#292199 - 12/01/2007 18:44
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: wfaulk]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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Jobs has now confirmed outright in two interviews that the iPhone is a closed platform and that the general public will not be able to develop for it nor install any random software.
As far as it being OS X, the empeg runs Linux, but you're not going to get far installing The Gimp on it. It being "OS X" doesn't mean it a "Desktop installationk of OS X." Not to mention it runs on a Samsung processor anyway and wouldn't be compatible with any Intel or PPC binaries.
Jobs went on to say that Apple would be selling/providing additional software, but that the software would not all be written by Apple.
This drammatically decreases the tech appeal of the phone. Not the sexiness mind you.
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#292200 - 12/01/2007 19:53
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: hybrid8]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 23/08/2000
Posts: 3826
Loc: SLC, UT, USA
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Quote:
This drammatically decreases the tech appeal of the phone. Not the sexiness mind you.
Agreed. Man, just imagine what devs could do with this thing if it at least had an open widget or plug-in architecture. The mind boggles.
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#292201 - 12/01/2007 20:06
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: loren]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12341
Loc: Sterling, VA
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*edit*
I'm going to scratch my post here, and I wish I could delete all my posts in this thread because it's clear that I haven't been able to communicate my thoughts in a satisfactory way.
Instead, I would urge everyone to listen to Engadget's podcast #98 because I was surprised to hear that every single point they make, both good and bad are exactly what I have been thinking.
The only other question I had for the people posting in this thread is this: who thinks that the iPhone indicates a possible new platform for the iPod-only line? Is it a preview of the 6G iPod? Basically, I would love to see this exact device, with a hard drive, and without the space on either side of the screen. That was the exact product I was hoping for. Had that been the case, I would have sold my two-month-old Archos and made my first Apple purchase.
I also just want to say that even though it's barely being mentioned in the press, I was incredibly excited about the Apple TV. In fact, I just ordered one and the new airport extreme. So I've got some Apple products now.
Edited by Dignan (12/01/2007 20:30)
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Matt
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#292202 - 12/01/2007 20:21
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
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Quote:
And now after we've sufficiently argued all of this, who wants to take bets that people will figure out ways to reliably install user-created widgets?
Keep in mind that there will be at least two different kinds of applications. Depending on what sort of DHTML / JavaScript support they provide in the browser, it might be possible to develop "limited" widgets that can be installed through the browser. That probably won't give you access to all the hardware's functionality, but it will get you a variety of things along the lines of stock tickers / weather gadgets / sports scores / etc.
You probably need a "native" app if you want to deal with the microphone, speaker, and the radios (beyond just making a TCP/IP connection to a web site somewhere). That's probably going to be Apple-and-friends only.
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#292204 - 13/01/2007 04:16
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: tanstaafl.]
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veteran
Registered: 21/01/2002
Posts: 1380
Loc: Erie, CO
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Quote:
Am I the only one who just wants a phone that lets me talk to people once in a while -- and nothing more than that?
Just for you...
Outlines all the cool features of the new iPhone.
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#292205 - 13/01/2007 13:56
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: webroach]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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I would hope the next iPod rev while including a scren covering the entire unit would also include bluetooth and WiFi. Unlike the current slated specs for the iPhone, wireless sync should come standard. The ability to surf the iTunes store and buy tracks would also be pretty cool, though for me not a big deal (since I personally still purchase my music on CD). Internet audio streaming and movie streaming would be a must, if for nothing else than to preview clips and trailers of what you might want to buy. Then of course this could mean wireless sync and transfer between iPod and AppleTV. It goes without saying they should pick up the new 100GB 1.8" drives as a minimum for their higher end model. 100-200GB of flash RAM would be better, but I don't think that's realistic for a few years still. 
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#292206 - 13/01/2007 13:59
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: cushman]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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Actually I want a phone that's just a phone too. But I want it to look just like the iPhone and have WiFi. Oh, and gobs of memory and music playback. And Bluetooth of course.
