A few years back, I was alid off from a fairly well-paying job, making something like $75,000/yr. I was then unemployed for over a year, and when I finally found a new job, it was for much less than I'd been making. Namely, $18/hr. But the contract was for six months and I figured I could tough it out for that long (despite the fact that it was about the same money I was getting from the state in unemployment insurance). My six months came up and my contracting agency told me that it was actually for a year, so I wouldn't be getting a raise then, since their contract was for a year. I kicked up a stink and managed to finagle $20/hr out of them. But that's okay, as when that additional six months was up, I'd get a bigger raise. It's still better than being unemployed, after all.

So now that six months is up and they told me that I'd be getting $26.50 an hour. Which is not very much for an experienced Unix admin. I was not happy about it, but it was something. Really, it was a 30% raise, so it was hard to complain.

But then they called me back yesterday and told me that they'd made a mistake, that the company contracting me gave them a sum of money and she'd based my salary on that, but that the company wanted to give me a 15% raise, so she had to take back some of that raise, and now I'd be making $25/hr.

Now, I'm not expecting that I'll be able to make $75k after such an economic downturn, but now they're obviously screwing me -- they were okay with giving me $26.50/hr, but they changed their minds, meaning that they're now getting the same money but giving me less of it. In addition, a guy that they hired six weeks ago that's also a Unix admin, and one not nearly as experienced as I am, is making $35/hr. Keep in mind that until they hired him, I was their only Unix admin, and if I left, they'd be out in the cold. No one here even understood Unix at all, so it was nearly impossible to document things.

What do you guys think I should do? My at-work manager seems to be friendly and has told me stuff before that, at least, implies that he'd like to help me with this stuff.

I'm not even sure what I'm asking. I may just be venting, as, right now, I'm on the verge of furious.

So, anyway, any advice?

Tell them it's not worth your while to work for that amount, and that you'll have to quit as soon as you find a new job.

The problem with that tack is that finding a new job might well take me over a year, just like it did last time. The job market here is poor and I still don't have the money to move. And they're likely to know that I'll have a hard time finding a job.

At the same time, I'm considering just being unemployed again. It's like a slap in the face.

I have no advice, but I can tell you I'd be really steamed in your position. Especially the part about being paid less simply because of when you got hired. Is there any way to transition to working for the company rather than the agency?

There's more to it than simply when I got hired. And it rolls back to the contracting agency being incompetent again. Honestly, I don't understand it fully, otherwise I'd tell you about it.

The job is actually with the State of North Carolina's Department of Transportation. Virtually all of the IT people are contractors because the state's pay scales are prehistoric. In order to pay a reasonable wage to IT people, they'd have to be listed as managers, and, apparently, people with manager in their job descriptions really have to be managers. Of course, that doesn't really apply to me, since I'm not making a reasonable wage.

Again, though, I'm not blind to the fact that I am employed and that I did get a 30% raise, even if it was then amended to 25%. It's just that it's still not commensurate with what I think I ought to be getting paid.

The problem with that tack is that finding a new job might well take me over a year, just like it did last time.

Even still, I would start to search actively for a new job, AND I would wouldn't keep it a secret from my current employers. You could let it "slip" in conversations you have with your boss, so that he knows you aren't joking. If he truely values you, he'll give you the raise you deserve. If he doesn't, you can quit if/when you find a new job.
I doubt that your boss would fire you over this, seeing it's unlikely he'll find somebody else who will do your work for a less or equal amount of money. (like you said, you're underpaid as a Unix admin)

Is there another contractor who works with the state? Maybe you can change your agency but keep your job?

Ever consider relocating? Seriously.... I'm in Northern VA and while the job market here is still tough... Unix admins... good ones are hard to come by....

Okay, here's the story with respect to why I got paid next to nothing to begin with.

