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#349305 - 02/12/2011 12:55 thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap
Daria
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
long i've promised my wife a media device in the bathroom so while she's using the jacuzzi she can watch. long have i not finished it, because getting a computer built out was taking too long.

finally, decided yesterday to wall-mount an LCD panel, install an AppleTV and be done. The panel I had tho, had no HDMI, and all HDMI to (VGA, DVI) devices are at least one of expensive, huge (converting receivers), or not reliable enough to drop money on (the monoprice $40 hdmi to vga converter... does it rescale? is there a left-shift issue? shrug)

so i found a refurb LED LCD panel on pcconnection for under $100, and they had the appletv on sale yesterday. boom. smart tv for under $200. if only there were a way to use tivo mrv on it... but otherwise, she should be happy, and our budget will be too.

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#349307 - 02/12/2011 14:10 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Daria]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
For the price, I don't see how you could have done better. The alternative might be a cheap TV with built-in Internet-ish features. You can get a 40" Sony Google TV for ~$600.

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#349309 - 02/12/2011 14:22 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: DWallach]
peter
carpal tunnel

Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4172
Loc: Cambridge, England
FWIW, HDMI to DVI should be simple and cheap. The signalling is the same, it's just a connector-convertor.

Peter

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#349310 - 02/12/2011 14:42 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: DWallach]
Daria
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
Originally Posted By: DWallach
For the price, I don't see how you could have done better. The alternative might be a cheap TV with built-in Internet-ish features. You can get a 40" Sony Google TV for ~$600.


$600 was right out. 40" (even 32") wouldn't work in that bathroom. More importantly, if the display somehow reacts badly to a humid environment? $99 refurb. oh well. not horrible. $600? ow.

That said, we have the Insignia 32" Connected (which was less) in our living room. Works well.

I'm tempted to try Seas0nPass again, see if I can downgrade it to Apple TV 4.3 so it can boot untethered, and get Plex going on it for her also, at which point the TiVoToGo plugin *might* work.

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#349311 - 02/12/2011 14:44 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: peter]
Daria
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
Originally Posted By: peter
FWIW, HDMI to DVI should be simple and cheap. The signalling is the same, it's just a connector-convertor.

Peter


At that price I might be willing to try. Of course, the old display was only a 17" and the new one is a 22", so I don't feel horrible about the new plan (also the old one isn't LED backlit, so there should be lasting savings) but having a portable HDMI-capable display might be worthwhile.

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#349312 - 02/12/2011 16:42 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Daria]
Phoenix42
veteran

Registered: 21/03/2002
Posts: 1424
Loc: MA but Irish born
Originally Posted By: dbrashear
if only there were a way to use tivo mrv on it...


I too wish Tivo work offer a box (or a channel on) akin to a Roku or Apple TV that would stream from a Tivo. Their Preview is close, but currently only available from some cable companies, and leases for $10/month I believe.


Edited by Phoenix42 (02/12/2011 16:52)
Edit Reason: typo

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#349314 - 02/12/2011 19:41 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Phoenix42]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
I've shifted my opinions on TiVo. I used to wish that TiVo would come out with newer/better equipment. Now, I just wish that somebody else would come out with a DVR.

Of course, the core TiVo patent was filed in 1998. We've got several years left until it (and the related ReplayTV patent) expire. I fear nobody will want to get into the game until those patents expire, maybe 7 years from now.

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#349315 - 02/12/2011 19:50 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: DWallach]
robricc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/10/2000
Posts: 4931
Loc: New Jersey, USA
I'm just going to toss it out there that I've been using a Windows 7 box with Ceton InfiniTV PCIe cablecard tuner for about 3 months now. While it's not something I would put in my parent's house, a techie shouldn't have a problem using it as their primary DVR/media hub.

I have the main machine with the cablecard hooked directly up to my living room LCD through onboard HDMI (Intel HD graphics). My bedroom uses an Xbox360 to stream from the main computer. It has the ability to watch live tv, watch recorded TV, schedule recordings, and almost anything else you could do from the main box.

