Indeed! I had thought about sending my clients a newsletter about USB-C, but I definitely don't understand it well enough to explain the concept to myself yet!

As for my quest, I guess things get easier if you don't mind plugging in two or three cables, but that's not what I'm looking for. USB3 to HDMI adapters help a little too, but none of it is ideal. That TB15 would be perfect if they could just get it to work! Argh.

Agreed. It's nice to see it include the power capacity to charge laptops. Thunderbolt 1-2 had a 10W limit, and was meant to power devices downstream. The jump to TB3 over USB-C makes it possible for one cable docking solutions.


This is the option I like the most even with the additional cost. The Razer core linked earlier has my interest as a way to drive a VR headset from a notebook due to the PCIe slot. And the prior TB1 monitor from Apple worked in this way. The display has it's own USB 2 root hub and controller, along with a firewire controller, and a gigabit NIC. Off the monitor USB bus is a sound device for the built in mic and speakers, along with a webcam. It's been a nice solution for my laptops since 2011 and I'm glad to see it hitting more widespread adoption with TB3. (Was hit with a bit of nostalgia seeing the old LightPeak thread back then.)



Back when TB1 was rolling out on the Apple side and a few PCs, there was a few months of various firmware and driver updates to stabilize the new tech. TB3 is likely going through similar as more vendors come online and also sorting out the details of running over a new connector. Out of the box, an early adopter friend of mine had to get through a number of updates for the Razer Core before it worked. Things will likely stabilize for most vendors and devices by the end of the year or sooner.

That's clearly the ultimate answer to my initial post. It's frustrating, but I'll try to be patient

Ahh.. but Thunderbolt is just a fancy name for "PCIe expansion bus" (plus a few things). So driver support is actually simpler than it might be for USB connected devices. PCI(e) stuff is generally very well supported "out of the box" for most OSs that I know of, so Thunderbolt should "just work".

Meanwhile though, in case you missed it, that USB hub thingie you linked to earlier on, which I originally dismissed as probably doing video-over-USB (aka. "DisplayLink"), appears instead to be using "DisplayPort". Which means it gives you "native GPU" output for one extra monitor.

Cheers

They did it by providing a huge docking connector which exports the entire internal peripheral bus (PCI or PCIe) to the docking station, plus additional connections for power-input, ethernet, and external monitors from the internal GPU. The docking station can then add additional PCI/PCIe chips onto the bus to support extra ports (eg. serial/parallel, more USB root ports, whatever).

Thunderbolt does mostly the same thing using far fewer pins, and tries to standardize it.

EDIT: My main machine here is a Dell Precision M6300. It has an old school docking station (fantastic!), but also has an ExpressCard slot --> essentially a hot-plugable PCIe 1X expansion slot. I use that slot to add eSATA ports, USB-3.0 ports, a real bus Serial Port, and other nefarious add-ons as needed.

ThunderBolt is the new version of that slot, on steroids!

Cheers

It was a bit surprising that Windows didn't support Thunderbolt all that well until Windows 10 and TB3. Windows has decent hot plug PCI support since 2000, but they didn't put the effort into moving that over to Thunderbolt until recently.

Macs that dual booted into Windows 7/8 had some limits including not being able to sleep among other issues. Microsoft's lack of support left it to Apple and Intel to try and handle at the driver level as best they could, and it's likely why so many early Lightpeak demos were all running on OS X or Linux.

Came across this detailing the Windows support being built into 10: http://www.synthtopia.com/content/2016/0...-in-windows-10/

That site ended up linking to some docs for Thunderbolt considerations with audio drivers on Win10.

I suspect the confusion has only just begun for regular people who just want things to work.

Even Benson Leung commented on the article.

My new 2016 MacBook Pro 15" is about to arrive and I am looking for the correct 'cables' to connect a pair of (well, three, actually) HDMI displays. Not so easy to work out which is the optimal selection.
In the meantime I have ordered three of these Aukey USB C to HDMI adapters

4K displays will be replacing the current HD+ HDMI monitors so looking for cables than can work at 4K.



