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#5666 - 09/03/2000 10:03 Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

I've looked at the Sony RM-X2S remote stick controller (I believe this is generally available for about 20-30 UKP), and have developed a cheap interface for the empeg. The controller has 12 functions and I've added support for all currently available commands (except menu functions (I will when details are announced)). You can change volume, track next/previous, f/forward & rewind, rotate visuals, toggle display information, sound source selection, mute, power ON/OFF and FM tuning & preset selection. I've also added provision for a car phone mute input as well. Auto repeat with a glide rate increase is also featured.

The interface is housed in a small plastic box (about the size of a match box)with a single 9 way 'D' type plug with screw posts and a 3.5mm stereo jack socket to connect to the Sony stick.

If there was enough demand I could get a PCB layed out and either supply a kit of parts or complete units?

This design will not work with current kernel versions as it requires the current baud rate to be reduced to 4800. This I'm told is going to be the default baud rate when docked into the sled?

I'll update my empeg page with some pictures of the prototype at the weekend.
Drop me a line if you're interested.

Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).
_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5667 - 10/03/2000 12:35 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
Clarke
journeyman

Registered: 18/08/1999
Posts: 90
Loc: Scottsdale, AZ USA
Now that's something that I would pay bucks for! :-)

Consider me signed up for one and interested.

Cheers,

=-C

_______________________________
List 351, empeg 00045, 10gb, Amber
_________________________
______________________________________ Queue 351, Mk I, 30GB Mk II #60000022 80gb, Blue - docked Mk2a, 80GB, Bruface, lighted buttons and dial

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#5668 - 12/03/2000 08:20 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
Trapped
new poster

Registered: 09/06/1999
Posts: 7
Loc: Noordwijk, The Netherlands
I'd definitely be interested in this. One of the limitations I find with the current system is that the remote control is
easily mislaid (under seats etc.), and I haven't found any place to mount it so that it points at the Empeg IR receiver.

For info, the RM-X2S can be seen here.


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#5669 - 12/03/2000 20:15 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31534
Loc: Seattle, WA
Aw SHIT.

The Empeg replaced a stolen Sony CD player, which came with one of those. I think I threw it away after the CD player got stolen. Figured I'd never have a need for it.

(**Sound of Tony banging his head against the wall.**)

Tony Fabris
Empeg #144
_________________________
Tony Fabris

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#5670 - 12/03/2000 23:29 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
danthep
enthusiast

Registered: 29/08/1999
Posts: 209
Loc: new zealand
This sounds great, i was gonna get a kenwood steering wheel control, but these sony stick controls look like they might be nicer to use. And my car only has one stalk so i've got a perfect spot for it.

Will it be easy to change what the buttons do? Or is that programed into the little box? For instance i would never use on/off so i'd like to map that button to somethign else like shuffle control (which will be much more useful if empeg ever 'fix' that function and make it realtime).


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#5671 - 13/03/2000 03:56 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: danthep]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

In reply to:

This sounds great, i was gonna get a kenwood steering wheel control, but these sony stick controls look like they might be nicer to use. And my car only has one stalk so i've got a perfect spot for it.

Will it be easy to change what the buttons do? Or is that programed into the little box? For instance i would never use on/off so i'd like to map that button to somethign else like shuffle control (which will be much more useful if empeg ever 'fix' that function and make it realtime).


I can only control the functions that empeg give us in their serial command sub-set. No command exists to toggle shuffle ON/OFF yet. Nice idea though...
To answer your question, the current micro controller I have used is hard coded, no facility to map button functions. Just have to get it right the 1st time I guess. It would be a good idea to come up with a list of buttons to empeg commands, so we could maybe get empeg to implement any ideas, not already implemented when they get time?

Mine are:-
4800 baud when in sled

Additional ASCII commands:-
Menu entry command.
When in this mode, the Vol+ & Vol- commands act like the top & bottom buttons on the empeg. Traversing the menu is already done with the Next & Previous commands.
Menu exit command.
Toggle shuffle command.
Previous playlist command (places into menu entry mode, see above).
Toggle Mute command (All modes i.e., Radio, Empeg, Aux).
Check that the Play & Pause commands work in all audio modes.

Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5672 - 13/03/2000 03:58 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: tfabris]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi Tony,

In reply to:

The Empeg replaced a stolen Sony CD player, which came with one of those. I think I threw it away after the CD player got stolen. Figured I'd never have a need for it.

(**Sound of Tony banging his head against the wall.**)


What a bummer! A dull thud like noise...

Regards,

_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5673 - 13/03/2000 03:59 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Trapped]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

Thanks for the link to the RM-X2S.

Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).
_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5674 - 19/03/2000 03:26 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
danthep
enthusiast

Registered: 29/08/1999
Posts: 209
Loc: new zealand
From the beta 10 readme:

Many commands have been reinstated for use over the serial port as well as
new ones added. Use 'M' for menu and '*' for cancel.


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#5675 - 20/03/2000 09:09 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: danthep]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi

In reply to:

From the beta 10 readme:

Many commands have been reinstated for use over the serial port as well as
new ones added. Use 'M' for menu and '*' for cancel.


But the baud rate hasn't been changed yet to 4800. When it does, I can than continue with the Sony stick project. I now have a design that supports mappable buttons also. I'm keen to test it as soon as I can talk to the empeg at 4800 baud.

Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5676 - 20/03/2000 10:51 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
tfabris
carpal tunnel

Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31534
Loc: Seattle, WA
I'm confused as to why 4800 baud is a requirement. Didn't someone else describe (in a different thread in the "projects" section of this BBS) a fairly simple mod for his Peugot control stalk which talked to the Empeg at its default baud rate?

Tony Fabris
Empeg #144
_________________________
Tony Fabris

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#5677 - 21/03/2000 03:04 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: tfabris]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

In reply to:

I'm confused as to why 4800 baud is a requirement. Didn't someone else describe (in a different thread in the "projects" section of this BBS) a fairly simple mod for his Peugot control stalk which talked to the Empeg at its default baud rate?


That was my project you mentioned. In order to cost ruduce the interface, lowering the baud rate would be the 1st step. Empeg also commented that they intended to set the docked-by-default baud rate to 4800 for use with serial GPS's etc. but was left at 115K for some reason. An empeg menu or Emplode advanced option is required to set the docked baud rate (ideally using an empeg menu).

Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5678 - 21/03/2000 03:20 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
altman
carpal tunnel

Registered: 19/05/1999
Posts: 3457
Loc: Palo Alto, CA
The idea is we'll default to 4800, and then emplode will try pinging at 115200 & if the empeg doesn't respond, will switch to 4800 and send a "switch baud rate to 115200" command.

This way, if you make a new gadget for the serial, it can start at a low rate and step up as necessary.

This is a slightly far-off change though, as it requires the gadget to talk the error-corrected serial protocol that emplode uses. I suspect a line in the ini file on the empeg will appear first.

Hugo



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#5679 - 21/03/2000 03:30 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Clarke]
rafran
new poster

Registered: 21/03/2000
Posts: 26
Im also very interested in this. And wouldn't you know it, I just so happen to have one of these remotes that just became available for empeg adoption (r.i.p. Sony cd player).

Rick (sn 00129,4 gb,blue)
_________________________
Rick (MkII #80000150 w/tuner & stalk, 40gb)

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#5680 - 21/03/2000 08:12 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: altman]
mac
addict

Registered: 20/05/1999
Posts: 411
Loc: Cambridge, UK
If we make the default docked baud rate 4800 and have a config.ini line to set it to something else (if required) then is this likely to cause problems for anyone? Does anybody actually synchronise whilst the unit thinks it is in-car?

--
Mike Crowe
I may not be speaking on behalf of empeg above :-)
_________________________
--
Mike Crowe

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#5681 - 21/03/2000 08:42 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: mac]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi Mike,

In reply to:

If we make the default docked baud rate 4800 and have a config.ini line to set it to something else (if required) then is this likely to cause problems for anyone? Does anybody actually synchronise whilst the unit thinks it is in-car?


