#185466 - 20/10/2003 04:45
3.5drive in empeg
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 13/04/2001
Posts: 1742
Loc: The land of the pale blue peop...
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At the moment i have two empegs
There is my noraml empeg a Mk2a and my back up which is a Mk2
What i would like to do is put the mk2 into a dock which i have.
Ideally this emeg would have all my stuff stored in it as in Mp3s Now since it ain't going anywhere there is no need for it to be portable.
So instead of going down the slightly expensive route of getting two huge 2.5 drives could i get one 3.5 and install that in the dock and get a external power supply for it and plug that into the empeg.
I know it means that empeg is tied into the dock unless i take the top off dock and pull cable off the motherboard.
Is there any snags anyone can see or shall i splash out on a central and upgraded it.
_________________________
P.Allison fixer of big engines
Mk2+Mk2a signed by God / Hacked by the Lord
Aberdeen Scotland
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#185467 - 20/10/2003 05:18
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: thinfourth2]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 15/08/2000
Posts: 4859
Loc: New Jersey, USA
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It can be done. I know that Mark has tested out hijack using 128GB drives. There is a limit, based on LBA (that is from memory, please correct me if I am wrong), and a special kernel will need to be compiled to support larger drives. You would need to put an adapter on the laptop IDE cable, but you might be able to supply the power directly from the player.
_________________________
Paul Grzelak
200GB with 48MB RAM, Illuminated Buttons and Digital Outputs
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#185468 - 20/10/2003 05:24
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: pgrzelak]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 13/04/2001
Posts: 1742
Loc: The land of the pale blue peop...
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intrested in powering them off the player as the less stress on empeg the better
As to the adaptor where would i be finding one of those.
_________________________
P.Allison fixer of big engines
Mk2+Mk2a signed by God / Hacked by the Lord
Aberdeen Scotland
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#185469 - 20/10/2003 05:38
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: thinfourth2]
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old hand
Registered: 14/04/2002
Posts: 1172
Loc: Hants, UK
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The adaptor you need is the *opposite* of what most people are looking for - most people want to connect their 2.5" drive to their 3.5" drive cable, but you are looking to connect a 3.5" drive to a 2.5" cable.
This seems to be what you require, but best to check first (and shop around a bit more!):
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3436287534&category=41993
Gareth
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#185470 - 20/10/2003 06:05
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: g_attrill]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 13/04/2001
Posts: 1742
Loc: The land of the pale blue peop...
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yah [censored] dancer man an they anly dan the rad in pasiley
i'll stick me heed in there soonish
_________________________
P.Allison fixer of big engines
Mk2+Mk2a signed by God / Hacked by the Lord
Aberdeen Scotland
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#185471 - 20/10/2003 06:25
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: thinfourth2]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 09/08/2000
Posts: 2091
Loc: Edinburgh, Scotland
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_________________________
Rory
MkIIa, blue lit buttons, memory upgrade, 1Tb in Subaru Forester STi
MkII, 240Gb in Mark Lord dock
MkII, 80Gb SSD in dock
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#185472 - 20/10/2003 07:49
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: g_attrill]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3584
Loc: Columbus, OH
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The adaptor you need is the *opposite* of what most people are looking for - most people want to connect their 2.5" drive to their 3.5" drive cable, but you are looking to connect a 3.5" drive to a 2.5" cable.
Same adapter. Just don't use the power plug on the adapter!
_________________________
~ John
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#185473 - 20/10/2003 08:54
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: JBjorgen]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 02/06/2000
Posts: 1996
Loc: Gothenburg, Sweden
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Same adapter.
Hmm, I might be slow today (sinuses really letting me know that they exist)... but isn't there a gender problem trying to do that?
A socket that can accept a 3.5" cable header shouldn't be able to accept a 3.5" drive... or am I missing something obvious?
/Michael
_________________________
/Michael
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#185474 - 20/10/2003 09:14
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: mtempsch]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3584
Loc: Columbus, OH
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On the 3.5" side you just plug a standard IDE cable on it. On the 2.5" side, you may need one of these if the adapter won't plug directly into the header on the empeg board. I've used 3.5" drives with an adapter like this on SBC's that only had the 44 pin 2.5 in. header.
