After some re-ordering of my playlist i was wondering why positioning in emplode looks different then is does on empeg. After searching a little bit through the BBS i found a thread explaining that the empeg player software will always sort alphabetically. Could anybody explain the reason for implementing this "positioning" feature in emplode ? Doesn't seem to make any sense to me ? Does anybody know if there are changes in the upcoming software release regarding ordering of playlists ? The second question that bothers me is if it will be possible to display the actual bitrate of the playing mp3 like winamp does ? Would be really interesting especially for VBR encoded files.

janosch

Happy MK II Blue owner

The alphabetic ordering on the empeg is so that you can jump in the
lists by pressing the letter keys on the remote - ie press 8 two times
and you're on the first song in the list that starts with an 'U'.

If you select the entire playlist it will play in the emplode
'position' column order (unless you've got shuffle on)

IIRC there would be some change as to how omplode ordered tracks
when you dropped a bunch at once into it from the explorer, but I
don't recall exactly what the new behaviour would be.

/Michael

If you drop a bunch of tracks from explorer, the new behaviour is to recursively sort them alphabetically by filename. This is to cater for people who have the track number at the start of the filename. I backported the code from v1.1 to v1.0, but I don't recall if it was released in v1.02, or if it'll sneak out in (a hypothetical) v1.03.


Roger - not necessarily speaking for empeg

if it will be possible to display the actual bitrate of the playing mp3 like winamp does?.

v1.1, dude .

Except that it only displays average bitrate, which isn't really that interesting for VBR files.




Roger - not necessarily speaking for empeg

I backported the code from v1.1 to v1.0, but I don't recall if it was released in v1.02, or if it'll sneak out in (a hypothetical) v1.03.

Behavior in 1.02: If you drop a folder from explorer onto Emplode, it will sort the files alphanumerically by file name.

Behavior in 1.10: If you drop either a group of files, or any folders, or a combination of both, from explorer onto Emplode, it will sort everything alphanumerically by file name.

Behavior in 1.03: WHAT? What on earth would we need a 1.03 for?


___________
Tony Fabris

After searching a little bit through the BBS i found a thread explaining that the empeg player software will always sort alphabetically.

I wanted to clarify, for anyone else reading this thread, that the player software doesn't really sort everything alphabetically.

The only thing that is alphabetical is the order of songs/playlists as they appear on-screen in the Playlists menus. This is to facilitate using the letter keys on the remote control to quickly scroll to a given playlist. This is only for display, it does not affect the actual play order of the songs.

The actual songs/playlists will play in whatever order you've set them in emplode. You have complete control over the play order in Emplode by selecting View/Details, clicking on the "position" column header, and re-ordering your files based on position.

___________
Tony Fabris

Behavior in 1.03: WHAT? What on earth would we need a 1.03 for?

Hmm.. maybe people won't want to wait for 1.1 before they can use their new tuner module..?



Rob

Speaking of said tuner module...
When can we expect shipping?

Speaking of said v1.03...
When can we expect shipping?

Speaking of said v1.1...
When can we expect shipping?


All very qoog questions, with equally interesting answers!

Smoker_Man
#080000449 MkII - 36Gb Blue

Worms, Can, 'nuff said.

Paul.

Paul Haigh, Reg. 4120
(mk1) 6GB, Blue, 00254
(mk2) 12GB, Red, 00357

I'll answer each of those in turn - the day before each appropriate answer.

Rob

The alphabetic ordering on the empeg is so that you can jump in the
lists by pressing the letter keys on the remote - ie press 8 two times
and you're on the first song in the list that starts with an 'U'.

I also would just like to clarify that songs aren't forced into alphabetic display, just the playlists. take the statement above and replace the word 'song' with the word 'playlist'.

I'd just like to say right now, read previous posts on this subject if you have a beef about how it is. It's been debated thoroughly (with me making a full prick out of myself just for defending something), and complaining about it more is just a waste of time. It would be nice to know what they ultimately decided to do in v1.1, but we'll have to wait and see (ooo, isn't that a novel approach!). Thanks!

