Apologies if I'm dredging up old news - I just found this site tonight. I've been waiting for the price of the empeg, aka Rio Car, to get within range of my budget...and it looks like it has. However, I read off of PhatNoise that the Rio Car is being discontinued. Can anyone set me straight? Thanks!

You are correct on both counts. In fact, the price reduction is because of the discontinuation. But there is a large community support for the player and the developers seem to be far from abandoning us. In fact, a new version of the player software is in beta right now, and was initially released to us, IIRC, after the announcement that the product had been discontinued. Please go ahead and order one. You won't be sorry.

If you're able to jump in, now's the time to do it. Since the EOL announcement there has been much activity (and outpouring of support) for the RioCar/empeg.

Unfortunately not enough support to get the project back on the shelf. :) It's extremely hard building this type of product when you don't already have the big bucks and facilities to do it for a song. A price of $499 for the 10GB model along with some respectable retail placement and a little bit of promotion, would probably see the empeg sell like hotcakes compared to its past record.

Of course if that price isn't feasible for turning a healthy profit for SonicBlue, it can't happen. And so we're left where we are now. People are predicting equivalent products in the future (or better ones yet). Let's hope at least one of those next-gen products comes from the guys that have worked so hard on this one! They have a fantastic lead over any of the traditional audio companies in intellectual property for this type of product. That's an asset I hope is managed and leveraged aggressively in the future.

I would have loved to wait a bit longer and pick up an empeg for less than the current $699 (10GB model). But then I'd risk not being able to find one at retail if supply runs out. If the price stays the same until inventory is depleted, you'll probably see an above-retail markup on sites like eBay again.

It is a solid product with a solid foundation of technologies to expand on. EOL or not, it looks like a safe buy right now. Don't forget that companies like Alpine, Clarion, etc. EOL most of their components every 12 months or less! Most retail computer models have an even shorter life span.


If I've gotten too wordy, let me clear it up: BUY ONE. NOW.

Bruno

But with Alpine and the like, they have new products for you to buy when they put old ones out to rest.

Check out the FAQ at www.riocar.org for the straight dope on the story.

In my opinion, you should pick one up despite the face that they are being discontinued.

Don't apologize for asking a question like this. It is only "old news" if you have heard it before. I would hazard to say that the situation of the Empeg/RioCar is deserving of a FAQ entry -- or a "sticky" post that some BBSes have. Doubtful you'll be the last person coming here looking for the straight poop on "EOL".

[Oh, goody. There's still time to edit this post and make believe that I already *knew* there was a FAQ entry about EOL -- OK, OK, I haven't been hanging around riocar.org enough! Awright, time to delete that "hazard to say" bit, uncheck the "Mark as Edited" box, and I'm good to go!]

Short of urging you to buy an Empeg, let me give you my summary of the situation:

The folks in Cambridge have built a mobile music product that remains without equal. The devoted following it enjoys is due in great part, not only to the unequaled wonderfullness of the player software, but also to the open "hackability" of the Empeg itself.

The manufacturing costs of the Empeg relative to volume remained prohibitively high, however, for many consumers who wanted the MP3 functionality, but who would not pay a premium for the "geek"/hackable aspects of the Empeg.

For what I consider to be fairly rational business reasons, SonicBLUE decided that they could make more money by selling "OEM" Empeg software function to high-volume, mass-market manufacturers (Pioneer? Panasonic? Only time will tell) for inclusion in less-expensive, mass-produced mobile players. SonicBLUE got out of the automotive audio biz.

So, it seems fairly likely that you will be able to go to Best Buy or Crutchfield during the next year and buy something that has a lot of the software functionality of the Empeg (and which in fact shares the code base of the Empeg), but which will be cheaper and which probably has a snazzier faceplate. It may even integrate with that manufacturer's in-car systems in a way that is cooler (assuming you buy all of their stuff!).

On the flip side, the possibility exists that none of these OEM products will come to fruition. Whatever OEM products *do* come to fruition, it is *highly* unlikely that they will have a serial, USB, and ethernet port. Indeed, given mass-market manufacturers' desire for a "trouble-free", easy-to-use, easy-to-support product it is likely that the functionality may be dumbed down and that any "back-door" interface is closed. Don't look for an OEM Empeg with a command prompt!

It is not clear that the shift to OEM products reduces the prospects for the original Empeg. Sure, they are not going to be manufactured. However, if OEM products continue to use the "modularized" code base that we see in V2 (a complete reworking of the original Empeg code), then the base of existing Empeg owners represents a valuable resource of ersatz alpha testers for SonicBLUE/Empeg code destined for OEM use.

Should you buy one?? Well, IMO, the many CDR-based MP3 players do not address the fundamental problem -- how can I bring all my music with me and organize it the way I want? -- that Empeg does. I knew that Empeg would always be a good bet in this respect as I knew that 2.5-inch drive prices would continue to drop. Some folks on this board now have 98GB Empegs. Touch that.

OTOH, you may be able to wait a while and buy an OEM unit that has 90 percent of Empeg function with decent storage (say a single 48GB drive) for not much money.

Many folks on this BBS (myself included) have gone back, though, to buy a 2nd Empeg because they are reasonably certain that its like will not be seen again. There have also been recent posts here from Neo owners who bought Empegs upon the occasion of the EOL price drop and who appear to be ecstatically happy.

In the end, you are the only person who can make the choice. I would encourage you to look around the BBS and riocar.org some more to help you decide whether the Empeg is "right for you" . I hope this little treatise has helped.

[P.S. - Aside from volunteering to get shot because I was negligent of Tony's never-ending, all-encompassing, most-excellent FAQ labors, I would be interested to know if folks think I'm off base in terms of my summary. I do think that there are potential buyers out there who might ultimately feel unhappy buying an EOL Empeg -- folks who might be more satisfied waiting a bit and buying a simpler OEM product. Allan, I can't say enough good about the Empeg, but in the end it comes down to whether it is a good match with what you want. Fair?]

I would hazard to say that the situation of the Empeg/RioCar is deserving of a FAQ entry

Yeah, like this one.

Just shoot me.

But with Alpine and the like, they have new products for you to buy when they put old ones out to rest

Yes they do. But what does that mean for the older units? It doesn't mean anything. It means you're still stuck with an old unit that works for you. And if it breaks and is out of warranty, you get it fixed for a price. Whether you pay Alpine or someone else to fix it.

That sort of sounds like the situation we're in with the empeg. Except, the guys are still working on code. Not to mention third party development. Not to mention, apart from all that, if it does what you want RIGHT NOW, then even if no additional code is produced, it will still do what it's doing a few years from now. Same as any head unit.

Bruno

Oh I love my Empeg. I just think another year of them holding on the line would have proved fruitfull.

I t is very sad to see what's going on. Anyway, this product is just one from the many to come, but way ahead of it's time. As a proud owner, I'll try to keep it rolling as far as it's possible and kick ass to that Clarion/Pioneer/Aiwa mainstream ordinary people with my MKI.
Hope that software v2.0 will be finished and operational in near future, especially with MS Windows XP and that damn synchronisation problems.