Apparently, the state has these job categories for contractors. Once a year (or something like that), contracting agencies are asked to bid on those categories. This allows them to supply contractors to the state. It does not allow them to have exclusive contracts, though. Basically, it just means that the agencies are then locked into the range that they bid for each category.

Problem one is that the categories are undescriptive and incomplete. For example, my job as a Unix sysadmin was listed as ``Desktop Support''. And, to be honest, it may be the best category for it.

Problem two is that my contracting agency way underbid each of those categories. For example, most of the chuckleheads who work here work for Keane. And these guys are often real chuckleheads. Their bid range for ``Desktop Support'' is $50-$150/hr. (This is how much the company gets paid; contractors get paid a portion of that.) My company, Sapphire, bid $30-$38/hr for the same category.

In deference to me, the state moved my job to a new category, LAN/WAN support, which is at $48-$60/hr, still not in the same category as the goobers around here, but closer.

You can look at all this information at the state's Supplemental Staffing Convenience Contract Instructions, including the bid rates.

At the same time, when I was hired, there was one other person they were considering, and he was apparently being bid a lot higher, and that may be the reason I have the job at all.

Is there another contractor who works with the state? Maybe you can change your agency but keep your job?

Part of my contract is that I can't work for the same employer directly after leaving the contracting agency without paying them some absurd amount of money. Even so, I've been considering it.

Even still, I would start to search actively for a new job, AND I would wouldn't keep it a secret from my current employers.

That's my current plan for this afternoon.

Ever consider relocating? Seriously.

Yes and no. I don't think that I've got the money to do it, and to be perfectly honest, I don't want to move at all, much less to NoVA.

Also, while I think I'm close to the top of the barrel down here (based on my experience working with others), I know I'm not elsewhere (based on my experience conversing online and at LISA), especially NoVA, where there's bound to be a glut anyway. Maybe not.

I'll consider it, I suppose. I just feel like I ought to be able to get more money out of my current employer, especially since I know other folks are making what seems to be a reasonable amount.

That goes without saying... the kind of money they are paying you is insulting for a Unix Admin.... Then again I'm not down with the job scene in NC.

As for being Top of the barrell... we have a unix admin here making probably 80 or 90k that well to be blunt, is a frickin moron I can't begin to explain the idiocy this lady brings to the plate in our weekly MIS meetings... So I'm sure your probably more equiped, and have more talent then 90 percent of the people occupying unix positions in this area.

Plus, there may be more people trying to fill positions, but there may also be more positions to fill. Then again, I know nothing about the NC situation.

Hell, some company should hire you to teach their employees proper grammar. I'm sure a lot of them need that

Wow.. You think YOU'RE getting screwed?

I'm working as a *nix admin *and* a DBA, and only making $42k/year. (~$20/hr) And that's after I raise I got last week. I REALLY need to find a better job.. Sheesh..

But, hey. I was able to afford my Mini and an Empeg. THat's all I care 'bout!

Me.

Well, that's about how much I'm making now, was making less than that six months ago, and all of that time, my only benefit was being provided with a way to get health insurance, not that they're paying for any portion of it.

Working as a full time programmer/*nix admin with a CS degree for ~35k/yr and I don't even get insurance coverage for my wife.

But, I like what I do, so it doesn't bother me that much.

Well I'm making a decent living as a programmer here, but for the last four months I've been surfing the web, making overlong posts, and generally trying look busy. There simply hasn't been any work for me to do, but my company doesn't want to pull me from my current contract so I had to just wait for some work to come along. Finally I got fed up (nothing longer than a day of doing nothing), posted my resume on Monster and "leaked" this information to my immediate supervisor. Surprise, surprise, he found some work for me to do and now I'm up to my elbows in jsp development and happy as a clam. So the "leaking intent to find another job" does work, though for me it was more work, not more money.

