And I don't want to speak for Tony and/or misrepresent him, either. I was just throwing my impressions out there. For *me* (and that's just me) being mad about the process that got us to war while ultimately being for this particular war once underway (if that's a fair summary) is a bit puzzling under the circumstances.

I understand your confusion. And yes, my view is more "trees" than "forest." Whatever got us into this, we're now in it, and we need to accomplish our objectives. Once it's done, there will be plenty of time to worry about which particular set of Arabs now hates us even more than they did previously.

Your mammoth post from a few days ago paints a very good picture of all of the ulterior motives and right-wing shadiness that has put us where we are now. I don't disagree with any of your conclusions, and I share many of your fears about the future, and how we'll look back on this war. I just don't see the point of wallowing in a fatalist view of things to come. With so much on the line right now, I am doing my best to see ways to turn this into a net gain.

Or maybe I'm just really, really naive.