#262178 - 04/08/2005 15:18
Seeking laptop recommendation
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 21/05/1999
Posts: 5335
Loc: Cambridge UK
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I am hiring two home working software developers. As they'll travel to Cambridge and elsewhere in the world from time to time it makes sense to give them laptops rather than desktops, but those laptops have to be up to the job for software development. Ultra thin but slow is no use - I'd say performance is more important than form factor. A good selection of ports is also important - plenty of USB, 1394 and ideally serial and parallel ports as well.
The IBM T43 series looks interesting - 2GHz for around 1300 UKP plus VAT. That's the ballpark price I'm looking for. Any recommendations?
Thanks!
Rob
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#262179 - 04/08/2005 15:52
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: rob]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/01/2002
Posts: 3995
Loc: Manchester UK
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My works Dell D810 is really nice, real serial/parallel ports, 3 USB, wireless, bluetooth, firewire, WVWXWXWWXGA screen (or something like that, 1900x1200). With the spare battery instead of the cd drive I get 5 hours at full tilt as well. Solid performer, quite easily the best wintel laptop I've ever had. Plus it has a nipple and track pad. I'd think 1300 quid would get a particularly speedy one too.
_________________________
Cheers,
Andy M
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#262180 - 04/08/2005 15:59
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: andym]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 30/10/2000
Posts: 4931
Loc: New Jersey, USA
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Quote:
...it has a nipple and track pad...
Sorry Andy, I think you may have to re-read the laptop anatomy FAQ.
_________________________
-Rob Riccardelli
80GB 16MB MK2 090000736
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#262181 - 04/08/2005 16:03
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: andym]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 21/05/1999
Posts: 5335
Loc: Cambridge UK
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That's impressively cheap! I've never bought from Dell but this is tempting.
Rob
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#262183 - 04/08/2005 17:11
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: rob]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 10/06/1999
Posts: 5914
Loc: Wivenhoe, Essex, UK
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The Dells aren't quite as solid as the IBMs, but I still like them.
_________________________
Remind me to change my signature to something more interesting someday
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#262184 - 04/08/2005 17:13
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: andy]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 15/08/2000
Posts: 4859
Loc: New Jersey, USA
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What do folks think of Alienware? I recently saw one of their highend laptops - beautiful device, but I heard their support was weak at best. I am not in the market, merely curious.
_________________________
Paul Grzelak
200GB with 48MB RAM, Illuminated Buttons and Digital Outputs
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#262185 - 04/08/2005 17:57
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: pgrzelak]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 15/01/2002
Posts: 1866
Loc: Austin
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A friend of mine has an Alienware desktop. He understands that he paid a huge amount of money for it, but he justifies it by raving about their support. He says that they do an awesome job.
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#262186 - 04/08/2005 18:00
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: andy]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/01/2002
Posts: 3995
Loc: Manchester UK
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Quote:
The Dells aren't quite as solid as the IBMs, but I still like them.
One of the guys in our Leeds office got a Thinkpad before we 'standarized' on Dells, it's really nice and solid feeling, but obviously has the price tag to match.
_________________________
Cheers,
Andy M
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#262187 - 04/08/2005 18:08
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: pgrzelak]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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Quote:
What do folks think of Alienware?
Nearly all Alienware systems are Clevo designs. Usually the same model laptop at Alienware can be found with more options and cheeper from elsewhere, like Sager. I've been eyeing the portable gaming market again, debating when to upgrade. And in doing so, have come across about 5 different vendors who use the Clevo base designs.
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#262188 - 04/08/2005 18:44
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: rob]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 12/02/2002
Posts: 2298
Loc: Berkeley, California
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I wrote out a long response, but came to the conclusion that this was all it was saying:
I don't think you can find a better thought out design than a powerbook.
I don't think you can find a more solidly built laptop than an IBM.
I don't think you can find a better value than a Dell.
From there, it's up to you.