Hmm.. Sounds like the iPhone. Oh yeah, I want it to cost under $400 without a carrier contract. Damn.
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#292207 - 13/01/2007 15:53
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: hybrid8]
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addict
Registered: 02/04/2002
Posts: 691
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Quote:
Oh yeah, I want it to cost under $400 without a carrier contract.
That's what I'm wondering about. I'm not going to purchase a 2 year contract to get the phone @ 599, but does that mean the phone will be $1000 without a contact?
How far into June do you think it will take for eBay to get flooded with cheap brand new iPhone's?
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Oliver
mk1 30gb: 129 | mk2a 30gb: 040104126
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#292208 - 13/01/2007 17:45
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: oliver]
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old hand
Registered: 23/07/2003
Posts: 869
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
How far into June do you think it will take for eBay to get flooded with cheap brand new iPhone's?
Irrelevant, unless they're also unlocked. And even if they're unlocked (getting more difficult these days... just try to get a Vodafone / SoftBank 904SH) you still won't be able to use the Visual (random access) Voicemail unless you're on Cingular. In which case, you don't need it unlocked.
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Dave
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#292209 - 13/01/2007 18:02
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: webroach]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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There's no sense in releasing a quad-band phone if it's locked - you wouldn't be using more than a single band most likely. Being tied in to a contract means Cingular gets your money - they don't need the phone keeping you there. Apple wouldn't have an interest in locking it for the first reason I gave (you couldn't use it to swap out to a different or prepaid SIM when traveling in areas that use other GSM bands, like Europe).
Interesting will be what kinds of partnerships they make in other countries. Apple is launching in the US first, but the product is obviously intended to be a global one - another reason for a soft keyboard rather than using a fixed qwerty design.
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#292210 - 13/01/2007 18:27
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: hybrid8]
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old hand
Registered: 23/07/2003
Posts: 869
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
There's no sense in releasing a quad-band phone if it's locked - you wouldn't be using more than a single band most likely.
I have to agree that there's no sense in locking them, but sadly, most are. I don't know about Canada, but in Japan ALL phones are locked to the carrier. I had to have mine unlocked before I had it shipped over. Check howardforums, you'll find that locked GSM phones are a huge problem in general.
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Dave
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#292211 - 13/01/2007 21:05
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: webroach]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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In Canada, typically subsidized and carrier-versioned phones are locked. I have not heard of tri or quad-band GSM phone here being locked here. That would prevent a different SIM card from being used whhen traveling - one of the basic benefits using GSM.
Many phones can be unlocked at home with some basic information from the net and others can be unlocked by people who do that type of thing for a small fee.
I won't buy a locked phone. Or rather a phone that can't be immediately unlocked. Likewise I'll never buy a CDMA phone and would never touch a TDMA handset again (is anyone still using TDMA?) Just to make sure everyone is on the same page, we're talking about SIM-locks which marry the handset to a specific carrier's SIM cards.
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#292212 - 13/01/2007 21:52
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: hybrid8]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 19/09/2002
Posts: 2494
Loc: East Coast, USA
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SIM locking seemed a non-issue compared to unhelpful cariers. I was unable to find European companies who would sell me a prepaid SIM for an American Cingular phone. There were all kinds of tricks like I needed an address in the destination country to register and refull the SIM, etc. For me, go ahead and lock my phone since I can't get other SIMs anyway.
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#292213 - 14/01/2007 00:29
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: FireFox31]
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old hand
Registered: 14/04/2002
Posts: 1172
Loc: Hants, UK
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I haven't had many problems getting prepaid GSM SIMs. For Cyprus I bought an official pack, for Italy ("Wind Mega No-Limit") it was trickier, but I used somebody in Italy who charges €5 to register them locally. For the US I have bought T-Mobile prepaid SIMs off ebay, for about $15 you get a card with $30 credit with a 4-6 week expiry. Annoyingly I bought one back in Nov and forgot to load another $10 which would have extended the other $30 until my next trip (SF/SJ, next week)
Gareth
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#292214 - 14/01/2007 02:32
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: FireFox31]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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Quote:
I was unable to find European companies who would sell me a prepaid SIM for an American Cingular phone.
