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#186169 - 23/10/2003 12:14 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: ithoughti]
RobotCaleb
pooh-bah

Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 1866
Loc: Austin
i did manage to place an order. but a friend didnt. i only ordered one. if it does go through and there are surplus to some people, id be interested in one

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#186170 - 23/10/2003 12:38 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: RobotCaleb]
mrfixit
enthusiast

Registered: 14/06/2002
Posts: 337
There is one thing that I was thinking about... some of the people that ordered 3 or more, what happens if dell just bills the correct amount to your account? Getting a bill for $1200.00 would not be nice.
_________________________
Ben
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 40gig blue no illumination....yet
hijacked

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#186171 - 23/10/2003 12:41 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: mrfixit]
JeffS
carpal tunnel

Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
what happens if dell just bills the correct amount to your account?
That, I believe, they cannot do. My credit card would just not accept the charges anyway (have a daily limit).
_________________________
-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.

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#186172 - 23/10/2003 14:29 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: JeffS]
loren
carpal tunnel

Registered: 23/08/2000
Posts: 3826
Loc: SLC, UT, USA
Yeah, they can't and won't do that. You have to authorize the amount they charge, and if they DID do that it would be suicidal... the backlash would be furious and loud i'm sure. But, that's irrelevant because i'm pretty sure that would be illegal.
_________________________
|| loren ||

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#186173 - 23/10/2003 14:59 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: mrfixit]
tman
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
Nah. It'd be illegal to do that. I think it's called bait & switch.

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#186174 - 23/10/2003 15:05 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: tman]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
Nah. Bait and switch is something else. It's when you claim that you have one thing to get people to come in and then tell them that you don't really have it and you should buy this instead. It's unethical, but not illegal, AFAIK. Well, maybe false advertising if you claimed you had something you didn't.
_________________________
Bitt Faulk

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#186175 - 23/10/2003 15:16 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: wfaulk]
tman
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
Ahh okay. I thought it was saying you could get something at so and so price but when you do come in, then you get charged something higher. Learn something new every day

Either way, Dell aren't going to charge the full price without checking with the customer. Imagine the outcry if they did

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#186176 - 23/10/2003 17:49 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: loren]
Diznario
enthusiast

Registered: 17/10/2001
Posts: 265
Loc: Portland OR
Speaking of people ordering 30+ units...

Have you guys looked on ebay recently?

There's quite a few 20gb Karmas on there. There's even one with a "Buy it now" for $275. Not too bad.

Looks to me like some people might actually be trying to sell 20gb Karmas, ASUMING they would be getting them from Dell for the supa cheap price.

I don't know exactly how all the laws work for online auctions, but I'm guesing that they are leagally binding. If that's true, and you were to get in there and buy one at a good price on ebay, the other party would need to caugh one up...

But then you'd prolly need to go to small claims court, blah blah blah. Might not be worth it, but I thought I'd mention it.
_________________________
Dario
MK2 in an Impreza 2.5RS

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#186177 - 24/10/2003 00:56 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: BleachLPB]
matthew_k
pooh-bah

Registered: 12/02/2002
Posts: 2298
Loc: Berkeley, California
Ah, gotta love it. This is from the Anandtech forum, justifying why Dell should ship these all out:

What exactly is the product... well its a 20 gig hard drive, well lets see, those go for about what, $10-30 now retail. It has a databus for the hard drive, which means a controler chip, it also has usb, which again is a control chip. Well just about ever motherboard manufacturer already has chips that are combo usb contollers and ide controller, and cost less then $2. You also have a processor chip to handle I/O requests and perform the MP3, etc. decoding ($5-10). You have a few capacitors and resistors (maybe, maybe $1-3 worth). You have your pcb for all the chips with traces for all the connections ($5). A header for the usb connector ($.10), a volume dial ($.05), a 1/16" headphone jack ($.50), a battery pack ($.40), a lcd screen? (not sure but only $5 if it has one), an external power adaptor ($1-4), and the plastic outside shell ($5). So, on the high side of the components you are only looking at ~$60-70 in parts, then figure another $10 in production costs, so figure $80 to produce.... hmmm... that sure looks VERY close to what we just bought it for....


