I've been looking for a while for a good LCD monitor for mobile video applications in my little Civic. My plans are to mount a PSOne in the glovebox and a 4 to 5 inch LCD on the roof so that the passengers can have a little game of CoolBoarders or Tony Hawk Pro Skater on the way up to the mountains. So far i'm leaning towards these monitors (which are made by Sharp)... Pyle's, MobileAuthority's, or this one...which can be had for a tad over $200.

Sooo... has anyone had any experience with any sort of mobile video install? (or more specifically with any of these products?) Stories, hints and tips are much appreciated!! Thanks.




|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

Other than the fact that it is illegal (in Canada) to have a tv/display in the drivers view or line of sight, or visible from the driver position.

Just make sure you take into account:
power - you will need a fair bit, unless you bypass the ac/dc converter in the PS - not easy, but it has been done.
line of sight from you - make sure that you "cannot" effectivly see the display(s) - or make it look like you can't (nudge, nudge, wink, wink.....)
storage - will a PS really fit into a civic's glove box?
what about a vcr? dvd? etc.... the possibilities are endless (so can be the cost!)

Have fun!

Nah, the most important thing is to get the PlayStation controller buttons integrated into the steering wheel. Gran Turismo, anyone?

___________
Tony Fabris

Just a thought but the Playstation uses CDs right? Well, when you hit a bump wouldn't the game restart or pause? Unless sony has built in Shock protection.. but I doubt that in a home console system. Better to get a N64 or a different cartridge system.

Tom

Reg #2845: Mark 1 #00173, Mark 2 #119

Other than the fact that it is illegal (in Canada) to have a tv/display in the drivers view or line of sight, or visible from the driver position.

Yeap, that's supposedly the same here in the US from what i gather. But then again, i don't know how those in dash DVD players with the motorized screens get away with being legal then...hrm...

I'm pretty sure i'd have to mount it behind my sunroof anyhow, but i haven't measured the dimenstions yet... but none the less it folds up so that it can be fairly well hidden. The hard part is going to be resisting the temptation to play when sitting in traffic on the 101!!!

storage - will a PS really fit into a civic's glove box?

The PSOne will ... that thing is TINY!!! it's a scaled down version of the regular playstation that's not much bigger than the cd itself depth wise. Neat stuff.






|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

I have seen both types of systems installed into an automobile. The playstation was a bit trickier, but this was in an SUV, and they used something similar to the shock-mount in the empeg, but mounted it to the whole chassis of the PS. But I am sure a lot of rubber, duct tape can solve anything!

Just a thought but the Playstation uses CDs right? Well, when you hit a bump wouldn't the game restart or pause? Unless sony has built in Shock protection.. but I doubt that in a home console system. Better to get a N64 or a different cartridge system

The PS uses a cacheing system for most of the in game aspects, the only time it's really full on reading the cd is during cinematics or cutscenes or when loading a mission or level. Regardless, i plan on having a small shockmount rigged up.


|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

Other than mounting LCD's in the headrests for the rear passengers, or in the seatback, the ceiling mount is apt for problems, especially in a car, if it was my head that hit the lcd, I would swear a lot and tell you to go someplace not nice if I broke it!

I have never seen the PSone, if it is that small, perhaps it is shockmounted somehow? is there a url where one can pique his interest in such a device?

Try Here, or here, or both.

________
Donato
MkII/Blue/40GB/080000565

Now that is one cool unit! Whay cant they do that for the original/future units? too easy for your neighbours 16 yr old to walk out with it?

That's twisted tony!

Calvin

Yeap, that's supposedly the same here in the US from what i gather. But then again, i don't know how those in dash DVD players with the motorized screens get away with being legal then...hrm...

i was under the impression that these types of installations had some sort of feature that only allowed the visual aspects (at least for those units that can play music as well as video) to operate if the emergency brake was applied. i have a feeling that any installer would set the unit up like this for liability purposes. of course once that is done, there is nothing stopping you from disengaging the emergency brake and leaving it on all the time :)

jeremy

12 gig, green...

Okay, i ended up getting the Pyle branded Sharp 5.6" LCD screen off of EBay
for $200... not to shabby. It'll be here next week...

