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#148681 - 15/03/2003 13:42 Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone?
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14491
Loc: Canada
Well, now that my docks are shipping, and the backlit button kits don't seem to be, I'd like to gauge interest in doing backlit buttons via the "pinhole" method described elsewhere on this BBS.

Basically, this would involve me supplying and installing the 4-gang resistor pack and four button LEDs, and drilling small holes through the tips of the existing grey player buttons to let the light through. These small pinholes would then be patched smooth and flush with dabs of clear epoxy, which would still let some light through.

It may even be possible to have a single LED placed under the knob too, with a few pinholes there as well.

The fee for this service would likely be around US$60-75 or so, parts and labour included, return shipping not included (those LEDs are very pricey, wow!). As with the button kit installs, you would remove the display board from your unit, send it to me, and I would do the installation and return it via shipping method of your choice.

Nothing definite yet, just checking the level of interest. I will be doing this to one of my own players for sure. And there's nothing about this that would prevent later retrofit of Brian's translucent button caps or full knob kits.

??


Edited by mlord (15/03/2003 13:43)

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#148682 - 15/03/2003 13:57 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
phi144
enthusiast

Registered: 15/02/2002
Posts: 314
Loc: New Hampshire, USA
I would be interested in this. When you are done with yours could we see some pics?

Thanks!
_________________________
Doug

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#148683 - 15/03/2003 14:37 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: phi144]
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14491
Loc: Canada
Yeah, after I solder my own together, I'll post pics. Another week or two from now, maybe. Meanwhile.. You've Got Mail!

-ml

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#148684 - 15/03/2003 14:39 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
phi144
enthusiast

Registered: 15/02/2002
Posts: 314
Loc: New Hampshire, USA
You've Got Mail!


Back at ya!


Edited by phi144 (15/03/2003 14:39)
_________________________
Doug

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#148685 - 15/03/2003 14:59 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
Tim
veteran

Registered: 25/04/2000
Posts: 1525
Loc: Arizona
That sounds great. I would be interested in a couple of sets.

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#148686 - 15/03/2003 15:35 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
mdavey
enthusiast

Registered: 06/03/2003
Posts: 269
Loc: Wellingborough, UK
My local model shop sells fluorescent, coloured and clear perspex rod in diameters from 1mm to 5mm in 0.5mm steps. It might be a good alternative to filling the drilled hole with epoxy (you'll probably still need epoxy to keep it in place).

Once cut to length, simply polish with ever finer grades of sandpaper or wet-n-dry emery paper before fixing in place.
_________________________
Michael
Ex-owner of stolen empeg #030102741

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#148687 - 15/03/2003 16:08 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
SE_Sport_Driver
carpal tunnel

Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
Mark, you should toss together one site that has links to all the services you offer. Even it they are just links to BBS threads so you don't have to update the site a lot. You do button kit installs, docking stations and maybe tuner assembly?
_________________________
Brad B.

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#148688 - 15/03/2003 16:12 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
genixia
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/02/2002
Posts: 3411
I'm still hunting through the linux kernel for the 'time machine' code that must be there.
_________________________
Mk2a 60GB Blue. Serial 030102962 sig.mp3: File Format not Valid.

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#148689 - 15/03/2003 16:14 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
thrasher
enthusiast

Registered: 10/01/2002
Posts: 362
that would be nice to have.when ever your ready,you can do both of mine.
_________________________
040103958 60g

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#148690 - 15/03/2003 16:46 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: thrasher]
justinlarsen
old hand

Registered: 31/12/2001
Posts: 1109
Loc: Petaluma, CA
count me in, i like this method better.
_________________________
---- Justin Larsen

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#148691 - 15/03/2003 17:28 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
Caps
stranger

Registered: 09/07/2002
Posts: 52
Loc: Arizona, USA
I was thinking about doing something like this to match my other car buttons. My buttons are black with small white triangles. But they turn red at night.

