Unoffical empeg BBS

Quick Links: Empeg FAQ | RioCar.Org | Hijack | BigDisk Builder | jEmplode | emphatic
Repairs: Repairs

Topic Options
#298633 - 21/05/2007 22:46 Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC IDE?
Willd
new poster

Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 17
Loc: Sussex UK
Major apologies if this has been asked a thousand times but I have searched for a good half hour and found nothing.

Is there a way to fill up my Empeg hard drive with nice new MP3s (from scratch) without using the emplode etc , by simply connecting the hard drive directly to my computer , then putting it back in the Empeg? Presumbably the Empeg wouldn't know what to do with it and would get all confused , but is there some software app to sort out the HD so the empeg knows whats on it?

Thanks in advance.
Will (Sussex, UK) MK11 30GB bog standard
_________________________
Sussex, UK. Rio car 30Gb and Neo35

Top
#298634 - 21/05/2007 22:53 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: Willd]
JBjorgen
carpal tunnel

Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3582
Loc: Columbus, OH
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see why you couldn't mount the drive on a linux box (or even possibly under Cygwin?) and use mp3tofid and rsync to copy your tunes over. I've never used mp3tofid or rsync for anything empeg related, so you'll have to do a quick search on them.

BTW, not to hijack the question, can someone tell me if you could mount the filesystem on a big-endian system, like a PowerPC Mac? Just to trying to satisfy my curiosity.

Top
#298635 - 22/05/2007 05:03 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: JBjorgen]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5680
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see why you couldn't mount the drive on a linux box (or even possibly under Cygwin?) and use mp3tofid and rsync to copy your tunes over.


That will work fine, apart from the Cygwin part. You'll also need ext2 drivers for Windows.
_________________________
-- roger

Top
#298636 - 22/05/2007 15:16 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC IDE? [Re: Willd]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31565
Loc: Seattle, WA
WillD, yes you can do it, but it's more trouble than it's worth.

The empeg doesn't store its files as loose MP3s. Instead, it stores them in a special database format. This format is described here.

In order to do what you describe, you would need the following things:

- You would need to dismantle your player each time you wanted to load tunes on it, which is a rather big job.

- You would need to disconnect the drive cable, risking wear and tear on the most failure-prone parts of the player.

- Every time you open the player, you take the chance of damaging certain fragile components that are easy to break accidentally.

- You would need to buy a special adapter cable to connect the empeg's laptop-sized hard disk to your desktop PC.

- Your desktop PC would need to be running Linux so it could mount the Linux filesystems on the drive.

- You would need to use the MP3toFID utility (as described above) to convert your MP3s into the format that the empeg expects.

After all that is said and done, it's simply easier and faster to use Emplode or Jemplode, and use the player as it was intended to be used.

What is your objection to using Emplode, may I ask? Perhaps whatever problem you're running into is something that we have a solution to.
_________________________
Tony Fabris

Top
#298637 - 22/05/2007 15:50 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: tfabris]
JBjorgen
carpal tunnel

Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3582
Loc: Columbus, OH
Quote:
What is your objection to using Emplode, may I ask?


My guess is transferring many Gbs of data on a 10mbps line. It takes a LONG time.

Also, if you take the time to figure out how to use mp3tofid and rsync now, you can keep your player in sync with your computer automatically in the future, without having to mess with emplode and jemplode. It's really not a bad idea if you have the technical competence and the time to figure it out.

As Tony said though, take care with taking your player apart and putting it back together. I've taken mine apart dozens of times without problems, but it only takes one mistake to damage an IDE header or cable, or blow a display fuse.

Quote:
You would need to dismantle your player each time you wanted to load tunes on it


Couldn't he just change his rsync config to sync over the network after the first initial sync?
_________________________
~ John

Top
#298638 - 29/05/2007 18:15 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: JBjorgen]
Willd
new poster

Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 17
Loc: Sussex UK
Hi, yes it is the time issue and also I was thinking of putting in a more reliable drive. My machine (30GB) comes up with HDD not found, apart from in warm weather. In cold weather i have to power it up 2 or 3 times, leaving it on inbetween, to get some heat into the drive.

I just didn't fancy tying up the PC for proably 24 hours uploading a whole drives worth of mp3 with USB1 , and I kinda figured one of you clever lot would have come up with a facility to fill up the drive . (you seem to have invented some other amazing gear!)

Since I would have the machine apart anyway, there would be no extra trauma for it with regards to the connectors. Also, I planned to use a USB to 2.5 inch drive converter to actually attach it to the PC for filling.

How long should 40 gigs take to fill up with the USB lead?
_________________________
Sussex, UK. Rio car 30Gb and Neo35

Top
#298639 - 29/05/2007 18:46 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: Willd]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4172
Loc: Cambridge, England
Quote:
Since I would have the machine apart anyway, there would be no extra trauma for it with regards to the connectors. Also, I planned to use a USB to 2.5 inch drive converter to actually attach it to the PC for filling.
[...]
How long should 40 gigs take to fill up with the USB lead?