This setup replaced a Moxi 3-tuner DVR with one Mate. It's a big upgrade from that.
_________________________
-Rob Riccardelli
80GB 16MB MK2 090000736

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#349316 - 02/12/2011 20:31 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: DWallach]
drakino
carpal tunnel

Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
I see DVRs as a legacy device, something from an era when it was actually difficult to watch shows when you wanted to. Kinda like how iPods and other dedicated MP3 players feel like legacy now in an era of multiple gigabyte phones and streaming solutions. For the masses that still subscribe to the typical cable or satellite solution, most just opt for the provider DVR. The very tech savvy are moving to other solutions via the internet. That leaves very little market for a new player to combat TiVo these days.

I was quite impressed recently when I was able to just prop up my iPad at the Denver Airport, tethered to my phone in my pocket, to watch the end of the Avalanche hockey game that night. Prior to being in a convenient spot to watch, the same app used was also pushing me score and power play announcements. I imagine it's only a matter of time before handegg, err American Football is also available in such a way. At a price of course, but it will be an option. Over the past 6 years of being cable free, I've spent less, and consumed more quality content then when I had various subscription plans. I've also wasted less time, as most of my content is just commercial free as is.

Of course YMMV in any conversion from subscription TV via cable/satellite to other solutions. In general though, I see then trend accelerating now that we have more "screens" around us, and less dedicated TV/Computer display devices.

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#349317 - 02/12/2011 21:07 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: drakino]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
You're right Rob, but the problem is that the TiVo is actually usable. My wife and my 6-yr. old daughter have no problem operating it.

For contrast, we got a Sony/Google TV for our lab, and the remote control on that thing is intimidating. They cleverly decided to mount an optical mouse upside down in the right button, so you can use your thumb over it kinda like a track ball. After that, though, it's just a sea of buttons. His Steveness would never approve.

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#349318 - 02/12/2011 21:28 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: drakino]
robricc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/10/2000
Posts: 4931
Loc: New Jersey, USA
Originally Posted By: drakino
I imagine it's only a matter of time before handegg, err American Football is also available in such a way. At a price of course, but it will be an option.

It's possible already... for a price. Since DirecTV somehow owns the entire out-of-market NFL experience, you can buy Sunday Ticket from DirecTV for $350. This allows streaming to mobile devices. You don't have to be a DirecTV subscriber. I set this up a friend of mine with endless pockets. He's apparently pleased with it.

I can't wait for the day cable TV companies become just a dumb pipe for data. I have a pretty minimal television plan, but it still includes a bunch of stuff I never watch.
_________________________
-Rob Riccardelli
80GB 16MB MK2 090000736

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#349325 - 03/12/2011 13:50 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: robricc]
msaeger
carpal tunnel

Registered: 23/09/2000
Posts: 3608
Loc: Minnetonka, MN
Quote:
I can't wait for the day cable TV companies become just a dumb pipe for data.


I am sure we will just end up paying them the same as we do for now for internet and tv because they will just keep charging more for the internet part. We don't have a cap here but I know some cable companies do already.
_________________________

Matt

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#349326 - 03/12/2011 14:25 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: msaeger]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
In the mid-1990's, lots of people were talking about "video on demand" or interactive TV-like technologies. Today, particularly considering things like AT&T's Uverse, we're actually capable of doing it at reasonable prices and large scale. The question is how it will shake out. In a system like Uverse, I believe they have their own fancy CDN to get the content out to the edges. How many vendors would be willing/able to build out the necessary CDN infrastructure, never mind co-location issues?

For now, it's the people who own the wires who can do the content distribution at scale. I fear that isn't going to change much in the next few years.

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#349336 - 04/12/2011 04:33 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: peter]
altman
carpal tunnel

Registered: 19/05/1999
Posts: 3457
Loc: Palo Alto, CA
Originally Posted By: peter
FWIW, HDMI to DVI should be simple and cheap. The signalling is the same, it's just a connector-convertor.


...just as long as the DVI-D has HDCP support. Not all do!

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#349348 - 05/12/2011 12:44 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: DWallach]
Phoenix42
veteran

Registered: 21/03/2002
Posts: 1424
Loc: MA but Irish born
Originally Posted By: robricc
I'm just going to toss it out there that I've been using a Windows 7 box with Ceton InfiniTV PCIe cablecard tuner for about 3 months now. While it's not something I would put in my parent's house, a techie shouldn't have a problem using it as their primary DVR/media hub.