Odd. All I did was walk into a cell phone shop in a mall in Cambridge, and walked out with an O2 prepaid kit. Came with the SIM that worked fine in my unlocked Sony Ericsson phone (from T-Mobile). It also came with a card that was usable at many ATMs to add more money to the prepaid account, and it worked into the Netherlands, Germany and Switzerland with no issues.
Also, unlocking phones if your provider won't is legal in the US under the recent DMCA exemptions.
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#292215 - 14/01/2007 04:36
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: drakino]
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old hand
Registered: 23/07/2003
Posts: 869
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
Also, unlocking phones if your provider won't is legal in the US under the recent DMCA exemptions.
Luckily, my phone was unlocked in Japan, so the DMCA is (for now at least) a non-issue.
And for Bruno, yes, we're talking about SIM locks.
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Dave
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#292216 - 15/01/2007 03:29
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/12/2000
Posts: 2665
Loc: Manteca, California
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I haven't read any articles that talk about the iPhones sound quality, as a phone that is.
Some how I suspect that the telephone audio doesn't go thru the same audio path the music follows.
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Glenn
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#292217 - 15/01/2007 18:18
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31600
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Was this already posted in this thread? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGXwtkXOjZw(We *know* someone who plays in Woz's Segway Polo league, y'know...)
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#292218 - 17/01/2007 22:16
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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Well, they announced the iPod sales numbers today, 21,066,000 for the last quarter that included the holidays. The iPod growth continues on.
As for the iPhone, they said in the earnings report that they hope to sell 10 million by the end of 2008. Thats still quite a bit for a $500/$600 phone, but I'm betting they will manage to do it. The phone still seems to have enough hype around it to carry it.
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#292219 - 17/01/2007 23:45
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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10 million units in 1.5 years isn't very high volume for a high profile phone model. However, I think that they're being conservative with their public predictions. I also can't see them keeping only the single model for 1.5 years, nor a US-only distribution.
It wouldn't surprise me if they did 20-30 million units (of all iPhones) by the end of 2008 if they open up sales to the rest of the world by the end of this year. If the price was lower I'm sure they'd do much higher volumes, but it would reduce their iPod sales without question.
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#292220 - 19/01/2007 03:38
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: hybrid8]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
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Quote:
If the price was lower I'm sure they'd do much higher volumes, but it would reduce their iPod sales without question.
My guess is Cingular will use the high price to attract new customers by offering rebates to new customers only. Either way, Apple gets its $$ and Cingular doesn't mind coughing up the rebates as long as Apple keeps Cingular as the exclusive seller.
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Brad B.
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#292221 - 21/01/2007 13:06
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 19/09/2002
Posts: 2494
Loc: East Coast, USA
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Quote:
as long as Apple keeps Cingular as the exclusive seller.
For a half year or so, anyway. After a short period of exclusivity, I'll bet the iPhone will appear on other American and international GSM networks. At least with Palm Treos, they are only exclusive to a network for a short time.
A CDMA iPhone on Verizon? Yeah, probably not going to happen. Sorry Verizon, you'll have to actually resume providing good service if you want to keep customers.
_________________________
- FireFox31 110gig MKIIa (30+80), Eutronix lights, 32 meg stacked RAM, Filener orange gel lens, Greenlights Lit Buttons green set
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#292222 - 13/03/2007 16:10
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: jbauer]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 12/02/2002
Posts: 2298
Loc: Berkeley, California
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I just came accross this on fakesteve.blogspot.com, thought it was hilarious: Quote:
Oh, one more thing. You're wondering how well the phone works. Well, it's amazing. The sound quality is like nothing you've ever heard. A few glitches with the screen but we're killing one Chinese engineer a day until our supplier works them out. Peace.