I detest Sapphire as a contracting agency - they only seem to care about their cut. They play the numbers game, throwing loads of resumes at a position in the hope that one sticks, without paying much regard to matching the resume to the position. As a result, whoever's doing the hiring has to read a bunch of crap. The final straw for me came after a couple of hours weeding through a stack of predominately useless resumes, only to then find a candidate with an identical job history to one of the first resumes. Copy'n'paste identical over several years. At that point I told my boss that I wasn't going to read another Sapphire-supplied resume as I couldn't trust them.
For a company of their size and history, they have no excuse for this behaviour. If _they_ made a mistake then _they_ should eat it, not force you to. Face it, that $1.50/hr is nothing compared to their revenue, and they can easily absorb it.
Furthermore, the company offered you $26.50/hr that you accepted. They have _no_ legal right to refuse you that now. Admittedly if it wasn't ever put in writing then you'd have a hard time proving it, and it possibly wouldn't be economical to go the legal route anyway.
Two possible strategies that I can think of;

1) Hardball. Suggest to Sapphire that a disgruntled representative might make it harder for them to get that work in the future. You'd have to be careful not to go over the line here.

or,
2) Refuse to accept the $25/hr rate (I assume you haven't so far). Keep going to work as usual, and then dispute (in writing) the paychecks. Hopefully you'll eventually get something in writing from them that acknowledges that they have adjusted (post-offer) your rate downwards. Keep working for 6 months or so whilst looking for a different job with another agency (or independant). Once you've changed jobs, take that stack of correspondance to the small claims court and sue them for breach of contract. (26 weeks of $1.50/hour sums to $1560).

Well, the thing is, I wasn't happy about the $26.50 to start with. I'm going to go talk to my manager this afternoon and find out what's going on. I almost expect him to tell me that they intended for me to be getting $35/hr and they're holding out on me.

That's a tough situation. It doesn't sound like you are willing to quit and it sounds like the contracting agency knows that or doesn't care if you do. That leaves you personally with little leverage.

The person who does have leverage is person who makes hiring decisions. But this isn't a definite either. Being that it's the govt I imagine they have approved vendor lists and can only use those contracting agencies. If your agency isn't the only one on that list and your boss is willing to go to bat for you then you have leverage. The agency cares more about their relationship with your boss then they do about you.

If your boss won't exert pressure then I think your only recourse is to accept the money and look for a new job while keeping your current one.

-Dylan

So this is where all our tax dollars go.

So this is where all our tax dollars go.

Not all. I believe at least $70K is going to the guy playing solitare about 10 feet from me . . .

That would have angered me as well. I think you need to think it over for a few days. Something I have learned is to not make a life decision too quickly or when I'm pissed off. Pride is one thing that we all have in common. It is a good thing. It is however difficult to eat nor does it convert well at the grocery store. You need to think it through and then make your decision on what you think is best for you and yours for the long haul. These are tough decisions and can only be made for you, by you. After reading your posts for the last couple of years I expect you will make a decision based on fact rather then emotion.

I expect you will make a decision based on fact rather then emotion.

I think you may have missed some of my posts.

Seriously, I talked to my manager when he (finally) came in today, and he was flummoxed at the raise I got. It turns out that there's a standard maximum 15% raise for state contractors. Now, I'd talked with my manager before and he agreed that I was making almost nothing, so he went out of his way to reclassify my job.

Somehow, his boss forgot the objective of all of that and limited me to that 15% raise. Once my manager got a hold of him again, he agreed that that was not right and called back the contracting agency and told them (and me, too) that they should resubmit me at a ``fair'' rate.

Now, though, I'm having the problem of coming up with what's a ``fair'' rate. I've not been making one for a while and the last time I did have one, it was before the dot-bomb exploded. So I'm having to take my agency's word for it. They're going to resubmit me so that I'll be making about $30/hr. Not as much as I'd like, but wildly more appropriate, I think. But I won't know if the State considers that fair until at least tomorrow. It's possible that it might even be more than that.