Matthew
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#262189 - 04/08/2005 18:46
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: rob]
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enthusiast
Registered: 11/06/2003
Posts: 384
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You should probably be looking at the R and G series Thinkpads. The R's are larger, cheaper, and will fill in the lowend. The G's are the biggest, but closest to desktop performance. The X's are the small 12" ones, and the T's are the most expensive. I love my T42p, 2GHz, 1.5GB, 128MB ATI FireGL video card, but only two USB ports, one parallel. No serial or firewire. The port replicator has a single serial port, and works great with the laptop stand I have for more USB. But I'm not a code monkey. The developers here are always whing about how a laptop just isn't fast enough when it comes to real world tasks like compiling. The raw CPU speed doesn't seem to correspond to the performance difference between their work on a Thinkpad vs. a Dell Desktop. I guess it comes down to front-side bus and things like that. If you're considering Thinkpads make sure you take a look at the master guide which came up recently in someone else's laptop quest. Also, there are some subtle variations in port replicators/quick docks/docking stations that may sneak up on you, like 2 USB ports vs. 1, and a security key lock vs. not. Also, some of the new Thinkpads don't have the jack on the bottom to use =any= of the docking stations, and our Levono sales person was incredidbly difficult to work with about correcting that. --Nathan
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#262190 - 04/08/2005 19:43
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: pgrzelak]
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veteran
Registered: 25/04/2000
Posts: 1523
Loc: Arizona
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Quote:
What do folks think of Alienware? I recently saw one of their highend laptops - beautiful device, but I heard their support was weak at best. I am not in the market, merely curious.
I'd say avoid Alienware at all cost. I have two of their laptops. So far, I have had to return one of the power bricks (louder than the other laptop, a desktop sitting on the floor and a desktop fan combined), went through a pair of video cards, and now we have to send that laptop back - even though we have onsite repair warranty. Even though they claim to test everything you order to ensure compatability, they somehow shipped me an external sound card and a speaker set that are incompatable (the speakers require a line-out, the sound card doesn't have one). The answer from support was 'ummm, its just a set of speakers, it should work' - even though it should be pretty obvious the subwoofer wasn't working. The initial order was missing two components, which were promptly shipped (after calling them twice). They run really hot (when working at home I turn them off every other hour or so because they get REALLY hot).
I'm completely underwhelmed with everything Alienware, and vowed to never order anything from them again. One of my friends has a desktop from them and went so far to report them to the Better Business Bureau because their product was so bad and support just as bad (wish I could remember how many times he had to send it back).
- Tim
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#262191 - 04/08/2005 22:36
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: Mataglap]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 31/08/1999
Posts: 1649
Loc: San Carlos, CA
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Quote:
The raw CPU speed doesn't seem to correspond to the performance difference between their work on a Thinkpad vs. a Dell Desktop. I guess it comes down to front-side bus and things like that.
Hard drive speed, hard drive speed, hard drive speed. The fastest laptop hard drive is still painfully slow compared to any decent desktop hard drive. This is really apparent on things like compiles where you are accessing thousands of small files scattered all over the drive.
-Mike
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#262192 - 04/08/2005 23:32
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: mcomb]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
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Quote:
Hard drive speed, hard drive speed, hard drive speed. The fastest laptop hard drive is still painfully slow compared to any decent desktop hard drive. This is really apparent on things like compiles where you are accessing thousands of small files scattered all over the drive.
The newer 7200rpm laptop drives aren't too bad for speed now. They're still not as good as a desktop but it's a major improvement over old 5400rpm and 4200rpm laptop drives which just crawled along.
You can always tote an external USB2/IEEE1394 HD around if you want fast access. Some Mac mini users use an external IEEE1394 desktop drive as their boot drive and they apparently get huge speed increases because of that.
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#262193 - 05/08/2005 01:24
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: rob]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/12/2000
Posts: 2665
Loc: Manteca, California
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My employer, offically, buys nothing but Dell. Though I'm not sure if that's a endorsement of Dell or and indictment of management.
------------
Isn't it amazing how Mac's seem to be able to boot from most any drive that is hooked to them? I wonder if that feat will carry over to the next gen?
_________________________
Glenn
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#262194 - 05/08/2005 03:23
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: rob]
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enthusiast
Registered: 20/11/2000
Posts: 279
Loc: Pacific Northwest
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Hey Rob, I've a T41 as my "daily driver" and absolutely love it. The thing is built like a tank (durable-not heavy). The dock we got has 4 USB plus all the other standard stuff. Beautiful screen & resolution options. Love the power control/options.
I've recently had in-laws buy a new laptop--they went through three different ones (Dell, Toshiba, <no brand>) before settling on one--not a Thinkpad, but they've given up. Totally different application than your usage. I played with each and they are varying grades of cheap when compared to Thinkpad units.
