So what should I do? Get one now or wait until 2004 for the STi version? 260 horses and 6 gears sounds pretty good, but I really want one now...

How about www.i-club.com

I only say that cuz you'll get more answers. BUT, I think for the money, you might be better off getting a WRX and modifying it. But the STi will be out of my price range, so I can't really say. I got my WRX for $25K, the STi will be ~$28K and the EVO-VII will be about $32K. But go test drive a WRX now to gauge it. 30hp isn't that much more and can be gotten easily. Whatever you do, don't test drive an auto - you'll be unimpressed (unless autos are all you have ever driven.)

260 horses and 6 gears sounds pretty good, but I really want one now...

What Brad said. (but I am obliged to join the chorus of silver WRXes!) Maybe $29-$30K, even, by the time they get here.

I'd love a 6-speed, but can't see spending that much on wheels (or afford it!). Only you know what's right for you. If fun is the priority, one risk of the delayed gratification approach is that the world is an unpredictable place and sometimes the DG never arrives. How much fun are your present wheels?

Well I've test driven the WRX about 6 times and loved it more each time. And I really hate delayed gratification, plus I just sold my 4Runner, so I guess I should get a new car soon. In the meantime I get to drive my Dad's '83 944 though...

Just out of interest, how much does it cost to insure an Impreza in the US? I'm 23 and live in UK so insurance is a nightmare. Whilst I could probably just about afford a new WRX, the insurance would be somewhere in the region of £6000 which I cannot justify. It's all very well spending serious money on a car because at least you've got something to show for it. But spending £6k on insurance and then having a claim free year is just a bit too much especially as they'll probably increase the premium for the next year anyway. I'm currently paying over £1000 on my current car, and it's not even particularly sporty.

Not that I'm jealous or anything, I'd really love an Impreza, my cousins husband had one, admittedly he's nearly 30 so his insurance is considerably less. Looks like I'll have to see how expensive a Golf GTI is going to be in the meantime.

...how much does it cost to insure an Impreza in the US?

I'm not quite sure how car insurance works in the UK but in the US insurance rates are different from state to state. I am 25 and live in Massachusetts which has some of the highest car insurance in the country (top 5 at least) and with a new WRX my insurance (with a $500 deductible, should I get into an accident) would run me less than $700 a year. Right now I own a '95 Toyota 4Runner and my insurance is about $800/year. Massachusetts insurance is regulated so there is less competition between companies, but in some other states one can get very discounted insurance rates. (not that $700 is bad )

i-Club.com sucks! j/k

Get the WRX or wait for the STi... it's a really hard choice... it really all depends on what you plan on doing with the car. If you value you factory warranty more than anything and you want a fast car. Wait for the STi. If you don't mind voiding your warranty on a WRX to make it as fast as an STi, then get the WRX... you'll be able to extract more performance from it fort he dollar value than you would straight up paying for an STi.

I bought my 1999 Impreza 2.5RS and added an aftermarket turbo and all sorts of other goodies to the car. It's well over 320 hp right now... but I've obviously pretty much voided my entire warranty on the car. But it's been worth it. Even with the tiny ocassionaly problem I have it's been worth the thrill ride that my car has become.

And the biggest consideration of all... how much money are you willing to spend on modding the car? If you are going to do so? Because modifications on a Subaru do NOT come cheap. They are still such low production cars compared to Hondas and Nissans that the runs of aftermarket parts are much lower and you are going to eat a lot more of the R&D costs (which is usually nothing more than how much the company wants to charge you).

When you do decide to buy a car drop by i-Club and post in your regional forum to find out the best dealers in your area. If your in MA I know the NESIC forum is VERY active so you'll certainly get a reply right away.

As far as MA having high insurance rates... it may, but you certainly don't. I have a 1999 Impreza 2.5RS and I pay $2300 a year with a $1000 deductable. So count yourself lucky only paying $700 a year man! Maybe I should have stayed in MA and not moved to FL.

-Nick
i-Club Imprezident
(that means I own and run it... and was just kidding about the SUCKS comment)

Thanks for the info Nick.

That settles it, I'm getting a WRX next month. I just can't wait any longer...

The reason I can't wait for the STi? Because once the STi gets sent to North America, its parts will become available!

My buddy is a DSM guy, and the New England community is amazing. So much so, that they have their own web site and forum. If the Subbie New England guys are close to that, then the regional section of i-club.com will be perfect.

