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#225760 - 03/07/2004 23:25 ARM stops working after router install. Help!
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
Hi there.

I'm not sure where to go with this, but today I installed a Linksys router WRT-54G and set-up a home network and seemed to have lost my connection to the receiver. I have the router connected directly to my server/desktop (where music is located) and have two laptops connected through wireless adaptors. Using Win XP.

Anyway, now when I turn on the receiver it starts with searching for server, then stops and screen says "info net: pna ip 172.16.X.XX n:255.255.0.0 g:172.XX.X.X" ARM icon on the desktop is red too, so i'm simply not getting any connection.

I disabled the firewall on the router already, but am curious if there's something else I need to do. I did reinstall ARM 1.04 and still no luck.

I have a pretty good feeling I'm not the only one who ran into this issue.

Please help! Thanks.

KC


Edited by gilmores (03/07/2004 23:45)

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#225761 - 04/07/2004 11:44 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
Linksys router WRT-54G


It's not directly related to this. I'm pretty sure that I used my Rio Receivers when I had a WRT54G.

Quote:
info net: pna ip 172.16.X.XX n:255.255.0.0 g:172.XX.X.X"


Are you using PNA?

Quote:
I disabled the firewall on the router already


Don't do this. The Receiver wants to talk to your PC, not the router.
_________________________
-- roger

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#225762 - 04/07/2004 12:37 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
If I'm using a PNA, i didn't realize it. I'm not a networking expert. I already had a dsl modem connected to my desktop and two wireless adaptors for my laptops. The rio was running straight from the desktop through the phone line.

Yesterday, i connected the router, called linksys tech support and they ran me through the set-up. I apologize for not being more of an expert.

I spent a few hours reading as much info on this site last night and played around with some settings, but just couldn't figure it out. The tray icon on the software never turns blue so it appears it's not connected to the network.

I enabled the firewall on the router.

Do you have any ideas for me?

Thanks for the help. It's much appreciated.

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#225763 - 04/07/2004 13:25 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
If I'm using a PNA, i didn't realize it...The rio was running straight from the desktop through the phone line.


This strongly suggests that you were using PNA -- which uses your normal phone wires to connect devices (to avoid having to run new cables).

How have you got the Rio connected now?

The reason I ask is that I suspect that you're having a problem that has plagued a lot of other people: the Rio Receiver supports both PNA and Ethernet networking. However, with certain routers, it fails to detect an Ethernet connection, and tries to use PNA instead. This fails.

I don't recall whether the WRT54G is one of the routers that causes this problem in the Receiver, but it might be.

If you look at the back of the Receiver, you'll see two lights: a yellow one labelled "activity" and a green one labelled "link".

If you're using an Ethernet connection, the Link light should blink quickly, and then come on. If you're suffering from the problem I mentioned, then this won't happen.

The interim solution is to try power-cycling the Receiver multiple times, until you can get the Link light to come on properly. You can power-cycle the Receiver by repeatedly pressing the power button on the front.

If you can get the link light to come on sometimes, but not other times (usually it seems to be about 1 time in 4 that it'll work), then you're suffering from this problem. What you need to do then is to plug a cheap 10Mbps hub in between the router and the Receiver. This'll fix it permanently.
_________________________
-- roger

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#225764 - 04/07/2004 13:35 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
The Rio is stil connected the same way, through the phone line then running into the stereo.

I ran the test four times. All four times the yellow activity light came on first for about a second, then turned off, then the green link light came on and stayed on. The activity light is very faint and flickering. Green light stays on. It did this all four times.

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#225765 - 04/07/2004 14:47 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
The Rio is stil connected the same way, through the phone line then running into the stereo.


OK, ignoring the RCA outputs on the back, let's just focus on the network connections. You've got phone line running from the Receiver to a jack on the wall, right? Then, how does the other end get to the PC?
_________________________
-- roger

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#225766 - 04/07/2004 15:52 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
In my office, I've got the phone line running from wall into the modem. Ethernet cable running from modem to the router. Ethernet cable from router to desktop computer. ARM is installed on this desktop computer. I also have two laptops running with wireless adaptors. All three computers are now networked together through the router.

Only connection to RIO in living room is to phone jack, RCA jacks to stereo, and power cable to outlet.


Edited by gilmores (04/07/2004 15:54)

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#225767 - 04/07/2004 15:57 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
Only connection to RIO in living room is to phone jack


This is where I'm obviously misunderstanding something.

Unless your DSL modem also supports Phone-line networking (PNA), then there's no way that the Receiver could ever have worked. It has no network connection to the PC, as far as I can see.
_________________________
-- roger

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#225768 - 04/07/2004 16:00 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
It's very possible that it did. I've never heard the term PNA, so I couldn't say for certain. Honestly, though, I didn't make any changes to the connection of the RIO, but it stopped working after I installed this router. I have a 2Wire Home Portal modem, using SBC Yahoo service. The only connection I've ever had on the RIO was the phone line and it always worked perfectly.

