#149947 - 23/03/2003 23:45
The Oscars
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12341
Loc: Sterling, VA
|
Sorry, I had to post about it.
Overall the Oscars were what I thought they would be. Horribly boring, drawn out, full of people who don't seem to even want to be there, and simply a large celebration of the movies with the largest box office takes of the 12 month of the year. A few things (and ONLY a few things) pleased me, though:
1) Steve Martin was the only reason for watching, as he is always one of the funniest people on the planet
2) The best original screenplay category was devoid of blockbusters and fan-favorites, meaning people had to actually think about what they were voting for. I hope to see "Talk to Her" very soon.
3) I applaud Michael Moore for saying what he did. I happen to agree with him, but that wasn't the point. I found two things funny about the crowd reaction. For one, other presenters and winners had some of the same basic sentiments, they just didn't say it as bluntly as he did. They were more diplomatic. Second, I found it quite funny how Moore received a well-deserved standing ovation for his Oscar win for "Bowling for Columbine," one of few for the night. The change in crowd reaction after his speech was very humorous.
All that said, it was overall the dull evening I expected. Chicago won a lot, the presenters were bored out of their minds, and Jack Nicholson smiled from the front row. Same old same old. Or, to paraphrase Dreamcatcher, same shit, different year.
_________________________
Matt
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149948 - 24/03/2003 00:40
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Dignan]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Moore is an idiot. He'll have to pry my guns from cold dead hands.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149949 - 24/03/2003 04:27
Re: The Oscars
[Re: ]
|
Pooh-Bah
Registered: 21/07/1999
Posts: 1765
Loc: Brisbane, Queensland, Australi...
|
as you wish
_________________________
--
Murray
I What part of 'no' don't you understand?
Is it the 'N', or the 'Zero'?
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149950 - 24/03/2003 06:57
Re: The Oscars
[Re: muzza]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Bring it. I guess when the anti-gun people disarm america they're gonna use sticks? Or are they gonna use guns too?
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149951 - 24/03/2003 07:46
Re: The Oscars
[Re: ]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
|
Well, nukes would work, for instance, and they're not guns. But cops will still be allowed to have guns, and they'll be the ones disarming you 
I don't think Moore's point was that disarmament is needed. I think Moore's point is that something is wrong with this country that's causing us to have problems when other countries with a similar or higher level of gun ownership don't.
I for instance think owning guns should stay legal, but I wouldn't cry if you had to undergo actual education in the handling of a firearm to get one. Many (not all or even necessarily most) NRA members have this knee-jerk reaction whenever such is suggested. On the flip side, that group doesn't seem to be interested in trying to solve any problems, either. As long as they've got theirs, they're ok.
In the interest of full disclosure, I own no guns, but have considered (and continue to) getting one, on and off.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149952 - 24/03/2003 08:07
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Daria]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
People should know how to use a firearm before using one, but I don't think it should be a mandatory requirement, and I'll tell you why. Arming yourself is not a privledge, but it is a right that you are born with, at least according to our ancestors who founded this country. Secondly, many people who fight for gun restrictions don't plan on stopping at that one "reasonable" restriction. Their ultimate goal is take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens completely. It's a clever plan to shoot for progressively more and more restrictive laws every few years until their goal is met. That's why I think you get the knee-jerk reaction, because these people want to defend that right and will fight anything the anti-gun activists bring to the table.
What kind of gun have you considered getting? I have an Olympic Arms rifle on order.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149953 - 24/03/2003 08:19
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Dignan]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
I applaud Michael Moore I never watch the Oscars, because I think they're the epitome of narcissism and pretentiousness in America... and boy is that saying a lot!
However, I did see the clip of Michael Moore's comments on the news, and I think they're absurd. He weakned his entire argument with the "ficticious President" thing. Come on, folks, the election was years ago. This whole sour grapes over the election makes any argument you might have look completely ridiculous. Yes, the election was divisive, yes, the popular vote and the electoral vote didn't match up. But it's 2003 now. Let's try to focus on problems that are still within our control, okay? Don't we have enough of those?
You know you're a real dope when you make an anti-war speech at the Oscars and get heckled.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149954 - 24/03/2003 08:29
Re: The Oscars
[Re: ]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
|
. . . many people who fight for gun restrictions don't plan on stopping at that one "reasonable" restriction. Their ultimate goal is take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens completely.
I am not by any stretch of the imagination in favor of gun control, but saying "I won't yield on my extreme position because the other side is too extreme in their position" is terrible logic. Yes, the founders of our country believed we should all have the right to own guns, but that says nothing about how we should prepare people for that ownership. I see no reason that people shouldn't have undergo training before being allowed to own a gun. It makes good sense and is in every way constitutional.
_________________________
-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149955 - 24/03/2003 08:32
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
|
He weakned his entire argument with the "ficticious President" thing. Come on, folks, the election was years ago. This whole sour grapes over the election makes any argument you might have look completely ridiculous.