Will these LED lights only turn on when the headlights are on?

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#148692 - 15/03/2003 17:32 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: Caps]
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14491
Loc: Canada
No, they're either always on, or always off, brightness is tunable via Hijack.

But they do "dim" when the headlights are on.

Cheers

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#148693 - 15/03/2003 18:10 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
fusto
addict

Registered: 27/12/2001
Posts: 504
Loc: Lummi Island, WA
I've been waiting about a year plus for my led kit to arrive from Brian, so count me in for at least one.
_________________________
...all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by.

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#148694 - 15/03/2003 20:10 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: fusto]
Shonky
pooh-bah

Registered: 12/01/2002
Posts: 2009
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
I've been on Brian's list for about a year now, so I've kinda given up hope. I understand the delays he is having - there's always something else to get done.

I will at least be interested to see how you do this Mark. Hugo's in Australia right now and has brought over some buttons for me to try this exact mod.
_________________________
Christian
#40104192 120Gb (no longer in my E36 M3, won't fit the E46 M3)

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#148695 - 15/03/2003 20:29 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: Shonky]
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14491
Loc: Canada
Yeah, I think this method is a good basic way to be able to operate the player while driving at night. Maybe I'll see you in Oz later in the year..

Cheers

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#148696 - 15/03/2003 20:33 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31594
Loc: Seattle, WA
These small pinholes would then be patched smooth and flush with dabs of clear epoxy, which would still let some light through.
Somewhere in this forum is a thread where I posted an "artist's conception" of a more advanced version of this. The idea was to make larger holes and fill them with translucent epoxy, not just pinholes. I don't think anyone ever tried it.

Unfortunately, I can't seem to locate the thread where I posted that picture. Anyone else got a link?
_________________________
Tony Fabris

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#148697 - 15/03/2003 22:02 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: tfabris]
fusto
addict

Registered: 27/12/2001
Posts: 504
Loc: Lummi Island, WA
_________________________
...all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by.

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#148698 - 15/03/2003 22:07 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: fusto]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31594
Loc: Seattle, WA
Thanks! Guess my search-fu wasn't very good tonight.
_________________________
Tony Fabris

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#148699 - 15/03/2003 23:29 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: tfabris]
Waterman981
old hand

Registered: 14/02/2002
Posts: 804
Loc: Salt Lake City, UT
So I just decided to bust out the dremel and go to town. Here's what I have so far.


Attachments
146878-buttons.jpg (303 downloads)

_________________________
-Michael

#040103696 on a shelf
Mk2a - 90 GB - Red - Illuminated buttons

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#148700 - 16/03/2003 00:32 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: Waterman981]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31594
Loc: Seattle, WA
KEWL. Now to find the proper epoxy (or perhaps proper pigment to mix into clear epoxy) to make it complete...
_________________________
Tony Fabris

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#148701 - 16/03/2003 01:57 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
jane
enthusiast

Registered: 10/10/2000
Posts: 350
Loc: Copenhagen SW, Denmark
I would be interrested in just buying the kit.

Marius (Escort Cab + Mark II; 2CV + Mark 2a)

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#148702 - 16/03/2003 03:40 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
StigOE
addict

Registered: 27/10/2002
Posts: 568
Why use only one LED under the knob? People were complaining when there were three LEDs on Brian's kit because the light wasn't even enough.... Why not make up boards similar to Brian's new board, unless he has copyrights and won't let you use his design....?

Stig

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#148703 - 16/03/2003 07:46 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: jane]
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14491
Loc: Canada
If you want "just the kit", then order the resistor pack and LEDs yourself, directly from Digikey. The parts numbers have been posted on this BBS and (I think) on RioCar.Org recently. I believe minimum quantity is 10 on the resistor packs, and the LEDs are around $3-$5 each in singles.