DiGNAN
Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da, etc.

I also would just like to clarify that songs aren't forced into alphabetic display, just the playlists.

Oh my God, I never noticed that. You're right! Very interesting!

___________
Tony Fabris

Ok....thanks for all the answers. I just want to explain why this is an issue for me. On my empeg i have only playlists on the "top" or "first level" or "playlist root" or what ever is the right description. Most playlists are called like artists and the albums are one level deeper. But for songs that i just use "temporary" or i don't own the complete album like some char hits and so on i have 3 playlists on the first level called "Misc I", "Misc II" and so on. Having them between all other playlist is ok but i want to be able to access the really fast. I tried to put them on top and then on bottom. In emplode everything seemed to be fine. But empeg (now i know why) displayed them only in alphabetic order. I just wanted to know whether there are any changes planned in 1.1 (Yeah got this). In the meantime i put the ~ Character in front and everything works fine.

Janosch

P.S. Sorry for my shurely bad english. It's long time ago that i learned english in school

In the meantime i put the ~ Character in front and everything works fine.

Right. I do the same thing, my playlists are organized the same way. For me, either hypens or parentheses work, too. All of my "mood" playlists are in parentheses now: (Low Key) (Demo) (LAN Party), so they show up first on the playlist menu.

___________
Tony Fabris

I do that as well. I used hyphens until I found that it placed things at the end of the list instead of how Windows orders it at the front.

I understand how some people might want it the other way. The concession we came to at the end of this debate is that us users would prefer a check-box that would say something like "Order playlists alphabetically". At first people wanted it completely changed from alpha, but after some explaining of the remote shortcuts, I think we came to an agreement.

But none of that matters, it's empeg's call

DiGNAN
Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da, etc.

But none of that matters, it's empeg's call

Yup. The thing is, they have never expressed an opinion on the BBS about this issue (apart from an initial "we need this because of the alphabetic shortcuts"). That question came up at the US meet. My memory of exactly what was said is getting a bit fuzzy but it was basically Rob acknowledging that non-alphabetical ordering has been requested on the BBS and Hugo saying it won't be in 1.1.

I find it hard not to whinge continuosly about this (and a couple of other missing features - going back to the last place in the playlist tree and append of playlist without the remote) but I've decided to keep quiet at least until 1.1.

Borislav

*ATTENTION* This is not meant as a flame or argument of any kind, just a question out of curiosity ....

I just wanted to know some of the reasons that some folk want non-alpha sorting. I can understand extraneous playlists that you want in the front like "other" or something, then there're artists that I guess you'd want more accessible, but are there any other reasons?

I don't mean to malign anyone's way of doing things, it's just that I find the remote shortcuts so useful and quick that it would be rather painful if I didn't have them!

DiGNAN
Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da, etc.

I like that emplode alphabatises according to filename, but I don't like how the empeg does so with the order of the actual playlists. For example, within the playlist "Depeche Mode" I have individual playlists for each album. I like to order them according to year of release and emplode lets me do this but empeg doesn't acknowledge this. The only work around would be to put a year in front of each album's playlist. So, for NIN, "1989 - Pretty Hate Machine", "1990 - Head Like a Hole (CD Single)", "1992 - Broken", "1995 - The Downward Spiral" etc...

I only use the remote to change to the next visual and search. (and I only do that because there is no way to do it with out the remote).

32GB (JUST UPGRADED!) Mk. II BLUE
Detroit, MI USA
www.PfeifferBeer.com

Oh yes, now I remember. I was actually a fan of that myself. Unfortunately, I'm not sure empeg woud be willing to provide playlist by playlist alpha options. Wouldn't that be great to be able to list your artists the way it is now, then chrono your albums inside in any particular order. hmmm.

DiGNAN
Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da, etc.

reasons that some folk want non-alpha sorting.

I'd love a feature that would allow adjusting the mechanical alpha sorts into something more meaningful. Example: I'd like to have Marc Cohn, Phil Collins, Mauro O'Connell, Ry Cooder and The Robert Cray Band in this sequence under 'C'. A way to do this could be to use a dedicated sort field that is filled by default with the playlist name but which *can* be edited into something more meaningful . . .