In the meantime i've been doing some research on the power for this project.
The main issue is that i want to be able to remove the gamesystem and put
any other AV type device in it's place (namely a PS2 as soon as i get my
hands on one so i'll have in car DVD as well as gaming). I'm going to mount
some female RCA jacks in the glovebox so that anything with an AV signal can
be shown on the monitor. SOooo.. that leads me to the power issue. I don't
want all this stuff wired directly to the power system, i want a good ol'
standard wall socket type plug to plug whatever the device may be into for
power. I've been looking around on the web for power inverters made for car
use and have come across a few so far (here's one, and here's another).
Has anyone installed anything like this or seen anything like this
installed? I know a lot of newer SUV type vehicles come with AC plugs in the
rear, and that's sorta what i'm going for, only i want to mount it somewhere
accessable in the front, hopefully in the glovebox. The problem i'm seeing
with the ones i've found is that they all plug into the cigarette lighter
socket, which is a no no. I want to power the inverter straight from the
battery or from the distribution block that my amps are coming off of (which
has two open ports). Sorry for being longwinded, but i hope that explains
what i'm looking for. Hints tips suggestions??

ANYONE? Bueller? Bueller?



|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

Hints tips suggestions??

Chop the cigarette liter plug of any old inverter add a fuse and wire it strait to the battery?

-Mike

. . . and maybe install a bigger battery / alternator

- --
Rod, UK Mk2 64gig Red S/No.341

This is what I did too, works like a charm.
Cannot have more load than about 1amps at 230 volts, but it works for laptop and the likes.

TommyE

This is what I did too, works like a charm.

Sweet. Could you fill me in on your setup? hardware at the likes? do you use the cigarette lighter or did you wire it straight up? Thankee =]


|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

. . . and maybe install a bigger battery / alternator


Naaah... What he's talking about doing is really a pretty trivial draw, compared to what his amplifiers etc. are pulling. Of course, there's always the "straw that broke the camel's back" theory to keep in mind...

tanstaafl.

"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"

I wired it to the lighter outlet, except that I connected it 'behind' the plug itself.

TommyE

Hi,

Regarding caching, sure it caches textures and levels. But games with in-game music usually plays it directly from the CD (meaning the CD would be running all the time). Also the PS is very bad at handling CD read-errors - in my experience it just dies if it can't read from the CD (no errors, retry options).




Lars

Hi,

I would avoid the power-inverters if possible for several reasons.

1) High-voltage AC isnt something you want in your car. It's dangerous, you can't have common ground to the car, it makes noise (literaly and induces noise in your stereo AFAIK)
2) Why go from DC to AC to DC? The PSone uses low voltage DC - and doesn't the PS2 do the same? As you mention yourself you can buy a lighter-plug adapter which provides the power you need (wire it directly to the car if you wish).



Lars

Hi,

The PSone has the usual Sony Playstation shock-mounts (3 small rubber feet), but the unit being to small the CD-drive really has no space to move.

I'd opt for some sort of shock-mount, perhaps just placing the PSone on a thick layer of foam sheet (I don't know if that is the correct term?).

I took a PSone apart the other day, everything is so small. Still I wonder why the regular Playstation has to be *so* much bigger.




Lars

2) Why go from DC to AC to DC? The PSone uses low voltage DC - and doesn't the PS2 do the same? As you mention yourself you can buy a lighter-plug adapter which provides the power you need (wire it directly to the car if you wish).

Agreed, i originally planned to do just that. BUT, the problem is that i want to be able to switch out game systems without having to rewire my car. If i had a standard AC plug, i could bring whatever my little heart desired, including any myriad of portable AV devices, and just plug em in. I'm still doing some research on the topic, but my installer ensures me he's done it before with no problems, so we'll see. Unless i can come up with a better solution for being able to swap out the systems, this is looking like the best way to go.


|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

True that. I definately plan on building some sort of shock mount platform. As soon as this game is done and we are out of crunch here at work, that's my first project.

The display should get here today or tomorrow, i'll take some pictures of it in action and post them on my site. I'll definately be documenting the install as well. (i'm going to be doing a bunch of stuff at once, including installing some MB Quart PSC 216's in the front, thanks to the ceaseless recommendations of tanstaafl and my installer.) I'll be doing it soon after the Holidays, so i'll keep you all posted on the progress. Thanks!


|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

Re: the caching issue. I asked around at work and got this info from a couple of the game programmers in case anyone is interested:


PS1 has only a 1 sector read ahead cache for data loading

The special format streaming audio has in the region of 32k internal cache (can't remember exactly but it is of no real help in shock proofing)

aside from that, the CD operation is application specific - some games with a lot of streaming audio never spin down - and a lot of games just use CD-DA for their music all the way through.

Some games load up and then spin down for play until a level is restarted

PSX is renowned for accelerated CD hardware wear and tear, and CD reading difficulties generally.