Well said.
_________________________
-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149956 - 24/03/2003 09:35
Re: The Oscars
[Re: JeffS]
|
addict
Registered: 20/11/2001
Posts: 455
Loc: Texas
|
I didn't watch the Oscars and couldn't care less about them... but didn't this Michael Moore guy get booed off the stage? I have seen some interesting links on the educational background of these celebrities who are so loudly protesting the war. If you Google on some variation of the above, you'll see the point.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149957 - 24/03/2003 09:41
Re: The Oscars
[Re: blitz]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
To save us all the trouble of googling, and since you weren't very specific about what to google for... care to elaborate? I'm all for anything which puts these Hollywood types in their place.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149958 - 24/03/2003 09:52
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
addict
Registered: 20/11/2001
Posts: 455
Loc: Texas
|
Barbra Streisand : Completed high school Career: Singing and acting
Cher: Dropped out of school in 9th grade. Career: Singing and acting
Martin Sheen: Flunked exam to enter University of Dayton. Career: Acting
Jessica Lange: Dropped out college mid-freshman year. Career: Acting
Alec Baldwin: Dropped out of George Washington U. after scandal. Career: Acting
Julia Roberts: Completed high school. Career: Acting
Sean Penn: Completed High school. Career: Acting
Susan Sarandon: Degree in Drama from Catholic University of America in Washington, D.C. Career: Acting
Ed Asner; Completed High school. Career: Acting
George Clooney: Dropped out of University of Kentucky. Career: Acting
Michael Moore: Dropped out first year University of Michigan. Career: Movie Director
Sarah Jessica Parker: Completed High School. Career: Acting
Jennifer Anniston: Completed High School. Career: Acting
Mike Farrell: Completed High school. Career: Acting
Janeane Garofelo: Dropped out of College. Career: Stand up comedienne
Larry Hagman: Attended Bard College for one year. Career: Acting
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149959 - 24/03/2003 09:55
Re: The Oscars
[Re: blitz]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
Hmm, maybe I'm lost here... Is it your point that people who haven't completed college shouldn't be allowed to protest a war?
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149960 - 24/03/2003 09:58
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
|
Or that people who haven't completed college aren't intelligent?
_________________________
Bitt Faulk
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149961 - 24/03/2003 10:01
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
addict
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 443
Loc: Raleigh, NC
|
I don't know about everyone else, but I wouldn't take acting advice from someone who got a 1 or 2 year degree in International Politics..
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149962 - 24/03/2003 10:12
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Yang]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
|
If the point here is that actors/ actresses shouldn’t be our moral & political guides, I think that goes without saying. Truth is, though, people listen because they’re in the spotlight and there isn’t much we can do about it. Of course, I don’t really think politicians should be our moral & political guides either . . .
_________________________
-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149963 - 24/03/2003 10:19
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
addict
Registered: 20/11/2001
Posts: 455
Loc: Texas
|
Is it your point that people who haven't completed college shouldn't be allowed to protest a war?
To specifically answer your question... I believe they have the right to say anything they want.
There is no point per se... I thought it was somewhat interesting when I heard it in the context of these celebrities coming under increasing scrutiny as to the relevance of their views.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149964 - 24/03/2003 11:03
Re: The Oscars
[Re: JeffS]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
there isn’t much we can do about it. Sure there is. Vote with your remote control.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149965 - 24/03/2003 11:20
Re: The Oscars
[Re: JeffS]
|
old hand
Registered: 28/01/2002
Posts: 970
Loc: Manassas VA
|
I completely agree with you, I'm all for the right to bear arms... but a friend of mine recently got his concealed carry license here in VA... You'd be surprised by the questions, very little had to do with gun safety, mostly stupid questions like "are you a terrorist" "do you have mental illness" "are you a felon" etc. So basically all you have to do is answer a few stupid questions, I think there is a 2 hour class envolved, but the class is only required if you want to be able to carry your gun around with you, and the class from what I gathered from him, is tought on a 3rd grade level (for lack of better words). I feel this is just more then a little silly.
I have a cousin who's a cop, he used to work a ghetto type area. He said the majority of gunshot wounds he saw "in the field" were to the lower abdomen and mostly the legs. Aparently no body tought the "gangsta thugs" in the area in which he worked the proper way to hold the gun, straight and not pointed downward and sideways...  If your gonna bust a cap in someones ass, at least learn the proper way, and make sure to keep the safety on until busting said cap...
Seriously I do think there needs to be a little more envolved then filing at the gun store and taking it home.
_________________________
Brett
60Gb MK2a with Led's
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149966 - 24/03/2003 11:24
Re: The Oscars
[Re: lopan]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
|
the majority of gunshot wounds he saw "in the field" where to the lower abdomen and mostly the legs
If your gonna bust a cap in someones ass, at least learn the proper way Sounds like they were pretty close to the ass. Maybe they just need more practice. 