You don't get the full USB1 bandwidth, or anything like, talking to the car-player directly: you should expect ~400Kbytes/s, so you're looking at 100,000 seconds, or about 28h. I've just done exactly what you describe (USB-to-IDE adapter, mp3tofid(*), mount on Linux) to re-fill my player after sticking new disks in it: I got ~10Mbytes/s, and I'd've got more than that except I stupidly made the "mp3tofid" directory tree on a different PC than the music files were on, so they all went over 100Mbit Ethernet.

It's not necessarily a beginner's task, though; the steps are:
  • Follow Roger's partitioning instructions using PC Linux and your USB-to-IDE adapter (your drive will appear as "sda" or "sdb" or similar instead of "hdc").
  • Follow Roger's formatting instructions.
  • Use Pim's mp3tofid program, which creates a link-farm on your PC that mirrors the desired directory layout on the car-player.
  • Use rsync (or just cp -L) to copy them to the filesystem on /dev/sda4
  • Install drives in player and run the normal upgrader to populate the root filesystem.
  • Then either use Emplode/Jemplode/Emptool for subsequent addition of music, or set up the whole rsync-over-Ethernet thing described on Pim's README.

I had 180Gbytes of mixed FLAC and MP3, so I was looking at a 6h vs 125h transfer.

Peter

(*) In fact a little program I knocked up a while ago, which is better about ASX playlists and about tracks which exist both as FLAC and MP3 -- but the moral equivalent of mp3tofid.

Top
#298640 - 29/05/2007 19:54 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: peter]
Willd
new poster

Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 17
Loc: Sussex UK
Thanks!.. and Yikes. Might be a bit beyond my capabilities / patience
_________________________
Sussex, UK. Rio car 30Gb and Neo35

Top
#298641 - 30/05/2007 17:54 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: Willd]
canuckInOR
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/02/2002
Posts: 3212
Loc: Portland, OR
Quote:
I just didn't fancy tying up the PC for probably 24 hours

Split your music into thirds (or quarters), and let it upload while you sleep.

Low-tech, but it's simple.

(On a side note, if you think it takes a long time via USB or ethernet, you should try doing it by serial cable... I uploaded one song that way just for giggles. It brought back memories of downloading things from a BBS.)

Top
#298642 - 30/05/2007 18:48 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: Willd]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31565
Loc: Seattle, WA
Willd, definitely do ethernet instead of USB, and just stick to the standard music upload methods.
_________________________
Tony Fabris

Top
#298643 - 18/06/2007 07:40 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: canuckInOR]
kjohanss
journeyman

Registered: 24/10/2000
Posts: 65
Loc: Bjørkelangen, Norway
Digression: BBS! Wow! I just remembered - I have a Wildcat BBS software install CD. It would be fun to install it on a Win95 computer just for the fun of it. No?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildcat!_BBS
now owned by
http://www.santronics.com
_________________________
Kyrre

'enni mizpellings ar dju tu kompjutr error'

www.kyrre.no

Norway, Hijack'ed 120GB upgrade, MKII, tuner, green, red, blue, yellow, illuminated. Looking good!

Top
#298644 - 18/06/2007 21:23 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: peter]
pim
addict

Registered: 14/11/2000
Posts: 474
Loc: The Hague, the Netherlands
Quote:
(*) In fact a little program I knocked up a while ago, which is better about ASX playlists and about tracks which exist both as FLAC and MP3 -- but the moral equivalent of mp3tofid.


mp3tofid indeed does not import playlists from files, but it does handle tracks which exist in multiple formats.

mp3tofid --help (in v4 and newer) suggests
--preferred-codec=codec[,codec]

for example, --preferred-codec=flac,ogg means: if a file exists in multiple formats, then use the preferred format (order is significant) and ignore others

If only mt-daapd and mpd had this option ...

Pim

Top
#298645 - 19/06/2007 09:22 Re: Can I remove the HD and fill it up with mp3s from my desktop PC ID [Re: pim]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4172
Loc: Cambridge, England
Quote:
mp3tofid indeed does not import playlists from files, but it does handle tracks which exist in multiple formats.

What I've ended up doing is having two parallel directory structures, one full of MP3s and the other of FLACs. I rip CDs into both simultaneously, but prepare playlists and so on in the MP3 tree only. Then the receiver server scans both trees, and notes when a pair of files are the lossless and lossy versions of the same thing. That way it can offer the same playlist hierarchy to both real Receivers and car-player Receiver Edition, but, for the Receiver Edition, send the FLACs instead of the MP3s. And I only have to make playlists once, for MP3s (I can even do it in Rio Music Manager if I only tell it about the MP3 directory).

Quote:
If only mt-daapd and mpd had this option ...

At some point I'm hoping to spooge support for this into mt-daapd and/or gmediaserver.

Peter

Top