Not much help I'm sure, other than there is no mechanism for shock protection - try playing a game in a PSX and jolt the unit - that will show you.


and


its also not a very good predictive device (no esp) it will retry a number of times to make sure it gets the data... it reads only when it needs something, not when it thinks it MIGHT need something...this can result in music stopping for no apparent reason, big lags loading... like _big_ lags... sometimes crashing. But once everything is in ram, most of gameplay wont be interrupted by bumps as you arent hitting the disk for anything (ie: you have music off).


So, basically i'm going to have to shockmount that puppy good. A big pad of foam seems like a fairly easy solution, if not unnatractive, but it'll get the job done. (the mind churns with visions of spring mounted platforms.....)




|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

Something to consider if you're using foam rubber as a shock-mount: It is an insulator. I don't know how much ventilation your game console needs, but you probably want to keep that in mind. You wouldn't want to overheat your game console by giving it a cozy warm snuggly bed of foam all around it, blocking all the air holes...

___________
Tony Fabris

ahhh, hadn't thought of that. Good call. I'll have to be careful of that. The PS2 has a couple of fans and an airvent (pic), but the PSOne is all heat sinks....


|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

2) Why go from DC to AC to DC? The PSone uses low voltage DC - and doesn't
> the PS2 do the same? As you mention yourself you can buy a lighter-plug
> adapter which provides the power you need (wire it directly to the car if you wish).

Agreed, i originally planned to do just that. BUT, the problem is that i want to be able to switch out game systems without having to rewire my car. If i had a standard AC plug, i could bring whatever my little heart desired, including any myriad of portable AV devices, and just plug em in. I'm still doing some research on the topic, but my installer ensures me he's done it before with no problems, so we'll see. Unless i can come up with a better solution for being able to swap out the systems, this is looking like the best way to go.

If you really want a AC plug in your car, I really advise you to make it switchable (on the 12V side of the inverter), because the inverter itself drains quite some power from the battery even with no AC device connected and even without that, 110V/230V are a security risk as well (fire, shocks etc.).
However, I would choose the following setup:

1. Install a high power DC plug somewhere near or in the glove box to connect any devices that will stay there for a while (PSone/PS2)


2. Optionally install an AC plug somewhere to provide power to devices that are only to be used for short term use (AV devices like DVD player, VCR, ...). Make sure you are easily able to disconnect the inverter from the battery for the above reasons.

Anyway: Have fun with your play-mobile (aka car).

cu,
sven
(MkII 12GB blue, #080000113)

Hrmm... good idea. I was definitely planning on having a switch for the AC plug installed on the floor console which would switch on the monitor and plug at the same time. But, I could just install another DC "cigarette lighter" type plug in the glove box for the PSOne to plug into that is always on... and... hrm... okay, you've given me something to think about. Good points. I gotta talk to my installer and see exactly what he's planning....


|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

<brag>
Well, looks like i'll have to make that shockmount for the PS2 instead of the PSOne. We just had the company party here at LucasArts, and the president of the company announced everyone will leave here today with a PS2 in hand for the company holiday gift. Aww jeah... in car DVD here i come, free ta boot. Now the shockmounts gonna have to be DAMN good!
</brag>

This brings up another question though....

how would i go about mixing the audio...say if i wanted to listen to music AND the gamesystem/DVD at the same time through the car audio system? I seem to remember this coming up elsewhere.... but i couldn't find it.



|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

We just had the company party here at LucasArts, and the president of the company announced everyone will leave here today with a PS2 in hand for the company holiday gift.

So THAT'S where they all went!

A pox upon thy family.

___________
Tony Fabris

Yeah, that's what i was thinking!! I can't believe they pulled it off with the shortage and all, but i'm sure the higher ups have some fairly large contacts at Sony. I think it's around 500 people or so here that are getting em?! Not to shabby. I'm guessing they pre-ordered em really early in the year.


|| loren.cox
|| 080000446

I can't believe they pulled it off with the shortage and all

Take a look on ebay if you want a surprise. Just from curiousity I looked yesterday, and there were more than 6,300 Sony Playstation 2's being auctioned. The greedy types with minimum bids in the $500 range were not getting any bids. Most seemed to be selling in the $400-$550 range. I saw one incredible auction for a set of four brand new playstations, starting bid $2,000, and the lunatics had bid the price up to $14,100 with three days still to go.

As for pulling the audio off of a DVD disc... it can be done. Tony Fabris knows how to do it. And I can just about promise you he will never try it again! I guess the process is, shall we say, fraught with unexpected problems and difficulties and requires some special software and a lot of time and very sincere effort. (He very kindly extracted the audio from my Cats DVD for me so I could put it in my empeg.)

tanstaafl.

"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"

I don't think loren was asking about extracting audio from a DVD. I think he was talking about playing the Playstation2 simultaneously with the car stereo.