Cheers

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#148704 - 16/03/2003 07:50 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: StigOE]
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14491
Loc: Canada
Why use only one LED under the knob? People were complaining when there were three LEDs on Brian's kit because the light wasn't even enough.... Why not make up boards similar to Brian's new board, unless he has copyrights and won't let you use his design....?


Well, the answer to your first question, why one LED, is that there appear to be leftover traces and mounting pads on the displayboard for one LED near the knob. I am hoping to use that for simple installation.

The answers to your second question are varied, but basically boil down to: (1) not interested, (2) not nice (I *am* Canadian, eh), (3) tfabris has a better knob solution anyway, that could be assembled and sold as an install-yourself kit, and (4) I'm trying to keep this simple enough that I don't lose too much money on it (when I'm soldering or gluing docks, I'm not hacking Linux for a living.. guess which pays better?)

Cheers


Edited by mlord (16/03/2003 07:53)

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#148705 - 16/03/2003 10:05 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
mrfixit
enthusiast

Registered: 14/06/2002
Posts: 337
Does anyone know if they have any "spare" buttons left over? I have been thinking of doing this same thing with the buttons, but I don't want to use my original ones.
_________________________
Ben
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 40gig blue no illumination....yet
hijacked

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#148706 - 16/03/2003 10:28 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mrfixit]
andy
carpal tunnel

Registered: 10/06/1999
Posts: 5916
Loc: Wivenhoe, Essex, UK
I think Rob said they had thousands of spare buttons, but he might have been exagerating.
_________________________
Remind me to change my signature to something more interesting someday

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#148707 - 16/03/2003 10:46 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: andy]
fusto
addict

Registered: 27/12/2001
Posts: 504
Loc: Lummi Island, WA
Just a thought but maybe Mark could get a bulk load of buttons from the empeg guys, and roll the cost into the kit install. Cant imagine it would cost that much.
And that way those who wanted to keep their stock buttons intact could.
That is, if Mark wanted to go along with it and the empeg guys would be willing to send out some.
_________________________
...all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by.

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#148708 - 16/03/2003 10:50 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: fusto]
phi144
enthusiast

Registered: 15/02/2002
Posts: 314
Loc: New Hampshire, USA
Great idea, if all are willing.
_________________________
Doug

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#148709 - 16/03/2003 12:15 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: andy]
mrfixit
enthusiast

Registered: 14/06/2002
Posts: 337
Should I email Rob directly? I would like to get a couple sets of buttons/knobs.
_________________________
Ben
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 60gig green/Greenlights Buttons
mk2a 40gig blue no illumination....yet
hijacked

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#148710 - 16/03/2003 12:55 Re: Backlit "pinhole" buttons, anyone? [Re: mlord]
mlord
carpal tunnel

Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14491
Loc: Canada
there appear to be leftover traces and mounting pads on the displayboard for one LED near the knob. I am hoping to use that for simple installation.


Today I disassembled one of my players, and desoldered the IR daughterboard as well (the little PCB above the knob that holds the LED and two IR modules).

The traces on the main board that appeared to be for a resistor and LED are, in fact, for a resistor and LED. It appears that the original layout was to have the IR module on the main board (there are unused pads for it there), and the throbbling LED down below the knob, again on the main board. At some point, the design changed, and they added the tiny daughterboard to hold the LED in a new position, along with the IR receiver, and the new IRDA transceiver.

EDIT: Actually, there are also pads for the IRDA on the main display board as well.. so I wonder if the whole point of the daughterboard was just to move the throbbing LED to the top? Mmm.. no wonder this thing was expensive to build!

So, I soldered in a resistor (1K) and LED, and turned it on. Sure enough, it simply behaved identically to the regular throbbing LED. Then I cut the top trace from the new LED, and connected to the button illumination control signal, and.. it works just fine as such. Pics to follow.

Here's a photo of the main display board, with the IR daughterboard removed:


Attachments
146954-underneath.jpg (317 downloads)



Edited by mlord (16/03/2003 15:59)

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