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To be honest, I only got into this conversation because it seemed innocent enough at first.

I think this conversatoin was, is, and will continue to be very innocent. I wasn't saying that we need more conservatives to come to your rescue. I was saying it would be a more fun debate with more shades of conservative opinion mixed in.

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The hate is 10 times worse than the stuff that turned me away from the Republican party during Clinton's stay in office.

Well, I start with the theory that the amount of "hate" directed towards a politician should be proportional to the seriousness of the mistake they made. And if you ask me, sending our boys to die in a war that has nothing to do with "winning the war on terror" (not to mention spending an absurd amount of money on said war) is WAY more than 10 times worse than Clinton cheating on his wife. One mistake has killed more than a thousand American soldiers, squandered the US's good will in the international community, and thrown gasoline on the raging wildfire that is the middle east region. The other mistake, at the most, strained a single marriage with infidelity, something Americans everywhere are doing on their own. I'll take one strained marriage over a thousand deaths (and untold future consequences) any day.

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I admit that it's no fun getting piled on here

I've said this to you before, but it bears repeating. There is definitely hatred towards Bush here, but I don't think anyone here hates anyone with a conservative ideology. If anyone does truly hate all conservatives, then they're not reasonable people and would probaby have exposed themselves as idiots by now. Since that hasn't happened, I'm of the opinion that all of these debates have been strictly about the issues, and what's best for America (and, depending on the discussion, the world in general.) The hate that you're seeing is hate directed towards the current administration, and if you're taking that hate personally, I don't know how to change your mind. But from my perspective, I don't see anyone here who thinks any less of YOU because of YOUR beliefs.

As for Teresa, individual interpretations of "attractive" differ, but the woman is 65. I think any man in his right mind would hope and pray that his wife looks as good as she does at 65 (with the obvious exception of your carefully-chosen picture.)
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- Tony C
my empeg stuff