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#74360 - 23/02/2002 18:46 TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc.
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
Everybody here probably knows the debate. If you want to get digital TV signals today, and you've got your HDTV-ready set, it still sucks to be you.

You can buy DirecTV with TiVo or UltimateTV. This gives you all the great time shifting features you could ever want. But, you don't get component output, and you don't get hi-def signals. (Let's ignore the ReplayTV 4000 for now, since it doesn't have digital input from the sateliltes -- a deal-killing bug for me. I want to minimize the number of digital->analog->digital roundtrips taken by my TV signal.)

You can buy a (much more expensive) HDTV decoder. This gives you beautiful signals. But, you can't time shift (or, you have to spend even more insane amounts of money on a digital VHS deck that may or may not be instantly obsolete).



My solution has been to stick my head in the sand and suck it up with my VCR an analog cable TV. I get decent-enough quality with my progressive scan DVD player. But, now I feel like I've been forced to make a decision because I want to watch Jeremiah, the new show written by JMS. It's only on Showtime. Getting Showtime from my analog cable vendor would require me to upgrade to their (lame) digital service which costs more money and gives arguably lower quality signals than their analog service (yes, it's really that ugly). The show starts March 3. This eliminates the Moxi / Dish combination from consideration, for the moment, because it's not for sale yet.

My current temptation is to spend $200 with AmericanSatellite, getting myself the Phillips/DIrecTiVo unit plus the elliptical dish suitable for future hi-def signals.

So, is this really the best compromise given today's shambling mess of digital television? My hope is that, in a year or two, I'll ditch the cheap TiVo box to replace it with some sort of bigger-better-faster-stronger hi-def DirecTiVo (or ReplayTV or Moxi or whatever equivalent).

Other random questions:

Is the elliptical dish for DirecTV the same hardware as the one used for Dish? Could I switch later?

Does the DishPVR suck? Dish would cost a good bit less money than DirecTV, but you get this box that's destined to be orphaned in favor of the future Moxi box.

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#74361 - 23/02/2002 19:35 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: DWallach]
drakino
carpal tunnel

Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
Well first of all, by years end, Dish Networks should have an HDTV PVR box out according to their last tech chat. Biggest hurdle right now is drive size, but by the end of the year, the space needed should be pretty cheep.

Is the elliptical dish for DirecTV the same hardware as the one used for Dish? Could I switch later?

I'm not sure how compatible it all is. One thing though, watch the merger carefully. If it goes through (Dish and DirecTv) customers on both sides won't have to pay any "upgrade" prices if the equipment changes. I am sure that Dish will standardize on their equipment, as it follows closer to what is used in many other places.

Does the DishPVR suck? Dish would cost a good bit less money than DirecTV, but you get this box that's destined to be orphaned in favor of the future Moxi box.

Yes and no. It offers no Tivo like show picking (though I have never seen this feature in action), and search is still in the pipeline (should be implemented by spring, via a T9 input like the empeg). And show recording could use some improvement compaired to what I have on the DishPlayer (the bastard child of the MS + Echostar arrangement that has since been abandoned by MS to work on UltimateTV). My upgrade plan right now is to wait on the Moxi player to replace my DishPlayer. But if I had to choose right now, I'd probably go with the DirecTiVo box, since it offers dual tuners (Dish has a box on the way soon, but it's not out now).

For HDTV, it should definitly improve if the merger occurs, since they will have tons of satelite bandwith to play with.

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#74362 - 23/02/2002 20:53 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: drakino]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
Has anybody played with the Mediamatics PVR software for a PC? Is it any good? Is it worth trying to shoehorn a PC next to my TV (versus the benefit of the nice, integrated, point-and-shoot TiVo solution)?

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#74363 - 23/02/2002 22:46 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: DWallach]
robricc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/10/2000
Posts: 4931
Loc: New Jersey, USA
Is the elliptical dish for DirecTV the same hardware as the one used for Dish? Could I switch later?

No, the DirecTV elliptical dish is that shape because it accepts signals from two different locations on the horizon. All of Dish Network's regular satellites are in the same location so their dish is only available in the round variety. They do have a satellite that is in a totally different direction. From what I know it carries certain local channels and maybe HDTV (I am not positive on Dish Network satellite locations). Picking up this satellite would require you to use two round dishes.

