!

LOL. A true classic!!

I collect cels and production drawings -- mostly production drawings ... It's notable that while this isn't a production cel (rather a limited edition cel), they actually are still quite collectable and do increase in value (you can find popular Disney and WB limited editions that sell in the thousands of dollars). I personally don't buy limited editions because I think there's something cool about having a piece of the real production. I buy production drawinings because they were (back in the day anyway) actually done by the real artists vs the inked/painted cels which was just some cog in a machine (though prices don't agree with my personal opinion, that's just how I feel). Now, of course, for most big productions, cels don't even exist because they're all inked on the computer

Anyway, back to your problem ... This piece is framed, so that adds about $100 on usually. To be fair, you'd easily spend that much getting it framed yourself unless you actually have a matte cutter and know how to frame. So back that down and you're at around $425 for the piece. Note that this is also signed, which does increase value. So now you have to do some google and eBay hunting to find comparables ... For instance with a couple searches I found http://www.animationusa.com/general/cn002.html which is an actual production cel unframed at $300. Now it's hard to compare because this cel was surrounded by a couple hundred that look almost exactly like it vs yours is only a run of 150. So at that point it's just weighing which one you prefer and whether the price difference is balanced by "feelgoodness". Now if you're looking at it from an investment standpoint, then you want to look at other Johnny Bravo limited editions and see how they increase in value over time (though you don't have much to compare against for him probably). It's obviously a gamble. If you were buying Disney or traditional WB characters, you have a solid investment, but with "niche" characters and cartoons, it's less clear.

So in conclusion I don't think you're necessarily being ripped off, but you're not getting a "deal" by any means. But then you don't buy direct from the cartoon network for bargain basement prices. It's like buying anything from the name brand outlet. Your best bet is to buy off of eBay as long as you do your research. I think I would rather own the production cel that is cheaper than the limited edition, but that's just my personal opinion.

Random Info:
http://www.animationmeat.com/cericel.html
http://www.awn.com/mag/issue2.8/2.8pages/2.8grossfeldcollect.html

Some Galleries I've Bought From (and been happy with):
http://www.thegremlin.com/
http://www.animationusa.com
http://www.animationartgallery.com/
http://www.vegalleries.com

Another thing I recommend is to call a gallery or two ... While they are salespeople to be sure, most genuinely love animation art and will gladly talk to you about it and explain things to you. When I first started collecting a few years ago, that's what I did.

That is a great episode of Johnny Bravo the cartoon network never shows it though.

Now, of course, for most big productions, cels don't even exist because they're all inked on the computer

Couldn't you sell "genuine electrons believed to have been used in the production of 'Finding Nemo'"? You can offer a money-back guarantee if the buyer proves that they weren't.

Gareth

PM sent. Read. Go over. Enjoy.
Me.

Bad:
* As said previously, it's "Limited Edition", which means it's a reproduction and not original in the literal sense of the word.
* If possible, you want the original sketch/drawing to go with the Cel. You won't get it here.
* I'm not sure how memorable Johnny and Scooby are when compared to Disney/WB classics and the like.

Good:
* There's only 150 made.
* It's Signed.
* Johnny Bravo AND Scooby Doo?! How can you go wrong?

Regardless of the above, it's not like you can haggle for a price, so if you have the money and it's worth it to you, go for it!

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, but it's my experience that stuff produced exclusively to be collectable, that is, "signed and numbered"-type bullshit never increases in value over the long run, and rarely in the short run. This may well be different in the animation arena, but have you ever sold a limited edition "cel" that nominally increased in value? Or is it that sellers who are sitting on them for too long increase the price to make them look more valuable?

Johnny Bravo AND Scooby Doo?! How can you go wrong?

You could have Scrappy Doo too, in this case we appear to be safe

Cheers Guys!!!

Loads of good info here. One thing I have decided is that I'm not going to buy over the Net, I think I need to see the thing in person to make sure its worth that much to me.

I've already found a Danger Mouse Cel (Well a one off Cel draw and inked by the creator, i.e. there is only ONE anything like it!) for over £1200 that I fancy, but thats way out of my league at the moment

Cris.

I have never bought a limited edition cel personally, so I haven't really watch their values at all. I will say that animation art, in general, isn't a particularly great investment -- there are certainly much better places to put your money. What I can say, though is that at the moment there is a pretty high demand for limited edition animation art (I think a lot of it has been driven by Disney releasing lithgraphs with their movies for the past few years). In the general case, I agree with you -- I view this as more of a fad. And like I said in my original response -- given the cost of some of these limited editions (there are some I've seen that sell for several thousand dollars), it seems sort of silly to buy a "fake" when you can buy a real cel for less money. But then when it comes down to it, it's all about the artwork -- If you think the limited edition cel or the lithographs are better images, then knock yourself out. The other thing I tend to dislike about limited editions is that they are always like the family portrait version of the characters -- it's completely artificial in layout. I feel like there's a lot more "life" in the production drawings/cels that catch the character in a motion and not looking into the camera and posing intentionally.

ms

I used to buy a lot of WB art, mostly the Model Sheets. It helped that I was working at one of the Studio Stores at the time and got a 20% discount. My favourite (and first) buy was the Batman Lightning cel which I've had for about 8 years now and still love and has appreciated nicely in price. At the end of the day I was buying because I liked and if that's the attitude you stick with you shouldn't be disappointed.

One cel I always regret not buying was a 1/1 where they'd taken a scene from a Wile cartoon The Fast and the Furyous which they'd managed to match the original pencil drawing to. The scene was quite comical but I couldn't afford the £1200 price tag. I wonder where that is now.

Sometimes when you see a unique piece, you just need to suck it up and pay the money if and only if you truly love it. I was at an artist's garage sale and he had a beautiful oil painting that was originally commissioned by the (New York) Village Voice as cover art. It had some ugly movie projector-like machines rampaging through New York like Godzilla or King Kong, shooting film reels out of their arms that, as if they were UFOs, were zapping things on the ground. It cost me $1000 and I don't regret it for a second. (Sorry, I don't remember the artist's name off the top of my head, and the piece is at home while I'm at work.)

Whenever you're buying art for "normal" prices, which is to say, for something well under your monthly salary, you shouldn't be thinking about its resale value. You should be thinking "that's something I want to hang on my wall". The same goes for jewelry, clothes, furniture, and just about anything else except maybe consumer electronics. Now, if you're buying something more rare and expensive (say, you found some pre-production artist concept sketches from the original Star Wars), then you're going to want to think of your purchase as an asset rather than just a pretty wall decoration, especially if you need to borrow the money to pay for it!

So... if you really dig Johnny Bravo and Scooby Doo and you really like that specific image... and you really want to see it hanging on your wall now and five years from now, then pay the money and enjoy the artwork!