At the uppermost layers, where "blindly believe this" proclamations generally originate, the "Church" for much of the past 1000 years has been little more than a massive Mafioso style of organisation. Much much more concerned with profit and politics than with understanding what God wants.

So "church as a whole" has zero weight for me, despite the years I wasted trying to figure them out.

The translation you're quoting is probably not true to the original speech, so I wouldn't place absolute trust into specific words translated 3rd hand from somebody's memoirs that were likely written far after the original conversations.

The general gist of it, sure, but specific wordings? Forget it.

Cheers