Well, I do use the 115k rate in my existing stick controller, but I'm very keen to have it set to 4800, then I could move forwards with the Sony stick interface etc. One thing, assuming you needed the developer image loaded to edit the config.ini file to say 9600 or 4800 (something other than 115k), the empeg in developer mode spews out a lot of ASCII down the serial port. At anything slower than 115k I would expect the empeg to start to slow down a tad as the data is queued out the UART (unless a very large TX FIFO buffer is used?)? So, I guess having the default baud rate set to 4800 (not requiring the developer image - or a means to set the logging method i.e. NON, FULL, VERBOSE & TERSE is the best option. Something to think about...

4800 baud when docked please..

Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5682 - 21/03/2000 13:48 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: altman]
Verement
journeyman

Registered: 02/09/1999
Posts: 97
Loc: Boston, MA, US
This way, if you make a new gadget for the serial, it can start at a low rate and step up as necessary.

This is a slightly far-off change though, as it requires the gadget to talk the error-corrected serial protocol that emplode uses. I suspect a line in the ini file on the empeg will appear first.


In cases where we don't have a lot of control over the serial gadget, rate negotiation isn't helpful. So I think it should always be possible to configure a fixed rate for the serial port.

Then again, my uses for the serial port have nothing to do with emplode or the player so rate negotiation is probably moot; I'd just as well stty the port myself to the right speed and tell the player to ignore it. It would still be nice to be able to control the player though... perhaps through a pipe or socket.


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#5683 - 21/03/2000 13:54 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
bonzi
pooh-bah

Registered: 13/09/1999
Posts: 2401
Loc: Croatia
John, if you ever decide to make a couple of these thingies, count me in. (Design only will not work for me - I have two left hands (as we say here) and am no better with soldering iron than with the ordinary one :)

Dragi "Bonzi" Raos
Zagreb, Croatia
#5196
_________________________
Dragi "Bonzi" Raos Q#5196 MkII #080000376, 18GB green MkIIa #040103247, 60GB blue

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#5684 - 21/03/2000 13:59 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: mac]
TommyE
enthusiast

Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 356
Loc: NORWAY
At least I'm not syncin' in car.

I would love 4800bps when docked. This way I can use my slow PIC16c84 project to
mute the empeg on GSM calls.

TommyE


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#5685 - 21/03/2000 14:23 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: bonzi]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

In reply to:

John, if you ever decide to make a couple of these thingies, count me in. (Design only will not work for me - I have two left hands (as we say here) and am no better with soldering iron than with the ordinary one :)


OK, watch this space or my empeg page for details. http://www.bjnet.demon.co.uk/Empeg/Empeg.htm

Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5686 - 22/03/2000 03:47 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
Lord Bleys
member

Registered: 30/12/1999
Posts: 143
Line dropped. I'm in (this is JUST the kind of thing I need, BigJohn).

I'm going to pick up the RM-X2S this weekend in preparation for completion at a TBD date.

-- Bleys

"If you would judge, understand." -- Seneca
_________________________
"If you would judge, understand." -- Seneca

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#5687 - 04/04/2000 03:21 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
Henno
addict

Registered: 15/07/1999
Posts: 568
Loc: Meije, Netherlands
John,

How about the 'Volume Bug' that's so prominently reported about elsewhere on this BBS. Apparently the panel of the Empeg player is sending the 'button up' command twice to avoid running away volume adjustments.

Will you (need to) do something similar for the remote stick you're building?

Henno
# 00120 (6GB+18)
_________________________
Henno mk2 [orange]6 [/orange]nr 6

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#5688 - 04/04/2000 03:42 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Henno]
rob
carpal tunnel

Registered: 21/05/1999
Posts: 5335
Loc: Cambridge UK
The bug to which you refer has nothing to do with setting the volume - it's a problem with missing key-up commands from the front panel buttons. This only applies to an internal empeg interface - John's project uses the serial port and cannot possibly be affected by this issue.

Rob



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#5689 - 04/04/2000 04:05 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: rob]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi Henno & Rob,

In reply to:

The bug to which you refer has nothing to do with setting the volume - it's a problem with missing key-up commands from the front panel buttons. This only applies to an internal empeg interface - John's project uses the serial port and cannot possibly be affected by this issue.


That's right. No problem using the stick controller, except when it's in repeat mode and the rate ramps up, the empeg can skip commands. This isn't a problem that it doesn't keep up as the rate is quite high by then and you'd hardly notice it.

