Unoffical empeg BBS

Quick Links: Empeg FAQ | RioCar.Org | Hijack | BigDisk Builder | jEmplode | emphatic
Repairs: Repairs

Topic Options
#304562 - 30/11/2007 04:44 New DSLR camera (to me)
hybrid8
carpal tunnel

Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
So I picked up a new Nikon D300 and 18-200VR lens today. Now what do I do?

I have only had a few minutes to play with it tonight and did so without even putting in a CF card. It shoots to its internal buffer in "demo" mode. In my very dim living room auto-focus was almost instant. It actually surprised me how fast it was. Of course I'll actually have to record some images and then pull them up on the computer to see for myself what the accuracy is like.

I've never owned a DSLR before and the lat SLR I used heavily was a Minolta X700. I've been in the market for an SLR since 1996, so after 11 years I've finally made my choice and picked something up.

My last Nikon was the E5700 which I had from 2002 until late 2005 or so. Abysmal low light performance (impossible to focus), though it had an excellent lens and made some nice images. This past year I had my brother's E8800 for a long time, which I couldn't stand, despite it also taking some nice pictures and having some similarities to the E5700. Function just seemed to be in awkward places and using the menu for everything was a real drag. Low light performance sucked less but still wasn't anything to write home about. I hate electronic viewfinders so it's a real treat to move back to an SLR.

Anyone have any interesting camera talk/tips to share? I know there have been a number of camera threads in the past so I know a lot of people here shoot. The noise at the DPReview forums makes them practically unbearable to even surf casually. The whole place just feels like the majority of posters have their heads so far up their asses I'm amazed they can see anything out the viewfinder. If I ever wrote anything like that on there I'm sure the followup would go past 100 in a few hours, all filled with drivel and threats.

The bottom line for me, is that I picked up this camera to start enjoying photography again and to be able to increase my control over what gets recorded. Being dead tired at the end of the night and looking at the 3/4" thick manual does leave me a little bewildered though.
_________________________
Bruno
Twisted Melon : Fine Mac OS Software

Top
#304563 - 30/11/2007 05:32 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: hybrid8]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1904
Loc: Leeds, UK
There are a couple of things I would try, I did and it really helped me....

1 - Find a good basic photography book, not one of those that tell you about how to transfer files from your CF card to the PC, but one on photography itself, go to your local book store and search one out, it doesn't matter how much you already know about photography if this is you first DSLR It's worth learning again.

2 - Use eBay to find a cheap prime lens, I'm a Canon person so I don't know the Nikon range (Edit see here), but I got a 50mm F1.8 for about £50 and it has really shown me what I can do with my DSLR. Zoom lenses are great, but a prime lens will force you to think about your shots and naturally improve. I have found that although this lens isn't the best quality best built thing out there it has been the most rewarding to use, of course the point of an SLR is to have a collection of lenses so I found this way a great way to make a start.



A recent shot I took from my table at a recent wedding with my 50mm F1.8, lighting conditions were very poor and I was sat across the room, flash was bounced off the ceiling, and knowing the bride I feel I captured "the moment" here.

Cheers

Cris.


Attachments
306306-IMG_7271.jpg (98 downloads)



Edited by Cris (30/11/2007 05:47)

Top
#304564 - 30/11/2007 05:41 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: Cris]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1904
Loc: Leeds, UK


Another shot from the same wedding, again in very poor lighting condition the speed of the prime lens really helped, here it opened up to F1.8, and a diffused flash (gary fong) was used, I also stood in front of a large mirror and as the couple danced passed me took a series of pictures.

A good flash may also be worth picking up if you are going to be taking lots of indoors photos, the in built flash will be rubbish, here I am using the Canon 580 EX and it was worth every single penny, my next step with flash is to buy a couple of cheap ones to use as remotes and trigger them via a cheap eBay trigger system, I have seen some very interesting results done with very very cheap old flash guns used in this way with a DSLR.

Cheers

Cris.

Edit - Just for info I was using a Canon 400D, 580 EX Flash Gun, Gary Fong diffuser and the "Nifty Fifty" Canon 50mm F1.8 lens.


Attachments
306307-IMG_7288.jpg (97 downloads)


Top
#304565 - 30/11/2007 05:42 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: hybrid8]
Schido
enthusiast

Registered: 29/03/2005
Posts: 364
Loc: Probably lost somewhere in Wal...
This is a nice site to (re)learn about photography technique:

http://photo.net/learn/

And here are a couple of good articles about nikon camera settings, not that much about the D300 yet though:

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech.htm
_________________________
Empeg Mk1 #00177, 2.00 final, hijack 4.76

Top
#304566 - 30/11/2007 13:02 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: Cris]
hybrid8
carpal tunnel

Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
I love those two shots. Very warm in look and mood, I feel like I'm actually in the room while looking at them.

I took a number of photo classes while in grade school (many years ago) and through high school just shot casually. In University I did a few more photo classes as part of my Art & Art History major. Photography and sculpture have always been my favorites.