Matthew

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#186178 - 24/10/2003 07:14 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: matthew_k]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4180
Loc: Cambridge, England
a few capacitors and resistors (maybe, maybe $1-3 worth)
LOL, everyone at Empeg Towers loved that.

Peter

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#186179 - 24/10/2003 07:25 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: peter]
CrackersMcCheese
pooh-bah

Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2489
Yes, those hard drives only cost $10 too! No software in the player either I notice!

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#186180 - 24/10/2003 07:26 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: CrackersMcCheese]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4180
Loc: Cambridge, England
No software in the player either I notice!
Well, why would there be? There's no RAM to run it in...

Peter

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#186181 - 24/10/2003 07:55 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: matthew_k]
msaeger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 23/09/2000
Posts: 3608
Loc: Minnetonka, MN
Morons !
_________________________

Matt

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#186182 - 24/10/2003 07:59 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: matthew_k]
JeffS
carpal tunnel

Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
If they truly believe that you can build/develop a Karma for $80 and sell it for $400, then why don't the set up shop and show the rest of us how it's done? Surely they'd want to take advantage of something you can sell at over a 400% profit?
_________________________
-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.

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#186183 - 24/10/2003 10:21 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: Diznario]
genixia
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/02/2002
Posts: 3411
Speaking of people ordering 30+ units...

I suspect that Dell will cancel those orders first. The terms and conditions of Home/Home Office sales include a 'No resale' condition, and people are going to have a hard time justifying their need for 30 personal mp3 players.
_________________________
Mk2a 60GB Blue. Serial 030102962 sig.mp3: File Format not Valid.

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#186184 - 24/10/2003 10:25 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: genixia]
loren
carpal tunnel

Registered: 23/08/2000
Posts: 3826
Loc: SLC, UT, USA
I'm surprised they haven't canceled them yet. What's taking so long?! =]
_________________________
|| loren ||

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#186185 - 24/10/2003 10:27 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: loren]
matthew_k
pooh-bah

Registered: 12/02/2002
Posts: 2298
Loc: Berkeley, California
What's taking so long?! =]

They're waiting so they can ship out everything else that wasn't a karma in those orders... Or at least, that's what they're doing with mine. It's all right, I've wanted an extra AC adapter for my laptop and this way it qualified for free shipping and got 15% off.

Matthew

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#186186 - 24/10/2003 10:44 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: loren]
genixia
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/02/2002
Posts: 3411
I'm not really sure if they can.

They sent me an order acknowledgement.
They thanked me for my order.
They sent me the terms and conditions of sale which include;

This Agreement contains the terms and conditions that apply to purchases by Home, Home Office, and Small Business customers from the Dell entity named on the invoice ("Dell") that will be provided to you ("Customer") on orders for computer systems and/or related products and/or services and support sold by Dell in the United States. By accepting delivery of the computer systems, other products and/or services and support described on that invoice, Customer agrees to be bound by and accepts these terms and conditions. If for any reason you are not satisfied with your Dell-branded hardware system, you may return the system under the terms and conditions of Dell's "Total Satisfaction Return Policy", which is located online at www1.us.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/policy/en/policy?c=us&l=en&s=gen&~section=010 or may be found in the documentation accompanying the system.

THESE TERMS AND CONDITIONS APPLY (I) UNLESS THE CUSTOMER HAS SIGNED A SEPARATE PURCHASE AGREEMENT WITH DELL, IN WHICH CASE THE SEPARATE AGREEMENT SHALL GOVERN; OR (II) UNLESS OTHER DELL STANDARD TERMS APPLY TO THE TRANSACTION.

These terms and conditions are subject to change without prior written notice at any time, in Dell's sole discretion.

1. Other Documents. Other than as specifically provided in any separate formal purchase agreement between Customer and Dell, these terms and conditions may NOT be altered, supplemented, or amended by the use of any other document(s). Any attempt to alter, supplement or amend this document or to enter an order for product(s) which is subject to additional or altered terms and conditions will be null and void, unless otherwise agreed to in a written agreement signed by both Customer and Dell.


I don't care that the order acknowledgement included an additonal clause. Their terms and conditions preclude it.
_________________________
Mk2a 60GB Blue. Serial 030102962 sig.mp3: File Format not Valid.