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#225769 - 04/07/2004 16:04 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
here's a link to my modem. 2Wire 1000SW.

http://www.2wire.com/?p=134

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#225770 - 04/07/2004 16:11 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
2Wire 1000SW.



Yep, it supports PNA. What's happened is that when you had the PC plugged directly into the DSL modem, it was letting your PC talk to the Receiver over the phone line networking.

Now you've put the WRT54G router in between the two, this no longer works. You've effectively put your Receiver outside your firewall, on a separate network.

Unfortunately, there's no (easy) way to make this work. Turning off the firewall won't help (and you shouldn't do that anyway).

One way to fix it is to run real Ethernet to the Receiver and also plug it into the WRT54G (although you might still run into the problem I described earlier).

Another option is to get a Home PNA card for the PC. There should have been one in the box that came with the Receiver. Then you'll use that to plug the PC into a phone jack as well.
_________________________
-- roger

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#225771 - 04/07/2004 16:18 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
It would be much easier to install the PNA card than run wires since I'd have to start from scratch on that.

Just threw out my old RIO box a couple months back and don't believe I kept that card.

Should I check to see if my computer has that card already, or is it rare to have one already installed?

Once I install that card, is there a complicated set-up to get this working again?

Thanks again Roger for all this info.

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#225772 - 05/07/2004 05:05 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
Should I check to see if my computer has that card already, or is it rare to have one already installed?



It's pretty rare to have one installed already. To find out, go to Control Panel / Network and Internet Connections / Network Connections.

This screen lists the network adapters in your PC. If you've got a Home PNA card, it'll be in that list.

Alternatively, you can just check the backplane of the PC, but you might have a 56K modem card in there, which will look very similar.

Quote:
Once I install that card, is there a complicated set-up to get this working again?


As long as you get one with out-of-the-box support for Windows XP, it should be extremely easy.
_________________________
-- roger

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#225773 - 19/07/2004 19:12 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
Alright. Got the card. It was actually a plug and play version by Diamond. It's installed but I'm still not getting a connection. Seems like i'm getting the same error code. I checked the ip configuration settings in ARM and it does list my new adaptor in the adaptor drop down.

Any suggestions?

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#225774 - 20/07/2004 07:03 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
Any suggestions?


Yes. First step: plug the card directly to the Rio Receiver using a single piece of phone cable. See if that works. I'm a little worried that the DSL filters might mess with HPNA.

If that still doesn't work, it's a problem with ARMGR, and we can work on fixing that.
_________________________
-- roger

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#225775 - 20/07/2004 10:12 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
The card i have is a USB plug and play device. It powers up when plugged by USB into the computer. I apologize if I am misunderstanding, but you're saying unplug it from the computer and just run the phone cord from the receiver through the the card and into the phone jack?

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#225776 - 20/07/2004 10:17 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
what I did try is plugging the card from the computer straight into the phone jack, skipping the DSL filter. Then connecting the receiver to the phone jack in the other room. That did not create a connection. Still getting the red ARM icon.

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#225777 - 20/07/2004 10:26 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: gilmores]
Roger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5577
Loc: London, UK
Quote:
The card i have is a USB plug and play device.


Oh, right, so it's a USB network adapter for HPNA networks? Do you have the model number handy?

What I'm saying is (and it sounds like you've tried this): make sure that there's a single plain piece of phone line (that you know works) between the HPNA network adapter in the PC and the Rio Receiver.

This will allow us to discount problems caused by filters, wiring or other stuff. At this point, we'll know that it's a problem with the configuration of ARMGR.

So, assuming that it is: run ARMGR, and open it up. On the Tools menu, select "IP configuration".

Make sure that the HPNA adapter is in the drop down list. If it is, select it and look at the settings in the dialog.

The first thing you should do is check that the "Make music available on this adapter" box is checked.

Is the "Enable Autoconfiguration" box checked? When you get the error from the Rio Receiver, what does it say on the screen?

From a Windows command prompt, run "ipconfig /all" (without the quotes) and post the output here.
_________________________
-- roger

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#225778 - 20/07/2004 10:40 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
when i ran the last test plugging the adaptor straight into the phone line, skipping the DSL filter, i didn't wait long enough. I just tried it again and it works.

It seems you're righ that the DSL filter is causing a problem with the phone line card.

BTW - i'm using the DIAMOND HomeFree Phoneline Network USB card.

http://www.overstock.com/cgi-bin/d2.cgi?cid=48418&PAGE=PRODUCT&PROD_ID=26714&fp=F

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#225779 - 20/07/2004 19:56 Re: ARM stops working after router install. Help! [Re: Roger]
gilmores
stranger

Registered: 30/10/2003
Posts: 14
i just used a splitter on the phone jack and am running the card and the DSL out of it. Right now both are working so I'm thrilled. As long as the Reciever doesn't cause problems with the DSL it seems this is a perfect fix for this.

Thanks again for the help. Very much appreciated!

KC

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