I've got (at least what I used to consider) a really good book called Photography, by Barberra & John Upton (as far as I recall), but I've already started making a small list of some new titles I want to get, including Light - Science and Magic which looks like a fantastic "text" for al things lighting. And if photography is anything, it's about capturing the light.

Here are my other purchases to be phased in over the next few of months:

Induro CX-113 tripod legs (picking up on Sunday actually)
Really Right Stuff BH-40 ballhead, QR lever clamp, QR L plate
Gorillapod SLR Zoom and regular Zoom models (the regular one will primarily be used for supporting the flash off-camera in the field)
Nikon SB-600 speedlight
Lumiquest 80-20 bounce card with inserts and diffuser
Sigma 30mm f/1.4
Sigma 10-20 f/4-5.6
ND filters 2 and 3 stop
Nikon Circular Polarizer
Some B+W step up rings (everything is going up to 77mm)
Nodal Ninja 5 pano bracket


The above stuff before mid-April 2008, the stuff below can come after

A Macro lens I haven't decided on yet
Nikon R1 macro lighting kit (the little flashes can be controlled off camera wirelessly

Haven't decided if I get the below before or after April
Cokin P filter holder (I'll take the front two slots off to eliminate vignetting at wide angles)
A couple of Singh Ray graduated ND filters to fit the Cokin.

Because of the smaller DX sensor (1.5x/crop), I've decided on the Sigma 30mm as my "natural" prime. It was a choice between it and the Nikkor 35mm F2. I did in fact want to start with the prime, but I was able to get a slight discount on the Nikkor 18-200 by purchasing it now. I love shooting with small and fast lenses, which is why the 50mm I had for the Minolta was my favorite.

I consider myself above average with Photoshop, but I have never established any kind of workflow for photography, let alone ever worked with RAW images. I picked up Lightroom in the summer which has been great for managing collections, and making adjustments and exports here and there. I haven't begun to tap its abilities yet though (I hope Adobe doesn't screw this program up).

I've been reading Ken Rockwell's site for at least 5 or 6 years, however very irregularly. I take his writing style and sometimes over the top assertions in stride, and still get bothered when some others can't do anything but put him down. Classic jealousy IMO. I understand where he's coming from and I appreciate all the effort that goes into maintaining his site. His ideas and opinions seem to be heavily geared toward opening up photography to everyone, so in that vein he's sort of the anti-elitist which is part of what bothers a lot of people.

You don't need an SLR or good lenses to make great pictures nor to enjoy yourself making them. For me however, the look, feel and control afforded by an SLR do go a long way to making the process a lot more manageable and enjoyable. I always felt severely restricted and encumbered by the E5700, even though I have quite a number of great looking images made with it.

I've got to get a handle on all the basic settings and initial setup of this camera before I'll feel completely at ease with it and can start concentrating again on the art.
_________________________
Bruno
Twisted Melon : Fine Mac OS Software

Top
#304567 - 30/11/2007 16:01 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: hybrid8]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1904
Loc: Leeds, UK
Ah! I see you already have quite a background in photography, combined with what must be quite a large budget, I am sure your transition to a DSLR will be smooth.

I'm glad you like the pictures, they are supposed to be warm, I am trying to develop my own style. I want them pin sharp, well lit and you hit the nail on the head with "like I'm there". I don't think the lenses I have are up to the sharp bit yet, but I can work with them.



This is my mate who was sat next to me, I like this one for some reason.

Have you got a few shots from your new camera to share yet ???

Cheers

Cris.


Attachments
306319-IMG_7265.jpg (96 downloads)


Top
#304568 - 30/11/2007 16:10 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: hybrid8]
Cris
pooh-bah

Registered: 06/02/2002
Posts: 1904
Loc: Leeds, UK
Quote:
Really Right Stuff BH-40


That looks like a pretty nice head for the tripod. I have something much less expensive the Manfrotto 222. It's a joystick type head and really is quite an amazing thing to use, check one out if you get the chance, I love it.

Quote:
Nodal Ninja 5 pano bracket


I have the 3, great bit of kit so the 5 can only be bigger and better, you won't regret that purchase!

Quote:
I picked up Lightroom


Quite an amazing program, I was "trying out" Aperture, but Lightroom really blows it out of the water once you get the hang of it. I am not very good with photoshop myself so personally my aim is to get it as right as I can in the camera, I love Cokin filters but have yet to perfect the art of their use.

Cheers

Cris.

Top
#304569 - 30/11/2007 17:14 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: hybrid8]
DWallach
carpal tunnel

Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
I'll second the earlier recommendation for a 50mm prime. I've got a Nikon 50mm f/1.8, cost me maybe $100, and I take about half of my pictures with it. It's the best lens you'll ever buy and also the cheapest. Similarly amazing is the 105mm macro lens, if you're into that sort of thing. (The new one has vibration reduction; I have the older one.) The 50mm prime makes for a fantastic portrait lens and it's great in low light. It's also stunningly sharp. You'll compare the results with your 18-200 and it will make you cry (or, make you go out and buy other prime lenses).

