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#260876 - 26/07/2005 12:13 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: wfaulk]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
Hot-swap disks are clearly important in a commecial environment, but for the home, I think I can tollerate the downtime once every N years when a disk fails and I have to take the thing apart. Still, that Buffalo thing has something like 40 screws you need to take out before you get a disk out.

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#260877 - 03/08/2005 15:25 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: TigerJimmy]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
Quote:
Well, here's my $.02.

You don't need very much processor power...


TigerJimmy has inspired me to break the bonds of Windows and experiment with this old beige box that's been collecting dust for a few years.
(180MHz Cyrix GX, 64MB RAM! )
I bought three of the Maxtor 200GB drives that were on sale at Fry's recently (no rebate) and started downloading Debian iso files.
Several days later I've managed to get a modest install running (desktop is a no-no). Did I mention that I'm new to this?
The learning experience has just begun, however- now I have to complete the configuration and establish my network.
Thanks to TigerJimmy and a couple of friends, I may soon have a 400+GB RAID5 box for a total capital outlay of $255.
Then I can begin ripping my CD collection!
...and, um, learning what a shell prompt does!
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)

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#260878 - 05/08/2005 13:59 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
Ezekiel
pooh-bah

Registered: 25/08/2000
Posts: 2413
Loc: NH USA
Robotic-
What kernel do you have running (or rather what installs by default w/Sarge). I've also got an old PIII box, and I want to use SATA (better airflow), but that seems to be (better) supported with the 2.6 kernel. Before I pony up for drives & the controller I wanted to check. Thanks.

-Zeke

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#260879 - 05/08/2005 16:04 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Ezekiel]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
Quote:
Robotic-
What kernel ...?


When presented with the selection of kernels to load, I chose 2.6 a few times, but it always hung during boot up. It took me a while before I realized the installer was 'recommending' 2.4 to me, so that's what's on there.
Your machine sounds more like TigerJimmy's (mine's weaker)- I'm not sure what kernel he's running, but I am sure he'll be happy to tell you!

Oh- and I'm running straight off of the motherboard- no controller card. But I guess you'd have to go that route if you wanted SATA.

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#260880 - 05/08/2005 17:08 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
Ezekiel
pooh-bah

Registered: 25/08/2000
Posts: 2413
Loc: NH USA
Thanks. I've installed Linux few times, none recently so I don't want to go out and get hardware w/o checking if it'll work first. I may forget the SATA, especially if I can root out a 133 PATA controller which I think I might have in the compu-junk crate (freebie with a drive a while back).

-Zeke
_________________________
WWFSMD?

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#260881 - 19/08/2005 13:08 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: DWallach]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
My Infrant NAS box is finally here and I'm pushing all of my data to it as we speak. The HTML configuration gizmo is pretty good, and the manual is great, so far as it goes. So far, my only real concerns are:

- They support per-user shares (i.e., \\YourServer\User1), but only under SMB. You can't see those shares via NFS and you can't really even configure those shares for things like when snapshots happen. As a result, I'm keeping the per-user authentication, but I'll be storing everything in a big, central share that I can mount once and be done with.

- They have a magic "media" share that is used for UPnP, SlimServer, and other such tasks. My MP3 collection is on its way over there. More tomorrow on how well it works. On their chat board, it seems a lot of people are trying to integrate with these various network video playing gizmos (e.g., the Roku HD1000). The consensus seems to be that you can get these boxes to work, but that they all suck in one way or another. There doesn't appear to yet exist a category killer for these things.

- I plugged my USB printer (an HP Deskjet 970Cxi) in and it was recognized and properly exported. However, any jobs I send to it are silently gobbled up and ignored. Hopefully they've got some kind of workaround.