So, to make a long story short (chime in here), it looks like it was a big bureaucratic snafu that might well be fixed very soon. (And I know what you're thinking -- ``A bureaucratic snafu? In State Government? Never!'' All I can do is assure you that that's actually the case. )

... he was fummoxed at the raise I got.

You mean flummoxed? I think that's only the 3rd time I've ever heard someone use that word.

Oops. Yeah. Fixed.

I'm glad it seems (hoping, fingers crossed)to be working out well. By the way, what is the emoticon for flummoxed?

-Zeke

But, I like what I do, so it doesn't bother me that much.


Exactly!

Once you have enough money for the necessities (food, shelter, transportation, etc.) additional money is far less important than job satisfaction.

I enjoy my job so much that I haven't taken a vacation in years. If I won the lottery, the first thing I would do is tell my employer to change my salary to $1.00 per year so it would be really difficult for them to ever get rid of me.

I wouldn't trade my position for Bill Gates' job for all the money in the world (which, I guess, it would pretty nearly be.)

I measure success not by salary, but by the standard of "Success is never having to do anything you don't want to do." I'm certainly not wealthy, but I am rich beyond the power of money.

tanstaafl.

Doug, that was inspiring. We should all hope for a job like that, or at least I do.

I've sent out a few applications this week, and I'm hoping to find something soon. It's a new experience for me, but certainly for now I hope to at least make enough money to live my current lifestyle, which is pretty much rent/food/clothes, with maybe one semi-large purchase a year and a few DVDs here and there

Here's hoping...

Hehe, I work for the government too, and believe me, I only wish I could make $30 an hour. I'm currently around $22.5. That being said, I'm also the highest paid non-director level position at my location, so that's 15 people being paid more than me, and ~600 being paid less, and some significantly less. On the other hand, I have a 35 hour work week, 13 days vacation (until next year, then it jumps to 19), When I go home, I'm home. If I work more than 40 in a week, I get overtime. I've gotten a raise every year I've been there, we have a phenomenal retirement system, full medical, dental, vision, etc. There are LOTS of more important things than just plain salary. My wife can retire in 3 years if she wants to. She won't, but she could. My department has 3 people in it. Me, my wife, and the new guy. The nice thing about that last bit is that they'd be in a world of hurt if they got rid of me, and they all know it. I have exclusive knowledge of too many site-specific systems that nobody else ever touches. Not that they couldn't train somebody, but it would be a painful transition for them. Actually, the new guy/girl would just have to figure it out as he/she went along since there would be nobody left to train them. Our newest employee has been in the field for 5 months now, all at the city, and he knows just enough to be dangerous. The good thing is that everyone knows this. He currently can't handle much more than installing printers and new computers, and sometimes he can't even do that, so I'm pretty secure there. He gets to chase all the "my mouse quit working" calls while I am busy maintaining our servers and handling the more important/difficult (i.e. fun) calls.

In short, I like my job. I've been offered almost double by private firms, but I've been there, done that, and don't plan on doing it again. Oh, the other nice thing is, if I feel like calling in and telling them I won't be in till 1, it's no problem, as long as I have the comp time built up, and believe me, I do.

Yeah, it'd be one thing if I was a real government employee, but, as a contractor I get squat for benefits. Obviously no government pension (which I know is quite nice with the State, as my mom's a NC employee), I get paid hourly, which means no paid vacations, I don't get paid for holidays, the insurance I get is not paid for in any way, though I do get the lower rates involved in a group plan, etc., etc.

And as to Doug's comment, the first thing I'd do if I won the lottery is quit my job and never work again, regardless of how good my job is. I hate reporting to other people, I hate being on their schedule, and I've got enough stuff to do on my own that I'd never get bored. In other words, a bad day at home is still better than a good day at work.

Bitt, that's not right. I'm a lousy intern at my father's office, and I'm the same type of emplyee as you. Not to give an ego boost or anything, but you should be getting more than that. I'm a copier/mailer/data entry monkey, and you're a Unix admin. There seems to be something wrong there.