Originally Posted By: DWallach
You're right Rob, but the problem is that the TiVo is actually usable. My wife and my 6-yr. old daughter have no problem operating it.


I'm in the same boat as Dan, if it isn't easy and trouble free for my wife and kids to use, it is not going to be used.

Given the pricing of Roku, $50, it makes for a very cheap extender to something like Plex, and using something like kmttg one could automatically export the programs one is interested in from the Tivo.

edit:
Plex has a Tivo app that
Quote:
The tivo plugin lets plex play shows directly off your tivo. Requires an activated Series 2, Series 3, or Tivo HD.
You provide your Media Access Key, it lists the shows on your tivo, you pick one and watch it.

So in theory this should be do-able, assuming everything plays nice...

The front end would be easy, the back end less so. Everything is do able, it is just a case of time and money. I'd happily send Tivo a once off payment of $100 to $200 to make it plug and play.


Edited by Phoenix42 (05/12/2011 14:33)
Edit Reason: Added info on Plex Tivo app

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#349351 - 05/12/2011 15:22 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Phoenix42]
Daria
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
Yeah, I was scoping the Plex plugin earlier in this thread. If the AppleTv can be untethered jailbroke, I will put plex on it, disable updates, and poof, for now my wife gets a thin TiVo-enabled client. Done.

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#349352 - 05/12/2011 15:27 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Daria]
Phoenix42
veteran

Registered: 21/03/2002
Posts: 1424
Loc: MA but Irish born
Doh! So you did, I didn't connect the dot.
Do update us on how it goes.

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#349353 - 05/12/2011 15:43 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Phoenix42]
Phoenix42
veteran

Registered: 21/03/2002
Posts: 1424
Loc: MA but Irish born
Looks like it is a no-go for me, unless I get an Apple:

Originally Posted By: Scyber
That wiki page is out of date. I've kinda "inherited" the tivo plex plugin. The original dev is no longer actively working on it. I made some changes to get it to work with Plex 9, but that is as far as I've gotten so far.

There are currently some serious limitations to the plex plugin. The primary one is that it is currently limited to OSX plex media server installs. The plugin uses OSX specific command line programs to discover and browse tivos. I actually had a version working on windows for discovery and browsing. But I was never able to get streaming to work correctly. The version I had working was using an all python based code for discover and browsing. So it should in theory work on Windows, Linux, and OSX.

My ultimate goal would be to get the Tivo Plugin working well enough so that I can use a Roku as a thin client on a TV w/o a Tivo. In theory all of the pieces are there, its just a matter of getting the all working together.

Thread post.

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#349373 - 06/12/2011 09:14 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Phoenix42]
tahir
pooh-bah

Registered: 27/02/2004
Posts: 1896
Loc: London
The Roku unit looks quite nice. Netflix launching in UK soon apparently. Only problem is my crap ADSL, don't know when they'll upgrade us.

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#349375 - 06/12/2011 11:57 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: tahir]
Phoenix42
veteran

Registered: 21/03/2002
Posts: 1424
Loc: MA but Irish born
How crappy is your ADSL? A quick check says Netflix needs at minimum a steady 1.5Mbps, 3 for DVD quality, and 5 for HD. We consumer ~90gigs of data a month, most of that is Netflix streaming, so if you have bandwidth caps bear that in mind.

I'd be interested in hearing how the selection on Netflix UK is.

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#349376 - 06/12/2011 12:13 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Phoenix42]
tahir
pooh-bah

Registered: 27/02/2004
Posts: 1896
Loc: London
1.5Mbps would be a good day, even crappy videos off YouTube freeze here.

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#349394 - 06/12/2011 23:56 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: tahir]
Daria
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
I suppose I should look to see what the Plex TiVo plugin uses in terms of binaries; maybe they can be ported to iOS.

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#349421 - 08/12/2011 04:44 Re: thin client smart tv-ish on the cheap [Re: Daria]
Daria
carpal tunnel

Registered: 24/01/2002
Posts: 3937
Loc: Providence, RI
mDNS colrm grep sort uniq tivodecode curl, and python needs HTTPServer among other things. i bet plex already needed it.

tivodecode is in all likelihood the only thing not already in cydia.

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