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#260882 - 19/08/2005 15:45 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: DWallach]
Foz
member

Registered: 24/10/2000
Posts: 106
Loc: San Jose, CA
I finally got rid of my Terastation, and built my own NAS box. Frys had fully complete sempron minitower systems on sale for $170, so I bought one, put 3 400 gig hard drives in it, built them as a raid 5 array and exported them to my network via NFS and samba. As a bonus, I moved my streaming music server and my mysql database to the same box and radically simplified my HTPC which was running all of that previously.

-- Gary F.
_________________________
Eeyore, Original Owner -- Mk II 80 Gb, Blue S/N #090000803 Tigger, 2nd Owner -- Mk IIa, 80 Gb, Blue S/N #40103789

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#260883 - 22/08/2005 14:56 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
Yee-haw!
Finally got all the ducks in a row and the install (the last of *several* attempts) went extremely smoothly- I guess practice makes perfect!
Big THANK YOU to TigerJimmy for expert guidance!
I now have 'gobsOspace' running happily- unfortunately, the newer machine got jealous of the attention and the 80GB drive that is currently holding all of my gold is threatening me with problems.
When the 80GB drive is not acting up, I can transfer about 50MB/min to the Debian machine.
Total ca$h invested <$300 (including new router!)
The basic setup is outlined in my above post- further additions/lessons:
- Netgear router (on sale! $30 no rebate! Woot! Network Empeg access!)
- PCI NIC -old ISA card was a no-go for Linux (on sale! $10 no rebate! Woot!)
- motherboard video and the Debian installer don't get along- had to go back to the PCI video card that was in there before.
- Next step: UPS
- Yet to be resolved: Debian is continually accessing the drives- even when no data is being transferred. With Jim's help we determined that SWAP was not involved. Does anyone have an idea of what could be causing this?
I would think that the drives should spin down if nothing is going on...
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)

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#260884 - 22/08/2005 15:10 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4172
Loc: Cambridge, England
Quote:
- Yet to be resolved: Debian is continually accessing the drives- even when no data is being transferred. With Jim's help we determined that SWAP was not involved. Does anyone have an idea of what could be causing this?
I would think that the drives should spin down if nothing is going on...

Does /etc/fstab list "noatime" in your mount options? If not, you'll want to change "defaults" to "defaults,noatime" against all your real filesystems.

Peter

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#260885 - 22/08/2005 16:25 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: DWallach]
GarySh
new poster

Registered: 29/12/2001
Posts: 6
Loc: CA, USA
In the end, how much cheaper was the X-Raid via the powerbuy? Want to determine whether it's worth holding off until the next one, or jump on it now.

Thanks,

- Gary

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#260886 - 22/08/2005 16:39 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: peter]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
Quote:
Does /etc/fstab list "noatime" in your mount options? If not, you'll want to change "defaults" to "defaults,noatime" against all your real filesystems.

Peter

Thanks for the quick reply, Peter!
I'll check tonight. Well, I'll *figure out* how to check tonight... still a steep learning curve here wrt linux/unix shell prompts.
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)

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#260887 - 22/08/2005 16:53 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
JBjorgen
carpal tunnel

Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3583
Loc: Columbus, OH
To display the contents of the file, at the prompt, just type "cat /etc/fstab".

If it needs editing, then "vi /etc/fstab"
hit "a" to enter insert mode, then make your changes.
hit "esc" to exit insert mode, then type ":wq" to save and exit.
_________________________
~ John

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#260888 - 22/08/2005 17:02 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: JBjorgen]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
Quote:
To display the contents of the file...

Wonderful! Thanks!
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)

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#260889 - 22/08/2005 19:24 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: GarySh]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
Quote:
In the end, how much cheaper was the X-Raid via the powerbuy? Want to determine whether it's worth holding off until the next one, or jump on it now.

If you buy a diskless XRAID and then buy separate disks at street prices, then you're pretty close to the PowerBuy price. The big savings came on the disks. Normally, they charge a premium to ship you a system that's ready to go, out of the box. Do-it-yourself installation is reasonably painless, so if you want it now, that's how I'd do it.