I'll second your choice to go with the Really Right Stuff gear. I've got the quick-release clamp and the L-bracket, and they're absolutely fantastic. My brother-in-law, who does automotive engineering for a living (he works for Chrysler), was really impressed with the build quality and metal working when my wife got me that stuff for Christmas.

As to the Sigma 30mm vs. the Nikon 35mm, and any other lens purchases, you might want to wait. The rumor mill claims Nikon has some new prime lenses in the pipeline which may (or may not) be announced at the big PMA show in February. I agree that DPReview is too painful to bear. I have Nikon Watch on my RSS aggregator. That's a good place to keep up with Nikon tech announcements and rumors with fairly low noise.

About the only other gadget I'd recommend getting yourself is a decent white balance card. I've got a WhiBal card set. These are neutral grey plastic cards. When you're in a tricky light situation (florescent, incadescent, daylight, mixed together), you can take a reference photo with this and then, using something like Adobe Camera Raw, it's a single click to get the white balance correct, which you can then apply to all your other pictures in a single go. Well worth it. (I used to be insensitive to all these different variations on white light, but now the variation drives me batty.)

As to what to go and do with your camera, you clearly already know a good bit about photography, so the thing to do is to go out and do it! The main thing that's going to be truly new and different is the sheer joy of being able to shoot at zero marginal cost. You never take just one shot any more. You shoot a million variations on the shot. Why not! The screen, particularly with the color histograms, is fantastically helpful at helping you get ideal exposures and/or compensating when the exposure meter is off.

Top
#304570 - 30/11/2007 17:20 Re: New DSLR camera (to me) [Re: Cris]
hybrid8
carpal tunnel

Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
Quote:

That looks like a pretty nice head for the tripod.

I looked at a number of other designs and was initially leaning toward the Acratech products. The RRS stuff comes highly recommended and looks/sounds so bullet-proof. My only disappointment is that it looks like their D300 L bracket won't have an additional threaded mount for when you want to use it temporarily with a tripod or other mounting device that doesn't have a clamp on it. I'm going to ask them about tapping it for me though.

Quote:
I have the [Nodal Ninja] 3, great bit of kit so the 5 can only be bigger and better, you won't regret that purchase!


I looked at so many solutions for a long time. I was initially leaning toward the RRS stuff but the prospect of paying their price was killing me ($800). Of course the RRS clamps and rails look every bit as god as everything else they make. I ended up stumbling upon the NN site and lucky me, they're about to come out with the NN5 which is pretty much a necessity for the bigger D300. Of course after this discovery I was looking through some old email and found a message from a good friend with links to all the good stuff I had just been finding on my own (including a number of links to pano software)

Quote:

Quite an amazing program, I was "trying out" Aperture, but Lightroom really blows it out of the water once you get the hang of it. I am not very good with photoshop myself so personally my aim is to get it as right as I can in the camera, I love Cokin filters but have yet to perfect the art of their use.



I've written about LR in other threads here. I had a number of reasons for choosing it over Aperture, despite Adobe repulsing me. Aperture is slower, regardless of what hardware you have. Aperture sucks up HUGE amounts of disk space even when you managing images in their original locations - its previews, even at most conservative settings were just eating way too many GB of HD space. Aperture also has some awkward and senseless concept of hierarchy for organization. They couldn't just use simple folders and let the user decide what they mean. No, they create multiple containers and saddle them with different restrictions and meanings that you can't alter. And you can't organize them as you would a plain folder hierarchy. Even if I had a super fast system and gobs of HD space to burn, there's no way I could put up with this fundamental design flaw. Aperture just sucks for DAM, IMO.

I'm looking/hoping for serious upgrades to LightRoom of course. I'd like more speed, more intelligent/human tools and the ability for third parties to plug into the non-destructive adjustment workflow. One of the things it really needs is region-based selection - and hopefully something implemented with some new ideas (see LightZone). I'd also love to see support for bigger image dimensions (it's limited to 10k x 10k which won't suit panos very well at all, not to mention any GigaPixel images ) Having built-in support for HDR (High Dynamic Range) imaging with tone-mapping would also be very welcome.

My primary criteria in looking for such a program was asset management. With Aperture and LightRoom released there was also no way I was going to settle on a solution that required firing up Photoshop or otherwise didn't support non-destructive editing. Unfortunately, the only other possibility I found was LightZone and it's not strong enough in management and a few other areas, despite its fantastic tools interfaces. LightRoom was therefore the only choice for me.

There are also a few things I hope they don't do, but more for selfish reasons because they might conflict with some software designs I'm working on.

I haven't had time to make any shots worth posting with the D300 yet. Just finishing up customer support emails and shipping for the day and still have to tackle an initial proposal which I promised someone for this weekend. In truth, I probably could have waited a couple of weeks for the camera because I'm so bloody busy. But on the off chance I get a few minutes here and there at least it gives me the opportunity to gain some proficiency with its settings, giving me a better likelihood of making some pictures over the holidays.
_________________________
Bruno
Twisted Melon : Fine Mac OS Software

Top