_________________________
Bitt Faulk
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149967 - 24/03/2003 11:29
Re: The Oscars
[Re: wfaulk]
|
old hand
Registered: 28/01/2002
Posts: 970
Loc: Manassas VA
|
Maybe they just need more practice.
See I can't help but think if the gun was being held and aimed properly the ass capping would occur with less bullets.
_________________________
Brett
60Gb MK2a with Led's
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149968 - 24/03/2003 12:51
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Dignan]
|
old hand
Registered: 28/01/2002
Posts: 970
Loc: Manassas VA
|
I gotta say though I just downloaded that Michael Moore speech... I've been reading the posts here and have actually waivered on my views with our involvement in Iraq (mostly due to views such as yours and others, I respect you guys). But as far as Mr. Moores comments I have to tastefully disagree, theres nothing ficticious about the violations Iraq has and continues to perform. Geneva convention, scud missiles, chemical factories, using inocents as sheilds. Everytime I look at the news I'm sickened not by this war but by the way the Iraq is conducting themselves, and only solidifies my support for this campaign.
_________________________
Brett
60Gb MK2a with Led's
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149969 - 24/03/2003 13:25
Re: The Oscars
[Re: blitz]
|
old hand
Registered: 28/01/2002
Posts: 970
Loc: Manassas VA
|
I got a similar piece of spam in my inbox stating that Bush was much more intelligent then these people citing your example. Going through Bush's scholastic career (very propaganda like) talking him up and such.
Bottom line... Bush is not a smart fellow, Bush had a C average throughout college and was a cheerleader (not that theres anything wrong with that, just kinda funny) He drank his way through and started in the oil business because of family ties… He had no foreign affairs training before becoming president except the horrible example of his father.
_________________________
Brett
60Gb MK2a with Led's
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149970 - 24/03/2003 13:32
Re: The Oscars
[Re: lopan]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
Bottom line... Bush is not a smart fellow, Bush had a C average throughout college and was a cheerleader (not that theres anything wrong with that, just kinda funny) He drank his way through and started in the oil business because of family ties… He had no foreign affairs training before becoming president except the horrible example of his father. Nice... With the exception of being a cheerleader and having family ties to oil, it sounds like I'm qualified to be a world leader!
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149971 - 24/03/2003 13:34
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
old hand
Registered: 28/01/2002
Posts: 970
Loc: Manassas VA
|
You'd probably even be a better president.... Actually I should correct myself, his scholastic career does not reflect intelligence... many of us went through school with a C average, doesn't mean we're not intelligent... it's my personal opinion that he's not very smart, something to do with that dull blank stare.
_________________________
Brett
60Gb MK2a with Led's
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149972 - 24/03/2003 15:11
Re: The Oscars
[Re: lopan]
|
addict
Registered: 20/11/2001
Posts: 455
Loc: Texas
|
... citing your example...
I'll say one type intelligence that Bush has going for him that the aforementioned celebrities do not. Briefings.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149973 - 24/03/2003 15:49
Re: The Oscars
[Re: ]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
|
because these people want to defend that right and will fight anything the anti-gun activists bring to the table.
I stopped having tantrums when I was 4 or 5.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149974 - 24/03/2003 15:51
Re: The Oscars
[Re: ]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
|
What kind of gun have you considered getting? I have an Olympic Arms rifle on order.
I had considered a hunting rifle (but I have no desire to hunt.) I also considered a handgun, but I have no intention of getting a concealed carry permit.
I'm weird.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149975 - 24/03/2003 18:53
Re: The Oscars
[Re: JeffS]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
"I won't yield on my extreme position because the other side is too extreme in their position"
I don't think it's an extreme position. People have been learning to use guns on their own or from their fathers for hundreds of years. And now there is way more information available to the common person than ever before. As a general rule of thumb, I'm not interested in the government telling me what I can and cannot do with my own things, on my own land, on my own time. I guess I am a big believer in a government that governs least is the best government.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149976 - 24/03/2003 18:57
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Daria]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Well it can't hurt to get one. You could always resell it if you decide you don't want it.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149977 - 24/03/2003 19:37
Re: The Oscars
[Re: ]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
|
People have been learning to use guns on their own or from their fathers for hundreds of years. People have been learning to drive cars from their parents for nearly a hundred years now, yet there's still a test to make sure you can use it properly before taking it out on the road.