OWC's announced Thunderbolt 3 dock has been pre-ordered but shipping is forecast for next February.

Just when you think USB-C cables can't get more confusing...

The USB-C cable that comes with the new MacBook Pro, to connect it to its charger, doesn't not function as a USB-C - USB-C 3.x data cable. It does however function as a USB 2 data cable

It of course looks like every other USB-C to USB-C cable.

I suggest working out a labelling scheme and attaching a very clear label to every single 'USB-C and Thunderbolt 3' cable right out of the package.

Label the ports on the laptop too
Decoding the tiny USB/DisplayPort/Thunderbolt/Power Delivery logos, if they are even present/correct, is error prone.

USB.org provides this helpful list of USB-C cables

I used Google Translate from the original German, this article describes how to tell the various USB-C ports apart.


From Intel.



Note the tiny 3 near the squiggly Thunderbolt marking.

I just bought the Dell WD15 dock for my XPS 13. It's pretty nice, but I'm having some trouble with the setup and I wondered if you folks might have some advice.

I've connected my Dell 3007WFP display via a mini displayport to DVI adapter (I can see why this might be the issue). It works, but I'm only getting a max of half the native resolution of the monitor. I'm stuck at 1280x800 instead of 2560x1600.

Does anyone know if it's the adapter or something else? From the specs of the dock it looks like this should be more than feasible using the mini display port, but I've probably missed something...

Ugh, nevermind, I figured out the problem I guess. I don't think I'll be able to do what I want. My adapter isn't dual link, so it can only go up to 1920x1200. There are active dual link adapters out there that appear to require power over a USB connection, but they all cost around $90-100, and I just shelled out $135 for the dock. At this point I'd rather sell my trusty old 30" fluorescent backlit monitor and get a newer LED model than waste a hundred bucks on an adapter.

If anyone has a suggestion I'd love to hear it. Feeling pretty disappointed right now...

FWIW, I've ordered myself a 13" MacBook Pro and haunted the Amazon reviews for adapters that should work properly with it. This was more complicated than I thought it would be. I ended up with:

Assorted adapter dongles:
https://www.amazon.com/Dell-Adapter-Type-Ethernet-470-ABQN/dp/B012DT6KW2/
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B019R9KAUE/

(Nobody makes a single dongle that has everything, so I'm instead getting two different dongles that each seem to do useful things.)

Charging cables (2x):
https://www.amazon.com/Griffin-BreakSafe-Magnetic-Breakaway-Chromebook/dp/B01CQTK6GU/

Spare charger (half the cost of the same thing from Apple):
https://www.amazon.com/Anker-Delivery-Charger-PowerPort-MacBook/dp/B01M19TP4H/

And, of course, after I order that Anker thing, there's an Amazon review for it saying that it's not compliant with all the USB-C PD specs. Arrrggggh.

Heh, I've actually used both of those adapters on a few clients' XPS 13 laptops. They're pretty good. I'll be curious about the compatibility of the Dell adapter with the MacBook. Please report back on that.


The Dell WD15 dock does have everything I wanted. The problem is my monitor. It only has two connections on it, dual-link DVI and VGA, and the DVI is the one that gets me the full resolution. But I guess there's no such thing as mini displayport to dual link DVI, unless I'm not thinking about this setup correctly, in which case someone please correct me. It's frustrating because I used to have this problem with lesser video cards on older computers, but now I supposedly have a connector capable of 4K resolutions, but it can't do this in between one.

Please, I'm hoping someone will say "no, dummy, this $10-30 cable/adapter will get you what you want!" So...there's your queue?

Dual-link DVI was a very short-lived item, as was Apple's ADC (DVI + power on the same connector). Supporting those going forward? You're basically doomed.