We've got plenty of empeg install experience too! I seriously LOVE driving my WRX. Every single day I enjoy it. I actually look FORWARD to my 45 min commute to work each day and am bummed out if I have to take my wife's Jeep Grand Cherokee anywhere. I wish I coulud say that for my Focus! (which I like too, but not as much)

GPB 6000 (US ~9000) for insurance is obscene, are you talking about an export WRX or a grey-market Asian import? Is there such a thing as "Non-Primary Auto" insurance in the UK?

Last year in Germany with a 325 I paid about DM 2400/yr for maximum coverage and no deductible. Back in Florida now with my M3 it's about US 3000/yr, and I would expect to pay a few hundred less on a WRX. I'm 24, and my record had been clean (expunged anyhow) until I accidentally used I-95 instead of the Turnpike a few months before my six-month renewal

WRT US variances... Five years ago my insurance agent told me that New Jersey had the highest rates and Florida was third (I'd just moved back to the latter from the former). Localized variances are where it gets really weird, at the time Buck's County, PA had the highest rates. There was a big problem with people registering their cars in NJ to get a cheaper rate!

In Michigan at least, turning 25 means a significant drop in rates.

My present policy expires just on the other side of my 25th birthday

My married friends tell me that they also got a rate reduction, very hefty for the under-25 crowd. It doesn't strike me as particularly cost-effective tho...

I guess I luck out cuz I'm married, 26 and have my house insured by the same company.... it doesn't help that people are watching Fast & the Furious, Grand Turismo3 and the WRC racing coverage and crashing their WRX's left and right.... seriously, the number of these things crashing is amazing. People think that AWD is more miracle invention. All on the all weather tires too. No wonder rates are going up. Check i-club.com for more info.

So, get one. Love it. But know your limits. But a WRX with an empeg - few things are sweeter! (The DeLorean post in the Install gallery would be sweet too!)

Is there any solid news on whether or not the STi is really coming to the states or not? All I've seen is speculation at this point.

Mmmmm... 6 speed manual...

The WRX STi is one car that I might actually consider as an upgrade from my car. The current WRX is faster than my RS, but the RS handles better, and has more low end torque, so it's more of a preference thing. The STi however, should be able to best my car in almost all areas... Hmmmm...

WRX STi with DMS suspension... Now that does sound tasty...

I discovered very quickly in a borrowed Impreza that AWD doesn't help much when all four wheels are on ice. It was entertaining for me and my passenger (not the owner). Fortunately we weren't in any danger, the worst that could have happened was bumping a parked Deutsche Post truck at < 10km/h.

Young people will always wreck cars thru stupidity or simple lack of skill / experience. Performance vehicles such as the WRX suffer from affordability. I strongly believe that the US needs (better) driver education, and that vehicles exceeding average passenger-car weight or performance should require additional training and licensing. Any parent that hands their freshly-licensed kid the keys to an SUV or performance car ought to be held criminally negligent.

Uhhh, pardon the rant...

-Bryce

Is there any solid news on whether or not the STi is really coming to the states or not?

An exerpt from this Motor Trend Online page

"2004 Subaru Impreza WRX STi: The Impreza WRX has been a smashing success, bringing first-time Subaru shoppers into the showroom and establishing a true performance image in America. A watered-down version of the home-market WRX, the 227-horse model will be joined by its WRX STi big brother. The Subaru Technica International model promises 260 horsepower, firmer suspension, front and rear limited-slip differentials, six-speed manual transmission, and larger Brembo brakes. "

Sweeeeet...

Wow, you gotta wait till 2004 to get an STi? Come to new zealand and get one now

We're also the only country outside Japan to get Legacy RSK-B4 sedans and GTB wagons

And no import duty.

And cheap insurance.

And lots of roads where AWD is a real advantage.



With regards to WRX or WRX STi, as i understand it the main difference is the STi has a different badge on the outside, reinforced pistons, and a tweaked engine management settings to up the power from 160Kw to 205Kw. You can easily do the badge and management system yourself on a regular WRX, and replace the pistons if you need to or when the STi parts become available from the subaru dealer. The 206 Kw is also a voluntary limitation the japanese manufacturers place on their cars. With your own management chip you can go above that.

