I wouldn't be supprised if it's turned into a 6 lane highway for the entire 60 mile stretch soon.

The saddest part is that the people of Colorado are going to spend a great deal of money adding those lanes, when simple adherence to the rules (by the same people, might I add) would reduce traffic jams more effectively.


You want to hear something really scary? Sure I know you live in California and LA is the king of traffic jams, but I live in the D.C. Metro area (I think we're second in that area), and we're doing something insane.

The VDOT (Virginia Department Of Transportaion) has begun an 8 year construction project on what is one of the worst interchanges in the country. By the end of those 8 years, they will have 113 bridges, and at one point the highway will be...get this:
24 LANES WIDE!!

And you know, I am absolutely sure that people will still be going 60 in the 11th lane and suddenly will have to get off on an exit in half a mile, swiping everyone in-between. I know this because, as a person I once knew said, "people are stupid".


Oh, and about only passing in the fast lane in Europe. I knew about that, and I think it's a great system. In fact, that's essentially what Tony and I are complaining about, only in that system (which i have observed everyone seems to do in Europe), it is assured that if you are going fast you won't get stopped by a slow-poke. I think it's great! But of course, that still doesn't mean that the drivers over there aren't as nuts as the ones we've got over here, but we do have a bigger population, and out of it we can draw more idiots that you can shake a stick at.

DiGNAN
13653

After reading about european drivers typically driving on the wrong side of the road I'm not so impressed any more. Where was that thread...?

Calvin

But it doesn't prevent people who are going faster than the "normal speed of traffic" from passing on the right, if they have an opening.

Right. The law has that provision so you don't get in trouble when you get frustrated and right-pass some yahoo going slow in the fast lane. I think you're right in that this is a difference between Europe and the US.

Of course, those people are probably breaking speed limit laws anyway...

Which is one of the things I complain about: the mindset that the "Keep Right" laws are somehow related to the speed limit, when they're not. Too many people think, "Well, I'm already going faster than the speed limit so I can drive in any lane I damn well please and I don't have to move over for anyone." You don't get that in Europe, I'll bet.

I freely admit that, if I exceed the speed limit, I'm breaking the law. But it's a different law.

I wonder if there are any studies comparing traffic jams in Europe with traffic jams in the US? I mean, there are times when a traffic jam can't be avoided at all: too much traffic merging into fewer lanes, construction zones, accidents, etc. But I've been in traffic jams that didn't include any of those elements, and I believe that stricter adherence to the lane rules would reduce those problems. Since the lane rules are practiced in Europe and not the US, I wonder if there's a way to prove that it's better by comparing the two? Do European cities need highways that are 24 lanes wide?

___________
Tony Fabris

But I've been in traffic jams that didn't include any of those elements, and I believe that stricter adherence to the lane rules would reduce those problems.

Oh god! I completely agree! I absolutely hate traffic jams that suddenly clear up for no explanation. I need blood! Hehe. Just kidding. But seriously, I have always believed your theory as to why we have these mindless traffic jams. People just don't realize that their speed in relation to everyone else has a major effect. One person slowing down too much causes a chain reaction, and pretty soon you've got a whole highway full of stop-and-go traffic.

And don't get me started on rubber-necking! That's my pet peeve! I once got in a 3 hour, 4 mile backup because every moron in front of me had been fixated on the guy with the flat tire on the side of the road! Arrrggghhh!!!

DiGNAN
13653

As much as I'm enjoying reading all these messages, I've gone over this topic so many times with friends, it's ridiculous. Needless to say, I agree with everyone on here. (Great pun, Geoff! I was really laughing out loud.) Too bad the bunch of us aren't the only ones on the roads!

George

Do European cities need highways that are 24 lanes wide?

I don't think our cities are wide enough to fit 24 lanes. .




Roger - not necessarily speaking for empeg

They do this on the busiest section (usually 8 lanes, but is 6 in some places) of the M25. Sections get assigned dynamic speed limits to ease congestion, and there are speed cameras to catch you above *every lane* each 1/2 a mile or so.

It seems to work most of the time...

Hugo

I should mention that the construction on this interchange I was mentioning is almost entirely neccessary. It is an enormous traffic jam everyday (I'm glad I don't have to drive it). There is no merge area on any of the roads and the highway is poorly planned. This is mainly for those "unavoidable traffic jams". After all, the section that is 24 lanes wide is only about 4 miles long .

Oh, and speaking of speed cameras, the other week we got a letter in the mail, and when my dad opened it he instantly looked at me with an angry look on his face. We had a picture of our Eclipse before the stop line at a red light, in the middle of the intersection at the same red light, and then going through it. We also had a close up of the liscense plate. Of course, we later found out that my mom was driving it that day

DiGNAN
13653

And you know, I am absolutely sure that people will still be going 60 in the 11th lane and suddenly will have to get off on an exit in half a mile, swiping everyone in-between. I know this because, as a person I once knew said, "people are stupid".

My personal favorite is hearing the commercials on DC101 or HFS about "aggressive drivers" and how the cops are supposedly sticking it to them just because they are aggressive drivers.

I wonder if anyone ever considered that aggressive drivers are born from idiot drivers who go 45 in a 55 in the left lane and refuse to yield right-of-way to ME! :)

(O|||||O)

...wonder if I should change my nick to DCJeep from ClemsonJeep...naaah. Tigers forever!

Just to note, in Pennsylvania, the keep right law was just passed a few months ago...note, that overtaking on the right is again, a separate issue.

Fly me to the moon...

Excellent! I think it would do well for those civil urban planning engineers to actually put some of the theories into practice in the US as well! :)

Calvin

Is your Eclipse automatic or manual?

Calvin

Automatic. It is technically my mom's car, and since she can't drive automatic I had no choice.

But you can definitely feel gear changes!

DiGNAN
13653

You have a slip in your message your mom can't drive automatic, and the car is automatic. ;) BTW The Auto tranny GSTs have a smaller turbo and significant drivetrain horsepower losses (50 hp loss).

Calvin "nit nit nit"

yeah yeah, I meant standard. Why did you mention the GST? Do you hae a GST?

DiGNAN
13653

In addition to Robs post about the M25 I'd like to point out that in some parts of the country (UK) there are some very special speed cameras!

These units actually calculate your average speed between two points and if it's over the limit they snap you and you will be fined/prosecuted - depends on the nature of the speeding. Rather nasty if you ask me. Most drivers just slow down for the normal speed cameras and speed up in between - can't do that with these.

M

The ones I have seen ( on Nottingham Ring Road ) actually face towards you, so they get a nice shot of your reg plate plus a picture of the driver. No more excuses about who was ( not ) driving the car at the time. Happy to say I also have a motorbike which allows speedier travel on that piece of road :-)

- --
Rod, UK Mk2 Red S/No.341