I just upgraded my video card to one that only had one HDMI and then three DisplayPorts on it. Only problem was that my monitors were old enough to need HDMI (or DVI), so I ended up just upgrading them to something more modern.

It always seems like small, simple upgrades have unintended consequences for me.

Does this help?

That's what I'm concluding. Looks like I got stuck in an in-between state. My monitor's 2560x1600 resolution is very uncommon these days.


Isn't that the truth! I had totally forgotten about the dual-link DVI issue. I now remember running into it the last time I upgraded my desktop. I ordered a lower-end graphics card because I don't game much, but it didn't support dual-link so I had to swap it for a better one. Annoying.


Unfortunately, all that does is make me conclude that it isn't worth it. In fact, It tells me that I underestimated the equipment necessary for this. I'd have to do this in two steps instead of one, and it'll probably cost around $200 just for the adapters.

Given that and the cost of the Dell dock, I'm starting to weigh all my options. USB C monitors are still really expensive. I'd love something like this LG model, but $700 is a lot.

The other options, though, aren't much cheaper. The least expensive decent 4K monitor I can see on Amazon is around $370. That and the Dell adapter cost about $510. At that point I'd honestly consider spending the extra $200 for the USB C monitor.

Or, I could go with a lower resolution but smaller monitor. The problem is that I've been spoiled. Going by PPI, my current 30" monitor is 100 ppi. My XPS 13 is 169ppi. A FHD 24" monitor is 91ppi, and it's noticeable to me. Maybe I sit too close, though

What monitors do you all use?

I went with a pair of ASUS MG28UQ which is the AMD FreeSync supported 28" 4k monitor. It was quite an upgrade from my old 24" 1920x1200 monitors.

That one looks nice. I've been looking at this Samsung because it's a hundred dollars cheaper and I don't need the USB hub built into the monitor. I still don't know if it would be better to simply ditch everything I've gotten so far and bite the bullet on that LG I linked to earlier.

USB-C to DisplayPort or HDMI adapters are fairly inexpensive. With my MacBook Pro 15" I am currently using two Aukey CB-C37 USB-C to HDMI adapters to drive a pair of Asus PA328Q 4K displays.



I intend to switch to the OWC Thunderbolt 3 to DisplayPort dock sometime in the next few months.

Those USB-C adapters don't help me, though. They can't output to my dual-link DVI monitor. I would also lose the ability to have a single-cable solution, which is what I've been looking for since the start of this thread. It's frustrating that I keep giving up features and I still can't get things to work with this fancy new technology. Crazy.

The OWC dock looks great, but I'm starting to give up on the dock idea. The Dell dock is giving me some serious problems, and I'm not even doing anything crazy with it. I'm not sure what's going on, but I'm having the most frustrating time getting my Logitech gear to play nicely with it. I can almost never get it to work right on the first try, and I'm without keyboard and mouse until I either restart or at least unplug and plug back in the USB C cable. And even then, for some reason Logitech's Setpoint software forgets all adjustments I make to the mouse buttons, which is a huge deal breaker for me.

I think I'm in one of those bad early adopter situations...

Only 24 or 30Hz though. I use a DisplayPort 4k at 30Hz for office and even some CAD and it's OK though.

I'm now researching the same things as in this thread, and I'm coming away more confused than when I started.

Here's what I understand so far, someone correct me if I'm wrong:

- If you have a laptop with USB3, then your option for a docking station is one with DisplayLink drivers.

- If you have a laptop with Thunderbolt ports using a USBC cable, then you could use a DisplayLink docking station like above, or, to be even more fancy, you could get a Thunderbolt docking station and then the displays could go straight from the plug to the monitors, without having to go through the DisplayLink driver.

- Nobody makes docks with both. It's either one or the other.

Am I right about the above?

Here's what I have, and what I want to do...

- I've got two 1920x1080 HDMI/DVI monitors I'm using right now. I might upgrade them someday.