I don't get any of those perks either (no paid leave whatsoever), and I am also benefiting from the company health plan but only in a similar manner to yours.

I load boxes of crap in FedEx trucks during the early morning hours and only get paid $7.50 per hour. No benefits, but I do get to break all the fragile packages.



I laugh when I see "DO NOT DROP" stuck on some sucker's box. Does that mean it's ok if I throw it? My all-time favorite was: "An additional $5.00 fee has been paid on this package to ensure careful handling. Absolutely no conveyor belts!" And of course this box comes down the conveyor belt like every other box. The silly sheep don't realize that it's not the conveyor belts that are breaking their shit. HAHAHA

Surprisingly, I've gotten pretty good service out of FedEx. Nothing has been damaged at all.

It's DHL that I've had problems with. We sent a casing which was made out of 5mm steel and was very well packaged as well. Somehow they managed to bend and dent the casing without destroying the outer packaging. Luckily DHL paid up as it was insured. Even the guy that came out to check the damage for the insurance claim was impressed.

a bad day at home is still better than a good day at work.

Preach it brother.

There is something wrong. Working for the private sector will always pay better than the public sector. However, the other benefits usually outweigh the pay difference. Bitt, however, is getting screwed because he is doing work for the government, but he doesn't work for the government. So, he gets the crap pay without all the good benefits.

Bitt, that's not right. I'm a lousy intern at my father's office, and I'm the same type of emplyee as you. Not to give an ego boost or anything, but you should be getting more than that.

I second that. There's absolutely no logical reason you should be making less than college interns.

Maybe try some of the services like Monster.com?

The way the ecomony is anymore especially in the tech sector, be glad you have a job reguardless of what you make. I make $15 an hour which isn't great, but it's better than what I have made in the past trying to keep my house afloat. I have spent too many months out of work living on credit cards that I am just thankful to have a job. But i know what you mean about contract work, you pretty much get nothing and work hard for it and the places I have been will get rid of you if you make the least little mistake. They know there are plenty of people out there to take your place.

They know there are plenty of people out there to take your place.

It is truly unfortunate that employers take this view (and they do), because it simply isn't correct. Well not in the case of someone like Bitt anyway (unless I am completly underestimating his level of talent). The truth is that while there are a ton of people out there with the qualifications to do the work, there aren't a lot of people out there who are going to be as good at it. I am truly suprised how many programmers my company has hired that looked good on paper and have basically been useless to do real tasks. I once heard someone say that only 10% of any profession is any good at what they do. This may not quite be true, but the idea is. Turnover is very expensive for companies, so a smart company who finds a employee who knows what he or she is doing should do everything possible to hold on to that person. Unfortunatly it doesn't work out that way, which is very sad, both for the company and the talented, underpaid employee.

I'm not disagreeing with you, Laura. You are entirely correct, and it is a great thing to have a job in this market. I just get frustrated when a company doesn't pay what they should for an employee. It isn't good for the employee, and ultimatly it isn't good for the company either. Right nows probably not the best time to bail, but I'm certain Bitt will keep his options open and keep looking, and sooner or later he's bound to find something more worthwile than what he's doing.

Ok, rant's over.

Since someone else brought it back up....

try some of the services like Monster.com

I've had my resume on there and a couple of others since shortly after I got laid off over two years ago. In that time, I think I got one or two people contact me from them. It was mostly useful in coming up with the requisite two applications a week for my unemployment insurance.

Thanks for the reassurance that I'm not making enough.

The way the ecomony is anymore especially in the tech sector, be glad you have a job reguardless of what you make.

I am glad, and I'd be happy to be making what I am if I thought that I wasn't one of the more highly skilled and least paid people here. People answering phones at the help desk are making more money than I am. And they mostly reset passwords and enter problems in a ticketing system. They rarely solve problems. They're a lot like an answering service most of the time as far as I can figure. (I rarely if ever use that ticketing system, but I was sent down there to learn what they do for a week. Pure torture.)