DirecTiVo series2 is on the horizon (holiday season 2002). However, I would get a series1 box while they're still available and under $100. Don't get the lifetime subscription since the Series2 box will be out by the end of the year and lifetime sub only pays when you keep the equipment over 2 years.

On DirecTV the only HD channels are a couple of the HBO channels and some pay per views. Showtime is not available in HD.

DirecTiVo Series2 should be similar in functionality to the Replay4000. It has 2 USB ports that allow for installation of a NIC and sharing programs between players. There is no word on wether it will support HD signals though.

I have a DirecTiVo on a 46" rear projection HDTV and it doesn't suck, but it's not that good. You see digital artifacts nearly all the time. However, they are not nearly as bad as Comcast digital cable I saw recently.

UltimateTV is no longer. There will be no new hardware coming out from Microshaft as far as I know. Also, the Dishplayer was designed with Microsoft so they are essentially the same thing. The UltimateTV UI is a bit different though.

My current temptation is to spend $200 with AmericanSatellite, getting myself the Phillips/DIrecTiVo unit plus the elliptical dish suitable for future hi-def signals.

This is what I would do.
_________________________
-Rob Riccardelli
80GB 16MB MK2 090000736

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#74364 - 24/02/2002 00:49 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: robricc]
drakino
carpal tunnel

Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
All of Dish Network's regular satellites are in the same location so their dish is only available in the round variety.

Nope. I have the Dish 500 elliptical dish that picks up satelites at 110 and 119. The non main ones are at 61.5 and 148, and those carry many international stations, plus provide coverage for Alaska, Hawaii, and other remote places. Most of the locals are carried on one of the two main, along with some HDTV I believe.

I have a DirecTiVo on a 46" rear projection HDTV and it doesn't suck, but it's not that good. You see digital artifacts nearly all the time.

Yet another benefit of the merger is that they plan on addressing this by not compressing everthing as much, since there will be 14 total satelites under the new company. Right now, each side has 6, with Echostar launching 2 more soon.

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#74365 - 24/02/2002 01:44 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: drakino]
robricc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/10/2000
Posts: 4931
Loc: New Jersey, USA
Nope. I have the Dish 500 elliptical dish that picks up satelites at 110 and 119.

I stand corrected but the dish is still round. I guess 110 and 119 are close enough to only require the use of a slightly larger round dish.

The elliptical DirecTV dishes receive 101, 110, and 119. 101 being the main bird and 119 serving up HDTV, some local markets, NASA channel, and a slew of spanish language stations. IIRC the 110 DirecTV location is going almost entirely unused. 110 is only supported as an add-on kit (LNB and proper multiswitch is not included with elliptical dishes).
_________________________
-Rob Riccardelli
80GB 16MB MK2 090000736

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#74366 - 24/02/2002 09:43 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: robricc]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
Yup, when you buy the elliptical dish today, it comes with two LNB's and a slot to install a third. The third LNB is only $50 and (if I read the web site correctly) wouldn't require running a third wire to your set-top box, making it a very simple install.

I didn't know that they decided to kill UltimateTV. Interestingly, I went yesterday to two local dealers (both big chains) that were listed on the TiVo web site as carrying the DirecTiVo. Neither one had it. One said that he'd never sold one so they recently sent them back. All he had was the RCA UltimateTV. The other dealer had both RCA and Sony UltimateTV as well as the Sony DirecTiVo. Prices were typically 2x what you can find online. Big surprise that nobody buys them locally, but this means that fewer people get exposed to the coolness of PVR when the stores stop carrying them.

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#74367 - 24/02/2002 10:01 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: DWallach]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
Okay, I just did it. DirecTiVo, here I come.

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#74368 - 24/02/2002 11:34 Re: TiVo vs. UltimateTV vs. HDTV, etc. [Re: robricc]
drakino
carpal tunnel

Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
Oh, oops. The Dish 500 is 20 inches compaired to the normal 18, but is still round. I'm thinking of the elliptical Starband + DishNetworks dish


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