- I've got a USB3 Windows 8.1 laptop.

- I've got a USB3 DisplayLink dock, which drives two displays (albeit limited to 1920x1080 or very close to it, and I occasionally see mild data compression artifacts from DisplayLink on them).

- On its way to me via UPS is a new Macbook Pro, arriving in a few days (I finally pulled the trigger and I'm swiching to Mac for audio production while I'm between album projects).

- I want a dock that allows me to plug either the Macbook or the Windows 8.1 laptop into it (at different times, not at the same time) and will use both monitors, the existing mouse/keyboard, and whatever USB peripherals are plugged into the dock.


I have already verified that my existing setup (USB3 DisplayLink dock with two HDMI/DVI monitors) works fine in the way that I want. I have plugged friends' macs into it and, as long as we install the DisplayLink drivers onto the mac, it works. I can freely switch between the Windows box and the Mac box by merely unplugging one and plugging in the other. So I've got something that will work for now.

But if I ever want to upgrade my displays to something higher than 1920x1080, or if I ever want to take advantage of the Thunderbolt connection on the Mac to drive the displays directly, I'll need to upgrade the dock. The problem is that, I think, from my research so far, if I do that, then the Windows 8.1 laptop will no longer be able to use the displays on the new dock. Am I correct about that?

Is there any solution that will work with both kinds of devices?

I haven't looked specifically for what you are after but my understanding is that you are right. There are no docks that switch between DisplayPort pass through over Thunderbolt 3 and DisplayLink over USB2/3/3.1/whatever.

I'm not sure a Thunderbolt 3 hub can plug into a conventional USB2/3.x port to start with and that's ignoring any of the video issues.

I reckon most people wouldn't want to pay for both solutions in one dock.

Note that DisplayLink can go higher than 1920x1080 (I think the old limit was 2048x1152 actually). I see there's even a 4k 60Hz capable one now:
http://support.displaylink.com/knowledgebase/articles/525038-displaylink-display-resolution-support

So maybe just use USB 3.1 (hopefully 3.1 Gen 2 so you get 10 Gbps instead of 5) with a DisplayLink dock or a couple of DisplayLink adapters?

I haven't seen any hubs with that latest 4k 60Hz chipset yet but haven't looked at them for a few months. Expect it to take a while to filter through based on previous experiences.

Something like this:
http://www.targus.com/us/displaylink-and...lagship-chipset

Thanks very much for that information, Shonky.

I had indeed seen that Targus unit at the DisplayLink web site (they link to it on this page), and I will probably upgrade to it, or something like it with the new 4k/60hz chipset at least, if I get new displays.

Do any of these USB3 docks support charging a Macbook plugged into it? Or am I destined for a second power cable as long as I'm tied down to DisplayLink?

I don't see any mention of it, but you are looking for USB-C Power Delivery.

Quickly looking at the ones on that page only the older 4k 30Hz type devices seem to support PD.

Doesn't look to be an all in one solution unfortunately.

For now, I've somewhat given up looking for a Thunderbolt 3 dock with DP passthrough at 60Hz, power delivery and that's a subset of what you want.

Two cables isn't really that much of a problem is it?

No, two cables is not that much of a problem. I'm already doing two cables for the Windows box. I was just thinking that, if a one-cable solution existed, it could be one of the data points in my search for a dock.

I received this update on March 8 from OWC.
I must admit to not fully researching the chipset(s) being used for the various ThunderBolt 3 docks, but perhaps there is only a single chipset vendor, Intel. If so, it may still be early days regarding what will be docks will be available when and with which exact capabilities.

I don't think any of the Thunderbolt 3 docks with PD are shipping yet. Not sure about USB-C docks with PD.

Dell WD15 is USB-C and does PD
Dell TB15 could do PD but was plagued with issues.
Dell TB16 (seems to be TB15 replacement) looks like it's available

So I think there's a few around, but only slowly coming through.