Good luck,
Tim
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#262195 - 05/08/2005 12:03
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: robricc]
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veteran
Registered: 21/03/2002
Posts: 1424
Loc: MA but Irish born
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#262196 - 05/08/2005 13:22
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: andym]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 06/10/1999
Posts: 2591
Loc: Seattle, WA, U.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
The Dells aren't quite as solid as the IBMs, but I still like them.
One of the guys in our Leeds office got a Thinkpad before we 'standarized' on Dells, it's really nice and solid feeling, but obviously has the price tag to match.
This university gets "special pricing" from Dell and those Texans owned much of the Intel PC biz here long before I arrived, including Intel laptops.
We were going to get a Dell D410 to use as a sniffer, but heard that Thinkpad prices were dropped a bit post-IBM. I gave the local sales rep a Dell D410 config/price target to hit and he came close enough with an X40 that we bought it. I have always loved Thinkpads and that little X40 is sweet.
I'll be interested to see how that product line evolves as Lenovo.
_________________________
Jim
'Tis the exceptional fellow who lies awake at night thinking of his successes.
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#262197 - 05/08/2005 17:00
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: mcomb]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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Quote:
Hard drive speed, hard drive speed, hard drive speed.
This will hopefully change soon. I'm wondering when a laptop will integrate a SAS (Serial Attached Scsi) controller. This would allow the end user to pick a 2.5 inch SAS drive with 10k RPM, and a 3gb interconnect, or attacked to the same port the user could pick a cheeper 2.5 inch SATA drive. All the SAS drives use the same connectors as SATA, and any SAS controller supports either.
Even SATA drives in a laptop would probably be an improvement, but those seem to be very slow in being adopted.
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#262198 - 05/08/2005 17:06
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: drakino]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 31/08/1999
Posts: 1649
Loc: San Carlos, CA
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Quote:
2.5 inch SAS drive with 10k RPM, and a 3gb interconnect
Mmmm, shiney. Hard drive speed is really the only complaint I have about using a laptop as my primary computer. I've got a 7200 RPM drive in my powerbook and it still feels slower than any desktop drive I've used in the last few years. A laptop with two internal drives that could be stripped would be sweet too, but I'm not sure there is a market for it. Some of the 17 inch behemoths sure seem like they should have the space.
-Mike
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#262199 - 05/08/2005 17:17
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: mcomb]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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The Sager 9880 does offer RAID 0 between two internal drives. Though after seeing one of these beasts in person, they definitly aren't laptops, but instead portable computers in the true sense.
I can't remember who it was, but someone used to offer a "desktop replacement" notebook that used both 3.5 ich drives, and desktop sized memory. I want to say it was either Asus or Acer, but I can't find it now.
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#262200 - 06/08/2005 06:47
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: rob]
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addict
Registered: 23/12/2002
Posts: 652
Loc: Winston Salem, NC
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I have a Dell Inspiron XPS Gen 2, which is a very nice machine that won't fry the family jewels (like the high-end Alienware machine). The only down sides are a 5200 rpm hard drive and it's weighs a ton. The bells and whistles make it a good desktop replacement, but the weight makes it a poor portable device.
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#262201 - 06/08/2005 14:30
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: Cybjorg]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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Quote:
Dell Inspiron XPS Gen 2
. Or take a look at the Dell Inspiron 9300. The differences between the XPS 2 and the 9300 are:
The XPS2 has software controlled color changing lights from several LEDs scattered all over, the 9300 does not
The XPS2 has a selection of an NVidia 6800 Ultra video card, the 9300 does not
The XPS forces you to get a 1920x1200 17 inch LCD screen, the 9300 offers either 1440x900 or 1920x1200. Why a high end laptop that costs more denies the end user choice on the screen is beyond me, but a big reason I haven't considered an XPS 2 as an upgrade from my Inspiron 9100 (where the 9100 and XPS has similar differences, minus the video card one)
Keep in mind though the 9300 is legacy free, so no parallel or serial, but gobs of USB ports are on it.
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#262202 - 08/08/2005 00:34
Re: Seeking laptop recommendation
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14486
Loc: Canada
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I use a fully tricked-out Dell Inspiron 9300 here (2GHz, 2GB, 100GB, WUXGA) and it absolutely rocks for (Linux) s/w development. A great machine.
cheers
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