They know there are plenty of people out there to take your place.

It is truly unfortunate that employers take this view (and they do), because it simply isn't correct. Well not in the case of someone like Bitt anyway (unless I am completly underestimating his level of talent).

Thanks!

While I think that I'm one of the more technically compentent Unix admins around (definitely not ``most'', though), my work ethic can leave a little something to be desired. Regardless, my work gets done and the end result is usually as correct as possible.

And to expand on

only 10% of any profession is any good

it amazes me the random incompetence of people around here. There's a new guy they hired who I think mostly understands Unix, even if he's not that ... agile ... with it, but I asked him to create an SSH key pair (if you don't know what it is, it doesn't matter). His workstation happens to be Windows (at least right now), and I suggested he use PuTTY. He didn't know how to use PuTTY's keygen utility, so I helped him out with it. When the time came to enter a passphrase, I was amazed at how slow he typed. I also noticed that he had difficulty figuring out how to press key chords (Ctrl-A, etc.). Since then, I've been paying attention to other folks, and they have similar problems. Some go so far as to have problems understanding the basics of graphical UIs. It's amazing the level of incompetence that exists.

The truth is that while there are a ton of people out there with the qualifications to do the work, there aren't a lot of people out there who are going to be as good at it. I am truly suprised how many programmers my company has hired that looked good on paper and have basically been useless to do real tasks. I once heard someone say that only 10% of any profession is any good at what they do. This may not quite be true, but the idea is.

Having just been through a recruiting exercise for a Windows developer I would say this is absolutely correct. The problem seems to be the number of people with lots of experience who genuinely believe they are experts in any given field, but in fact are not. It is very difficult to pick out the people who really are good, but one thing I've learned is not to take salary expectation as any indication of someone's true skill level.

Luckily we were able to find a good chap to take over from Roger next month.

Rob

Another followup, if anyone cares:

It's now five days until my current contract expires. I have yet to sign a new one. But things look like they're going well, if in a remarkably dilatory manner.

I told my contracting agency that I'd like to get resubmitted at about $30/hr, maybe a little more. (I have a friend who makes $65k/yr doing what I do, more or less, who has less experience, and that comes out to about $32.50/hr, plus he gets benefits.) They argued with me about that amount. They thought it was too high. They finally grdgingly submitted me at that rate.

Yesterday, my DOT manager showed me the applications for the position. (Apparently, the state is required to publically repost all expiring contracts, so everyone gets a chance to apply for it, but there's little chance they wouldn't rehire the same person.) My contracting agency submitted me at $50/hr (so they're making two-fifths of that). There were about ten applications. Most had a rate significantly higher than mine, anywhere from $60-$85/hr, as per my memory. There were two that submitted at $48/hr. So my application was still amongst the lowest. Which, I think, means I probably could have gotten a decent amount more. (Not that I'm complaining. I'm still now going to get paid a reasonable amount, I think.)

Of course, the state still hasn't accepted any of those applications. So, with less than a week to go, I still don't really know that I'll have a job when my contract expires. My manger talks like it's a done deal, but I'm paranoid about it.

I'm also considering telling my contracting agency that they still probably slightly underbid me. Of course, they always get angry when I imply that I know how much they're making off of me. Maybe I'll just tell them that my manager showed me the other applications, and tell them that I assume they and all the other agencies are making 75%-100% of what I'm making, and that means that most of the applications, even at the low employee-rate side of those percentages, would be making more than I will be.

But maybe I should just leave it alone.

40% is taking the piss. Even litigation-happy lawyers generally only take 33% of the gross.

Well, you mentioned before that Sapphire are money-grubbing bastards. I've found that they'd prefer to make something than nothing, but that seems to be about as far as they're willing to go to not screw me.