I'll wait for 1.03 before listing it as a wish . . .

Henno
mk2 6 nr 6

Ah, and now I remember the other reason, the last names. I'm not too picky. I don't mind having Jerry Cantrell under the J's. I guess my mind just works differently than others

DiGNAN
Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da, etc.

DiGNAN: I don't mean to malign anyone's way of doing things, it's just that I find the remote shortcuts so useful and quick that it would be rather painful if I didn't have them!

Ah. And I don't use the remote at all in the car, except on those occasions when I have to change visuals to impress passengers (I don't use visuals at all, either :), so the remote shortcuts don't add any value for me. That's not to say they aren't useful for people who _do_ use their remotes, and of course I wouldn't advocate that the current way of sorting "go away" - just that a choice be offered.

Henno: A way to do this could be to use a dedicated sort field that is filled by default with the playlist name but which *can* be edited into something more meaningful . . .

Yes, exactly; and as it happens, ID3v2.4.0 supports sort keys for artist, album, and song title in ID3 tags, so as software starts supporting ID3v2.4.0, the "sort key" will be there for the using.

However, not only do I want to list "Phil Collins" under "C", and "The Police" under "P" (which I currently do by tagging them as "Collins, Phil" and "Police, The", which looks ridiculous on the Empeg's screen but does let me find them where they belong), I want to be able to sort albums in chronological order - or whatever order I want, really. I personally feel that if the Emplode user interface allows me to drag playlists around and reorder them, then when I turn on the Empeg I should at least have the option of seeing the playlists in the order I put them in; otherwise, I wouldn't have reordered them in the first place! :)


-----
Daniel M. Zimmerman, Caltech Computer Science
Mk.2 #060000058, 36GB
Mk.1 #00101, 10GB

I just wanted to know some of the reasons that some folk want non-alpha sorting. I can understand extraneous playlists that you want in the front like "other" or something, then there're artists that I guess you'd want more accessible, but are there any other reasons?

I'd like to be able to list the albums in an artist playlist in chronological order, and related artists next to each other in a genre playlist. Sorting artists correctly by last name (as mentioned elsewhere in this thread) will also be very nice.

Regards,
Borislav

I do the same thing. I name my playlists "Bowie, David" or "Murphy, Peter" and for something like "The Beatles" I simplay name the playlist "Beatles". My tracks are still named correctly, but I just alter the playlists.

32GB (JUST UPGRADED!) Mk. II BLUE
Detroit, MI USA
www.PfeifferBeer.com

when I turn on the Empeg I should at least have the option of seeing the playlists in the order I put them in

agree. Even better than dedicated sort fields

BTW I generate a catalogue of my CD's from emplode using a dedicated sort key in Excel: simple formula's that neglect the initial 'The's and 'A's in playlist titles so ('The Rolling Stones' become 'Rolling Stones') and extract the inititial 6 alpha's from the second remaining word (that makes these simply 'Stones'; plus a few macros that sort out the remaining inconsistencies so 'Dire Straits' are still inder 'D'). Works quite well: 6 pages with most of my CD's in a meaningful order . . .

Henno
mk2 6 nr 6

That's exactly what I did and I really enjoy being able to quickly jump to the intial letter of any artist with the remote. I also agree with Borislav that I would further like to sort albums of a particular band by year. You can accomplish that by preceding the album by a letter or number, but that screws up the lovely "search/append by source" feature.

Basically I'd like sort them any way I please and have the empeg respect that. The empeg could still jump to the first playlist that begins with an 'P' when I hit the '7' button. That feature would just be a little less useful if all the other 'P's were not adjacent. I would then alphabetize bands and chronologically order albums below that.

This is all rather petty complaints on such a great product. The only reason that I'm picking nits is that all my major needs (some of which I didn't know I had until I saw the feature) have been met.



-jim 080000260 w/18G in a Carrera