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#260890 - 23/08/2005 18:43 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: JBjorgen]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
Thanks for the lesson!
I managed to easily edit the file and added the ",noatime" behind "defaults".
Wasn't quite sure what was meant by 'real' filesystems, but I tried various combinations, including everything except swap.
Also didn't know whether to expect the changes to take immediate effect or whether a reboot was needed.
No matter- tested everything and did not get a quiet 'disk access' LED.
Did I miss something? Might there be something else I could check on?
- really appreciate the help, guys!
Say, if I get a hang of this Linux stuff, these home-grown NAS systems could be fun to build for friends!

Edit:
Hmm, found this disk spin-down primer that I'll have to read this week.
I guess it's normal for the disks to be spinning all the time with Linux. Weird.
Looks like noflushd is a strong option for me.
Anyone want to argue in favor of disks spinning all day and night?


Edited by Robotic (24/08/2005 15:49)
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)

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#260891 - 25/08/2005 19:05 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
One last update for my homebrew NAS-
The drive issue (constant accessing) magically disappeared last night after a message popped up relating the completion of the RAID5 sync following the OS install. Go figure- it was working on something the whole time.
However, trying to install the drive spin-down package failed and pointed to problems with my 'locales' that I'll attack soon.
Happiness ensues!

and- since the RAID5 sync finished the transfer speed has nearly doubled to ~90MB/min!


Edited by Robotic (26/08/2005 14:19)
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)

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#260892 - 16/11/2005 22:50 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: DWallach]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
Got any more thoughts on your NAS?
_________________________
Bitt Faulk

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#260893 - 07/06/2006 13:39 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
Robotic
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
Dredging up an old thread because a thought popped into my head.
(the rhyme is totally unintended)

I was just thinking about booting up Linux from a USB jump drive.
If the BIOS allows such a thing, would it be possible to forego a CD drive on a home-built NAS and use the standard terminals for 4 HDs instead of what I've done (3HDs+1CD)?
Moot point for my particular case- the BIOS does not support USB boot. That and I'm not gonna muck about fixing something that's not broke.
One can put all the OS and supporting stuff on a cheap USB flash drive, no? Umm- ok Swap on the flash would be a no-no, but otherwise...
Just thinking to myself about the implications of flash memory-based OS.
_________________________
10101311 (20GB- backup empeg)
10101466 (2x60GB, Eutronix/GreenLights Blue) (Stolen!)

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#260894 - 07/06/2006 14:21 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: wfaulk]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
While we've resurrected this thread...

My Infrant X6 is now some nine months old and humming along nicely. Actually, it's humming noticably louder than the day I bought it (the fan now runs at 4300rpm rather than its original 3700-3900rpm) and Infrant is sending me a replacement fan, under warranty, to see if that addresses the problem. I have "rev A" box, and they've since gone to a completely different fan structure in the newer "rev B" boxes, although there's still quite a bit of agitation on the Infrant chat board, particularly with the "rev B" boxes.

Still, it's working like a champ, now happily storing my entire CD collection as Apple Lossless. With the latest SlimServer software, it even does the transcoding to WAV to support my SqueezeBox. Performance was marginal when I was using 100Mbit Ethernet and no battery backup. Notably, it was unable to deal with capturing video from my video camera through iMovie (DV video is something like 25Mbits). Now I've got GigE and battery backup and the performance is quite snappy. iMovie is now entirely happy to have all of its data on the file server.

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#260895 - 07/06/2006 15:30 Re: External storage recommendation requested. [Re: Robotic]
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14482
Loc: Canada
Quote:

One can put all the OS and supporting stuff on a cheap USB flash drive, no? Umm- ok Swap on the flash would be a no-no, but otherwise...
Just thinking to myself about the implications of flash memory-based OS.


This is done all of the time. Just (1) no swap on flash, and (2) no filesystems mounted permanently R/W on flash either (a mounted f/s results in quite regular updates on the fly, which isn't great for the flash. Or perhaps laptop-mode would help with this instead).

Cheers

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