According to http://www.imprezawrxsti.com/engine.htm:

The STi engine is different from the engine that the US WRX receives in that it has a larger IHI built turbo unit, a larger intercooler with water spray, and Subaru AVCS.  Automatic Valve Control System, or AVCS for short, helps give the STi more torque and horsepower throughout the entire powerband.  It is Subaru’s version of Honda’s VTEC or Toyota’s VVTL-I, for example.  Also different is that the STi is a semi-closed deck block, which helps ensure reliability when running more boost from the larger turbo.  The STi engine also includes sodium-filled valves and other internal changes (i.e. forged internals) to make the engine more reliable at the higher boost levels.  Also, the intercooler has a pink STi logo on it, and the intake manifold is painted a pinkish-red, so that every time you open the hood you are reminded you are driving something very special.

Yup, that sounds like the standard STi engine the imprezzas and legacy's get here. (cept the legacy with tiptronic transmision option gets tuned down to 195Kw)

if you don't mind risking your warranty to upgrade get the regular. If you are the type of person that needs to know they are covered by warranty get the sti..

they are both great cars.. also, you can get sweet deals on WRX's now , at least in AZ you can.. i think the best price i got was 23,500 OTD. i think that was a dealer in a small place called prescott.

I heard that Japanese automakers get in some trouble if their cars are more than 260hp or so. Because of this, many of their cars ARE over 260hp, but they rate them lower in advertising. This has been rumored for the Mitsu EVO-VII. Has anyone heard if the STi numbers are also higher in real life?

Why is the UK WRX lower in hp than the rest of the world? To make room for the UK300?

There is a gentleman's agreement in Japan that no car to be sold in Japan can have more that 276 hp

I've never heard that the STi numbers are higher in real life for factory spec. But i have heard that the only thing stopping the engines deliverying more power is the voluntary limit. With a 3rd party engine management chip you can get the engine to output more power.

In australia you can get a 2.2 litre STi imprezza, but it still only puts out 206Kw in factory configuration.

Fatty!!!

Because modifications on a Subaru do NOT come cheap.

Too bad this might party be due to i-club.com price fixing or whatever it is called.. I mean the WRX isn't THAT low volume. They are sold all over the world, have been for years.

Sorry, just ranting. Feel a little cheated.

In reply to:

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Too bad this might party be due to i-club.com price fixing or whatever it is called.. I mean the WRX isn't THAT low volume. They are sold all over the world, have been for years.

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No, but thanks... sorry if we don't cater to vendors that might possible be selling stolen, or cheap imitation, goods on our site. We however do not price fix.

And although there were suppose to be 15K WRXs brought to the states this year, that ended up being the total production of all imprezas sent to the states, not just the WRX... so that's the 2.5RS, 2.5TS, WRX Sedan, and WRX Wagon. Although they do share most of their parts. Most people do not modify the cars (read: little old gray haired grandmothers that want a safe reliable car), so production on aftermarket parts is still much much lower than on a normal production car like a Honda like I originally stated. You are also ignoring the fact that this is the GDA, or New Age, impreza which is a brand new body style. It was only introduced in Europe and Japan one year before it was introduced here in the states for MY02 . So although parts have existed for other GC8 and prior models for years, a good deal of the parts will not fit the new GDA application.

Sorry you think we price fix... but you might want to do more research next time, before making comments like that.

-Nick

Nick, I was refering to this thread on the I-Club. The vendor in question wasn't accused of selling fake or stolen goods. He was just accused of offering lower prices than some sponsors. I thank you guys for doing your best to weed out frauds, but this instance seemed more like the sponsors were dictating the content and policies of your site. It also seems to be Alex's battle at the moment (is the site co-owned? I'm confused. ) Most of his posts seemed to be concerning how he should protect his vendor who are former members. There was little mention of ever protecting or helping the "non-vendor" members. We are feeling a bit left in the dust. But Alex does seem to be doing a better job of clarifying the situation.

I am aware the new-age Impreza is a whole new car, but thought it was on sale in Europe and Asia for 2 years prior - not one. Thank you for clarifying.

This isn't really the forum for this, I'm sorry I bought it up. You shouldn't have to answer i-club.com questions while surfing the rest of the web. I appologize and next time I save it for the right web site!

Brad,
No hard feelings... it's one of those touchy situations... nobody knows this guys real intent... and we've been doing this long enough that we know when something sounds that 'too good to be true' it generally is.

And Yes, Alex and I co-own the club.

-Nick