_________________________
Bitt Faulk
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149978 - 24/03/2003 21:44
Re: The Oscars
[Re: wfaulk]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Driving cars isn't mentioned in the Bill of Rights either.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149979 - 24/03/2003 22:02
Re: The Oscars
[Re: wfaulk]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Furthermore, a license is not required to drive a vehicle on your own private land.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149980 - 24/03/2003 22:03
Re: The Oscars
[Re: wfaulk]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Nor is a license required to purchase a vehicle.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149981 - 24/03/2003 23:01
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Dignan]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
Here's a good commentary on Michael Moore's outburst and why it was so stupid. Kinda makes the same point I did above, about how he immediately killed his whole message by bringing up the "sour grapes" of the election. Some other good points about celebrities and the war in there as well.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149982 - 24/03/2003 23:37
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12341
Loc: Sterling, VA
|
Look, I think he is (and you are) making a big deal about the election mention. That wasn't the point. His point was to exaggerate the lump sum of his grievances. I can see what the reviewer was getting at with most of his points, and I think he was on to something. However, I think you are mistaking the overall point of his article. His basic message, IMO, is that Moore should have been more diplomatic and middle-of-the-road about his speech. You know what I say? Screw that!
I'm tired of people trying to pander to the the greater population. Perhaps if people actually said what they wanted to more, the people of the country would have a better idea of where everyone stood. Instead, regardless of election results, we get a President who panders to the masses, then runs straight back to the right or the left. That is what pisses me off. I dislike moderates who are not actually moderates.
As for the diplomatic speeches, several actors said something about the war. Yes, it seemed kinda dumb. The only one I took seriously was Chris Cooper who said he felt silly for accepting an award while Americans are dying overseas. That's not anti- or pro-war, that's a commentary. The rest of the comments were extremely diplomatic attempts to not insult either side. You know what? Those are less productive than Moore's comments.
Anyway, I'm not sure why I'm arguing, because i sincerely doubt that anything these people say matters, but since your argument is based in the idea that it does matter, I felt like saying something about it.
Damnit, why am I not going to sleep. I'm still rambling...
_________________________
Matt
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149983 - 25/03/2003 01:21
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Dignan]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Dignan, I can honestly say that I completely agree with you. While I think Moore is an idiot and I don't agree with his ideas, I still give the guy credit for having balls.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149984 - 25/03/2003 07:51
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Dignan]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
His basic message, IMO, is that Moore should have been more diplomatic and middle-of-the-road about his speech. You know what I say? Screw that! Good, then he'll continue to have his message heard by the 1% of the population who shares his extremism, and the message will be lost on the rest, because of his poor delivery of that message. He could have gotten the same points across (save the sour grapes over the election, which is not in play anymore) using more diplomacy.
This country doesn't need the extreme left and right to become even more extreme. What it needs is for those closer to the middle to become more informed and more active.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149985 - 25/03/2003 07:52
Re: The Oscars
[Re: ]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
Dignan, I can honestly say that I completely agree with you. Nice. I rest my case.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149986 - 25/03/2003 08:55
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
At least he says what he really thinks.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149987 - 25/03/2003 10:19
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12341
Loc: Sterling, VA
|
This country doesn't need the extreme left and right to become even more extreme I never said that. I said that all the moderates who are simply disquising themselves are what is wrong here. Yeah, Moore was pretty far to the left that night. Great! My point was that the only way you can appeal to anyone to the right is to disguise your tendancy to the left, and what does that solve?
I can hope that out of his comments, people who were undecided might actually take a stance, either way.
To sum up, I disagree.
_________________________
Matt
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149988 - 25/03/2003 10:41
Re: The Oscars
[Re: Dignan]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
|
the only way you can appeal to anyone to the right is to disguise your tendancy to the left, and what does that solve? I don't think you need to disguise your tendancies to appeal to the other side. You catch more flies with honey. Moore probably has some good points that could be substantiated with sound logic, but when he presents it the way he did on Oscar night, he loses his audience. At some point, the far right would tune him out no matter what he said, but by relying on emotional appeals rather than logic, he's losing any portion of the audience that would listen. If he could have expressed those exact same reservations about the war in a more logical and palatable manner, he might have actually influenced someone to look at their own views in a slightly different light.
Or, in other words, I don't think anyone with views on the extreme left or right needs to express those views in such an extreme manner that nobody will listen to them except their small, captive audience of fellow extremists. But I do appreciate the role of voices on the poles of the political spectrum... I just think they're wasting their time if they're not doing their best to bring about change in the middle of the spectrum.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#149989 - 25/03/2003 12:30
Re: The Oscars
[Re: tonyc]
|
carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12341
Loc: Sterling, VA
|
Well, I can see your point.
I think the problem is that diplomatic wasn't the word I'm looking for, but it is what you were saying is necessary, or as Dictionary.com says, "tact and sensitivity in dealing with others." I suppose I can agree with that.
One thing I'll say for it, it has gotten a lot of people talking, and like I said, hopefully it will make more people think about their own stance.
By the way, I've always liked vinegar more than honey. Mmmmm, boardwalk fries...
_________________________
Matt
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
Previous Topic
Index