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#186187 - 24/10/2003 10:52 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: genixia]
RobotCaleb
pooh-bah

Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 1866
Loc: Austin
this very well could turn into the greatest thing, ever
well, in a long while

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#186188 - 24/10/2003 10:52 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: genixia]
matics
new poster

Registered: 21/10/2003
Posts: 16
Well, I'm sure that everyone who had placed an order knows by now that this deal is not happening. I received a notice from Dell that the item as advertised is not available. So, those of you who missed this deal, you didn't miss anything.

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#186189 - 24/10/2003 10:57 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: matics]
matthew_k
pooh-bah

Registered: 12/02/2002
Posts: 2298
Loc: Berkeley, California
I dunno, I'm still InProduction with no email. Though i'm crossing my fingers but not holding my breath. Of course, it take a while to send out a couple thousand emails.

Matthew

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#186190 - 24/10/2003 11:04 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: matthew_k]
matics
new poster

Registered: 21/10/2003
Posts: 16
Here is a link directly to a customer support forum at Dell that clarifies the situation:

http://forums.us.dell.com/supportforums/board/message?board.id=cc_order_status&message.id=73178

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#186191 - 24/10/2003 11:45 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: matics]
ninti
old hand

Registered: 28/12/2001
Posts: 868
Loc: Los Angeles
Meanwhile, a co-worker of mine who ordered 10, has had his credit card charged for the full amount.

Now, he is the sysadmin and a regular customer with a corporate account. That may have something to do with it. We'lls ee if he actually gets anything.
_________________________
Ninti - MK IIa 60GB Smoke, 30GB, 10GB

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#186192 - 24/10/2003 11:53 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: ninti]
loren
carpal tunnel

Registered: 23/08/2000
Posts: 3826
Loc: SLC, UT, USA
odds are his card was just authorized at that amount, not actually charged. It shows on mine too, but it's not an actual charge until they are shipped.

edit: but if i'm wrong... and i get canceled... sign me up for one of those 10! hahah.
_________________________
|| loren ||

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#186193 - 24/10/2003 12:14 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: loren]
ninti
old hand

Registered: 28/12/2001
Posts: 868
Loc: Los Angeles
Lol, get in line.

Hmm, that could be the case. I asked him about it and he had no idea about authorizing vs actually charging, it is entirely possible that is all it is.
_________________________
Ninti - MK IIa 60GB Smoke, 30GB, 10GB

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#186194 - 24/10/2003 14:43 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: ninti]
mrfixit
enthusiast

Registered: 14/06/2002
Posts: 337
I just got the email from dell that "matics" posted the link to. They regretably canlceled the order bla... bla...bla. That stinks but I figured it would not happen. The corrected price is still not that bad though.
_________________________
Ben
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 40gig blue no illumination....yet
hijacked

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#186195 - 24/10/2003 15:58 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: mrfixit]
matics
new poster

Registered: 21/10/2003
Posts: 16
I also agree that Dell, in spite of the screwup, has the best delivered price (as of today at least) on the Karma. $324 shipped - $20 rebate and your out only $304!!

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#186196 - 27/10/2003 12:24 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: matics]
BleachLPB
enthusiast

Registered: 01/11/2001
Posts: 354
Loc: Maryland
My old boss (the one who informed me about this whole thing to begin with) says he argued and bitched on the phone with Dell for about an hour, and they agreed to sell him the Archos Jukebox Multimedia Video AV 120 for the same price. He works in customer support, so he knows how to demand answers and information, be annoying, and polite all at the same time.

When I asked him how he stumbled upon the cheap Karma in the first place - he says he happened to be shopping for mp3 players at the time of the price mixup.
_________________________
BleachLPB ------------- NewFace MK2a

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#186197 - 27/10/2003 13:35 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: BleachLPB]
ninti
old hand

Registered: 28/12/2001
Posts: 868
Loc: Los Angeles
Everyone in my office who received a confirmation notice has had his canceled by now.
_________________________
Ninti - MK IIa 60GB Smoke, 30GB, 10GB

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#186198 - 27/10/2003 14:41 Re: 20 GB Rio Karma on the cheap at Dell.com [Re: ninti]
RobotCaleb
pooh-bah

Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 1866
Loc: Austin
oddly enough mine still shows as in production

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