Regards,




_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5690 - 04/04/2000 23:48 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
Lord Bleys
member

Registered: 30/12/1999
Posts: 143
John,
I'm still running beta 10 (NOT beta 10a) because I don't care to confirm/set visuals on every time I boot the unit in the car. I'll switch to 10a (or whatever is current) when you've got closure on your project and I have one in my possession.

I am curious, though, if there's a quick methodology to enable visuals via the stick controller (i.e. a single button press?). I'm also curious if there's a macro I can set/control that might allow the unit to enable visuals for me when the stick controller gets power AND detects that the Empeg is present and on.

Or am I smoking crack?

-- Bleys

"If you would judge, understand." -- Seneca
_________________________
"If you would judge, understand." -- Seneca

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#5691 - 05/04/2000 11:37 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Lord Bleys]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

In reply to:

I'm still running beta 10 (NOT beta 10a) because I don't care to confirm/set visuals on every time I boot the unit in the car. I'll switch to 10a (or whatever is current) when you've got closure on your project and I have one in my possession.

I am curious, though, if there's a quick methodology to enable visuals via the stick controller (i.e. a single button press?). I'm also curious if there's a macro I can set/control that might allow the unit to enable visuals for me when the stick controller gets power AND detects that the Empeg is present and on.

Or am I smoking crack?


There is no single button to enable visuals, but a button allocated to cycle them. More importantly, there is a button to toggle text modes. So, hitting that button twice from power up will remove the default textuals and you'll be back where you were before you stopped. My unit will be able to accept macros and re-mappable buttons at a later date.

Regards,





_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5692 - 05/04/2000 11:39 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: rafran]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

In reply to:

Im also very interested in this. And wouldn't you know it, I just so happen to have one of these remotes that just became available for empeg adoption (r.i.p. Sony cd player).


Keep an eye on my empeg page for details: -
http://www.bjnet.demon.co.uk/Empeg/Empeg.htm


Regards,



_________________________________________
John, (S/No 0114, 20G).

_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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#5693 - 07/04/2000 22:43 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
Lord Bleys
member

Registered: 30/12/1999
Posts: 143
Ahh, thanks!

-- Bleys

"If you would judge, understand." -- Seneca
_________________________
"If you would judge, understand." -- Seneca

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#5694 - 16/08/2000 19:10 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: Big John]
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
So... What's going on with this RM-X2S project? Is it compatible with the MkII? This interests me greatly... I haven't seen any news since March or so... Big John, do you still have plans to put the interface thing on a PCB?
Thanks.
-Tony

_________________________
- Tony C
my empeg stuff

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#5695 - 22/08/2000 07:03 Re: Sony RM-X2S Stick Controller [Re: tonyc]
Big John
member

Registered: 05/10/1999
Posts: 126
Loc: Hants, UK.
Hi,

So... What's going on with this RM-X2S project? Is it compatible with the MkII? This interests me greatly... I haven't seen any news since March or so... Big John, do you still have plans to put the interface thing on a PCB?

You're right, no updates since March. This is the saga :-

Spent some time in April designing a PCB for the controller project. Got a batch of PCB's made, 10 of these assembled into units. This batch was an intrim design that used non-SMT components for development and home assembly.

The design works, the PIC software requires some small tweaks and some serious testing on MK1 and MK2's. Then my life took a 'U' turn and I'm still picking up the pieces...

I'm hoping to complete the software this week and will be offering a few early interested parties a unit for test purposes. The next unit will be SMT and a lot smaller.

Limitations of use
------------------

Currently, the unit has pre-programmed button/command operations, I've designed the hardware of the unit to be programmable, just needs additional software later on.

The RM-X2S can be fitted either side of the steering column, so I guess I'd better take this into account too.

The MK-II has two essential missing cables in the RS232 wiring loom (will be rectified in the next batch produced), so some additional wiring will have to be implimented between my product and the empeg's harness for those looms effected.


Regards,


_________________________________________
John, (MK1 114-20G, MK2 15-36G).
_________________________
[color:yellow]_________________________________________John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).</font color=yellow>

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