_________________________
~ John
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#185475 - 20/10/2003 09:24
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: mtempsch]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4180
Loc: Cambridge, England
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A socket that can accept a 3.5" cable header shouldn't be able to accept a 3.5" drive... or am I missing something obvious? The ones I've seen have been 44-pin female to 40-pin female plus power -- in other words, they plug into your motherboard, not your existing cable. (This rules out master/slave configurations, though.)
Peter
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#185476 - 20/10/2003 09:32
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: peter]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3584
Loc: Columbus, OH
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I've had several, and have never had one like that. They are almost always 44pin female to 40 pin male.
In the above picture, you could plug the 44 pin female end into the mainboard header on the empeg, then put a standard IDE cable on the 40 pin male end and plug a standard drive into it. Just leave the power cable dangling. (like I said in my first post)
_________________________
~ John
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#185477 - 20/10/2003 09:37
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: JBjorgen]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 02/06/2000
Posts: 1996
Loc: Gothenburg, Sweden
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Hmmm, where the #%!* did my reply go?
' nother try then...
you may need one of these if the adapter won't plug directly into the header on the empeg board.
yeah, I'm definately slow today. Never thought of plugging directly into the IDE header, nor using a simple pin list as gender bender...
@peter:
The 2.5" to 3.5" adapters I've seen have alll been the type to sit betwen the cable and drive, ie male/female.
/Michael
_________________________
/Michael
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#185478 - 20/10/2003 09:57
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: JBjorgen]
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old hand
Registered: 09/01/2002
Posts: 702
Loc: Tacoma,WA
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interesting couldn't someone who was really desperate for a new ide cable for their empeg get two of these adaptors then get a standard 40-pin ide cable and their problems would be solved? Maybe this should be a "last resort" alternative in the FAQ to getting an empeg IDE cable.
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#185479 - 20/10/2003 10:08
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: thinfourth2]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 29/08/2000
Posts: 14493
Loc: Canada
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This will work fine.
HIjack works with my 160GB drive no problem. The Empeg disk-builder unfortunately uses an older kernel, and so will not work correctly on drives bigger than 128GB -- I suppose one of us could hack the builder files to include a modified kernel without much fuss.
Simpler though, is to just use a Linux box to copy all the files from a smaller drive to the HUGE one after manually partitioning it to mimic a stock empeg drive (cp /dev/olddrive /dev/newdrive (raw copy of entire disk), and then change the size of the fourth partition on /dev/newdrive to use the entire free space, then run mke2fs on it with the correct options.. a small amount of research required, or just use a rescue disk from Redhat 6.2 (not newer)).
I'm visiting in Paris this week, and won't have access to my development system while away.
Cheers
Edited by mlord (20/10/2003 10:09)
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#185480 - 20/10/2003 12:23
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: mlord]
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old hand
Registered: 28/04/2002
Posts: 770
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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HIjack works with my 160GB drive no problem. The Empeg disk-builder unfortunately uses an older kernel, and so will not work correctly on drives bigger than 128GB -- I suppose one of us could hack the builder files to include a modified kernel without much fuss. hmm, wasn't there talk about an unpackager/repackager to make custom upgrade files a while back? it would be SO COOL to be able to include a hijack kernel and roger's addons to a standard developmental upgrade file.
then again, i'm doubting that the tools that the empeg guys are using are propietary... unpackager code is already gpl'd. be MUCH easier just to convince one of them to release the packager that they use.
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#185481 - 20/10/2003 17:24
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: image]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
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That would be cool to have all that stuff tossed into a .builder file, but I thnk Mark is referring to the builder utility that simply formats the drives for the empeg (and does not install the empeg kernal or software.)
_________________________
Brad B.
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#185482 - 20/10/2003 18:21
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: image]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
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Sven has already written a utility to create upgrade files.
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#185483 - 20/10/2003 19:22
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
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old hand
Registered: 28/04/2002
Posts: 770
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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That would be cool to have all that stuff tossed into a .builder file, but I thnk Mark is referring to the builder utility that simply formats the drives for the empeg (and does not install the empeg kernal or software.) the builder upgrade file is the same format as any of the regular ones, you see it go thru the motions (erasing kernel, flashing kernel, pumping partition). anyway, the builder seems to contain programs and scripts that prepare the partitions, which arent avaliable in the other image files.
come to think of it... easiest way to get over 128GB with the current builder image is to install hijack, then use the ethernet upgrader. it will leave the hijack kernel in tact, and assuming tat >128GB is compiled by default, this should work fine.