For that, he needs a mixer. That's something rarely needed for car audio, so I don't know where to find such an animal. I know you can get line mixers in musical equipment catalogs, but I don't know if they're appropriate for car audio applications.

Anyone have any experience mixing two audio signals in a car? Or is it as simple as using a Y-splitter cable backwards?

___________
Tony Fabris

Hmmm, the empeg guys have mentioned that the empeg may be able to do sampling of the aux inputs. Not at a high enough bit rate for music, but maybe good enough for something like this?

-Mike

Alrighty, the LCD and a brand spankin' new alarm are in...

http://www.skivvies.com/car/

Another 6pm to 3am install job. What's left to be done:

1. Install the inverter and playstation, with an on/off switch between the inverter and battery (still researching if this is necessary, some inverters say they turn themselves off....)

2. Install the MBQuart Components up front. Easy.

The alarm install was way more involved than i'd ever thought. I learned a whole shiteload about relays and the electrical system overall...simple stuff slapped together to make a big complicated mess. Scott removed the old factory alarm, which was an incredible nest of T connections, and simplified it with some relays. Now it does all sorts of fancy crap from my remote. I opted to not install the remote start, since i KNOW i'd forget oneday and start it up in gear since it's a standard.

We decided to not reinstall the Sony CD head unit as planned, as we'd have to do some major console cutting to fit it and the LCD. So i just settled with getting the Tuner for the empeg when it comes out. I can wait...though traffic reports would be nice.

We hooked the playstation up (as you can see in the pictures), and have the audio going through the AUX in of the empeg, and holy crap does it sound good. One oddity though... (maybe a bug), When i selected AUX from the front panel of the empeg, we got nothing, no sound at all...which scared the crap out of me. We rechecked the wiring and it was all right, and still nothing. So it occured to me to hit the input selection buttons on the remote, and when i hit Tuner, BAM there it was.... Anyone know what's up with that?


|| loren.cox || 080000446 ||

First: wow! That install looks excellent. Very impressive.

Second: "I opted to not install the remote start, since i KNOW i'd forget oneday and start it up in gear since it's a standard. "

I know that some alarm companies make an interlock that uses an optical sensor to see if your shift lever is in neutral before engaging the starter circutitry. I believe this option is in the $100 range. My wife has a starter, and that thing is great.

Thanks for the pictures. Excellent.

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

I had this a long time ago with (I think) something like B12; you can actually "Pause" the AUX input. Did you try pressing the PLAY button twice?

One of the few remaining Mk1 owners... #00015

Didn't try that... Will do as soon as the inverter is in and there's something to pause =]. Thanks for the tip!


|| loren.cox || 080000446 ||

In reply to:

---

I opted to not install the remote start, since i KNOW i'd forget oneday and start it up in gear since it's a standard

---

Why on earth would you need a starter in the mild climate of San Fran? (And yes the optical sensors for that are 'bout $100) They do work well, because it is rather funny to watch a pickup truck start, then start to roll off down the street through a fence, and high-center itself on a broken fence post! (Not my truck!)
The remote door locks I can see would be beneficial for those really rainy days.

Nice install by the way! If I am ever in San Fran I will have to stop by and have a boo!

Now for the control pad buttons in the steering wheel for Gran Tourismo....

Smoker_Man
#080000449 MkII - 36Gb Blue

Exactly, it's not needed at all, just cool little add on feature...though it does get damn cold in SF, just no where near cold enough to need a remote start. Bah.

Definitely stop by if you in the bay area, i still have yet to meet another empeger... which reminds me... we need to do that get together soon..

and yes, steering wheel mounted Dual Shocks....hmmm...now that's an idea! hahah.


|| loren.cox || 080000446 ||

In reply to:

---

steering wheel mounted Dual Shocks....

---

To controll the James Bond-esque toys for those road rage days!

Smoker_Man
#080000449 MkII - 36Gb Blue

Seems like I cannot edit my previous post.

About the North American (Western US/Canada) Empeg meet.
Someplace centrally located would probably best, however, I am sure a lot of poeple would fly in rather then spend 4 days driving. Also, I cannot forsee any immediate reason to take my car to California.

Although, I am sure poeple are using this media to schedule and meet with other fellow Empegers(Empegans, Empegians?) when they are "in the neighbourhood".

Perhaps we should take a poll for North Americans to participate?
I will create in in the General Forum.


Smoker_Man
#080000449 MkII - 36Gb Blue

Someplace centrally located would probably best, however, I am sure a lot of poeple would fly in rather then spend 4 days driving. Also, I cannot forsee any immediate reason to take my car to California.

If you fly then how are you going to show off your install? Defeats the point if you ask me...

Borislav