Matthew
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#292223 - 13/03/2007 17:46
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: matthew_k]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/01/2002
Posts: 3996
Loc: Manchester UK
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It's funny because it's true.....
I like the guy from Cisco's retort to Fake Steve's subheading on his blog:
We invented the friggin network router. Have you heard of it?
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Cheers,
Andy M
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#292224 - 04/06/2007 04:05
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: jbauer]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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June 29th looks to be the official date, revealed via new iPhone commercials that aired tonight. I'm pretty certain I'll be getting one at this point. The full web browser, along with wifi will make it very useful for me at work. It's also going to replace my podcast iPod Nano (the first gen scratches if you look at it edition), and likely will have some video podcasts/Daily Show syncing going on too. Still debating what to do about data access on it. So many places here in Austin offer free wi-fi, that it might not be worth paying AT&T for probably some ungodly rate on unlimited data. I think this will also be a good product to bring me into the smartphone era, after finding myself in need of a PDA like device with my current position. I'm not willing to touch a Windows powered phone with a 10 foot pole. Even today, I see the issues I had with my iPaq prevalent in todays Moto Q and other sleek looking devices.
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#292225 - 04/06/2007 12:27
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14496
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
... iPod Nano (the first gen scratches if you look at it edition)
Did that ever get corrected in later revisions?
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#292226 - 04/06/2007 13:05
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: mlord]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
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I've got a 2G iPod Nano and it's done an excellent job of staying unscratched, despite that I've treated it to a fair amount of abuse.
As to the iPhone, I'm going to let other people stand in line and be the first on the block to get it. Now if it had some kind of native Gmail support, then I'd probably go for it immediately.
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#292227 - 04/06/2007 13:29
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: DWallach]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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I'd probably pull the trigger on an iPhone if it came with 200GB of storage, primarily to use as an iPod.  Let's see if Steve was talking about the iPhone as the "awesome" iPod he hinted to in his interview last week or if there's in fact a new iPod with some touch screen goodness coming later in the year. This past week I made an adapter to connect my fiancé's iPod to her Pioneer IPBus head unit, so inevitably I ended doing some track selection and navigation. She's got a 4GB 2nd Gen iPod Nano I bought for her last fall. After using the interface for a while I've come to a conclusion. It sucks. The iPod interface stinks plain and simple. Not intuitive at all and a downright insult to use at times. Apple have made some serious progress with iTunes but the iPod has fallen behind dramatically. In only a few minutes I thought of a few ways to fix a number of the navigational issues and give the whole thing a much more fluid feel while opening up the possibility for additional input/config without adding any other buttons. Main issues are moving from one menu level to another as well as selection and deselection (exiting). The iPhone interface looks a lot more natural but I have my doubts it will be ideal out of the gate. Hopefully they're not averse to making corrections and updates down the road.
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#292228 - 04/06/2007 14:45
Re: Apple iPhone announced.
[Re: hybrid8]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12341
Loc: Sterling, VA
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Quote:
The iPod interface stinks plain and simple.
No arguments here. I only worry that they're afraid to change it for fear of confusing the millions of people who have an iPod and are so familiar with it. It would have to be a very intuitive interface with a very small learning curve.
That said, a touch screen is amazing for a DAP. I have the Archos 604 w/WiFi. It has a good amount of problems of its own, but it has a touchscreen interface and I love it. If I know what I'm looking for, it takes me approximately seven seconds to navigate to it and start playing.
I'm very interested in seeing what the next gen iPod would be like, though. I might be interested in getting one, but I know I'd still be dissatisfied with the limited codec support. I don't think I can live with that.
Edited by Dignan (04/06/2007 14:46)
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Matt
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