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#185484 - 20/10/2003 19:24
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: image]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
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Yeah. But you'd still need to partition the drive and format the music partition. The ethernet upgrader doesn't do any of that. The builder image is what actually does all of the stuff regarding creation of the various partitions and the formatting of each. You then load the consumer/developer image into those partitions with the upgrader.
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#185485 - 20/10/2003 19:35
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: tman]
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old hand
Registered: 28/04/2002
Posts: 770
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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wow, upgradespliiter is COOL! time to create custom distro images now. it can pump any partitioin, which means that we can populate the spare driectories (hd[a,c]2).so after tongiht, i should have an EXACT image of my empeg excluding music paritionis compiled in a simple .upgrade file.
and oh, i should make a builder upgrade with the hijack kernel too, huh?
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#185486 - 20/10/2003 19:41
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: tman]
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old hand
Registered: 28/04/2002
Posts: 770
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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The builder image is what actually does all of the stuff regarding creation of the various partitions and the formatting of each to experiment, i just did an ethernet upgrade using the builder image. worked like a charm. gives me the hijack screen, then goes into the 'drive already built' screen.
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#185487 - 20/10/2003 19:49
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: image]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
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I can't remember but you might actually need to have swap turned on if you're creating such large partitions...
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#185488 - 20/10/2003 19:58
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: image]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
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A while back, empeg said that they didn't want custom upgrade images being distributed with their code. This might have changed since then but you might want to check with empeg if you want to distribute any of your images.
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#185489 - 20/10/2003 22:25
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: tman]
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old hand
Registered: 28/04/2002
Posts: 770
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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well, this is very exciting. i've successfully created an upgrade file containing v3a3, hijack345+ext3, and a hda5 pump image containing the standard stuff plus e2fsck-utils1.32 (for support of ext3) and roger's base.tar.gz. right now, im right now trying to modify the builder upgrade to make a 32MB hda5 partition instead of 16MB. just need to find where the scripts are. i'm guessing the partitioning scripts are on the ramdisk.
i FULLY understand why the empeg guys didnt want anyone to distribute custom upgrade files. someone malicious can cause ALL kinds of trouble (i.e. hose your music partitions, trojanize your empeg, etc). so for the time being, this is for my own use and learning. but i'm sure that the PMs are going to come.
EDIT: i'm starting to think that the partition table creation is hard coded in the flash of the empeg or something, and some part in the upgrade file triggers it.
Edited by image (20/10/2003 23:30)
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#185490 - 21/10/2003 02:39
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: image]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5683
Loc: London, UK
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i'm sure that the PMs are going to come
ISTR Rob's last comment on the matter would work out to the effect that even if the PM's did come, you'd be in violation of empeg's copyright if you responded to them.
Giving other people instructions (or a script) to do this is probably fine, but distributing empeg copyrighted code is a no-no.
Of course, he may have relaxed his views on this matter recently. Until you get a definite yay or nay, I'd refrain from redistributing these combined upgrade files, publicly or not.
_________________________
-- roger
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#185491 - 21/10/2003 05:26
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: image]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 09/08/2000
Posts: 2091
Loc: Edinburgh, Scotland
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If there are issues around copyright, I would still be very interested in the steps required to create these upgrade files - mainly so I can have a very simple backup procedure, rather than having to rebuild then reinstall all the extras.
Any chance you could post a detailed walkthrough of your upgradesplitterbuilder process (I seem to remember trying a while back but getting something wrong)
_________________________
Rory
MkIIa, blue lit buttons, memory upgrade, 1Tb in Subaru Forester STi
MkII, 240Gb in Mark Lord dock
MkII, 80Gb SSD in dock
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#185492 - 23/10/2003 13:24
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: mlord]
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member
Registered: 21/01/2002
Posts: 107
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Has anyone heard from Mark, he hasn't posted since Sunday?
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#185493 - 23/10/2003 15:02
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: lothar]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
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He's in Paris according to one of his posts
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#185494 - 23/10/2003 15:42
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: tman]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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Actually, according to the post to which lothar was responding.
_________________________
-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
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#185495 - 23/10/2003 16:37
Re: 3.5drive in empeg
[Re: lothar]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 13/04/2001
Posts: 1742
Loc: The land of the pale blue peop...
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He is almost trackable if you follow the geocaching sites
_________________________
P.Allison fixer of big engines
Mk2+Mk2a signed by God / Hacked by the Lord
Aberdeen Scotland
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