It really tipped me off when I was compaining about all of this and the phrases ``appreciate you as an employee'' and ``want to keep you happy'' kept popping up.

But are the other employees that you mention, contract workers or government workers. You have to take into account what they pay the agency for you, not what you make an hour. Most agencies make about 50% off contract employees, that's what keeps them in business. After doing contract work for 3 years, I am very bitter to-wards it and would rather flip burgers than go through an agency again. Also they had to pay the agency an upfront fee for your services.

I hope you get your higher hourly wages, I never meant to imply that you aren't worth it

90% of the other employees I'm talking about are also contract workers. The NC gov't seems to prefer contracting IT workers. I think it's because they can't begin to pay them enough without their pay grades being management-class.

They can't withdraw from an offer once made. Equally, you should be entitled to pay parity with co-workers from the same agency.

If this is the agency's style of personnel management, then I would suggest that you search for a new agency, sort out another job, and resign. Vote with your feet.

If you feel that the place you are actually working at is a good place to work, why don't you approach the boss informally and lay out your cards. Sound him out to see if he'd be willing to take you on full time, and pay off the agency. It's pointless to piss them off, especially if they are happy with the standard of your work. Try it, you might be surprised. But don't stay with an agency who does that to you.

They can't withdraw from an offer once made.

Which was almost equally as bad as the offer they retracted it for. So it's kinda pointless to play that card. I'm actually glad that they did retract it, as I guess, at least initially, I was inclined to take it in the ass rather than speak out about it. As it is, my raise went from 20% to 15% to 50%.

Vote with your feet.

1. I really don't want to pay them money.
2. I really don't want to deal with changing insurance companies
3. The final outcome was reasonable.

That being said, I fully agree with your sentiment, but I have little enough free time as it is, and I don't want to spend even more of it being petty. I will (and do), however, tell everyone I know not to use them.

I am considering sending them an email detailing the fact that I did the majority of their job and that I'm generally unhappy with them. My manager's manager came to me yesterday to verify that they gave me most of the raise he gave them. He said that he gave them a $12 raise, and they gave $10 of that to me. So that in itself is a good percentage, but they're still making 40% of the total. I might talk to him about that.

I do need to let them know that I'm, at best, unimpressed with their service.

Oh, and I was to have gotten my first higher paycheck yesterday, but they screwed it up and I got paid at my former rate. They say they'll make it up in next week's check, but we'll see.

When I was contracting I felt I was pretty good at playing the game and I could squeeze them down to about 20%. My experience was that 40% was a typical margin but they would be willing to go down to around 20% before they'd refused to give up any more. This was, however, in the mid/late 90's when the market was so hot and it didn't include any benefits.

-Dylan

A 40% agency margin is utterly unacceptable. Even at the worst margins I have faced it has never been more than 28% which is also outrageous. They should be taking no more than between 10 and 20% max depending on what they do for the money.

You should leave them. It's worth the hassle. They screw you once, it WILL happen again. I've been contracting for upwards of 16 years now and they never get better: all agencies try it on at some time or other.

Did you talk to the boss about taking you on?

Ignoring the 40% thing, I don't think they've done anything that can really be called ``screw'' (despite my use of the term in the subject). It's really more ``gross incompetence''.

I've not talked to my boss about taking me on, but it's not going to happen. Of the 17 people in my group, two are not contractors, both are senior in time, one in seniority (bad use of words; sorry), and I have it on good authority that they make amongst the least in the group.

I could conceivably go to a different contracting agency. I'll at least talk to them first and see what they'll do. That way, even if I do get rid of them, they'll at least know why, which is much better than just dropping them like a hot potato. (I suppose I'm technically into my new contract now, despite the fact that I haven't signed anything, something that could work to my advantage, conceivably.)

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I do get to break all the fragile packages.

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That was you that broke the display in one of the Empegs I shipped through FedEx wasn't it?! I know a certain BBS member that would love to meet up with you.

Stu