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Sheesh. JeffS + Post-On-Any-Topic = Intense-relgious-discussion. I guess it's been a while since we've had one of these and we were about due.


I think what it is Jeff is that there are two camps which can never come to a mutually agreeable concept of reality. And that's not neccessarily negative. But the fact remains that those who believe in a thing and those who do not really have no acceptable middle ground: you can't "kinda believe in somthing you don't bellieve in" or vice-versa.

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Anyway, I'm just chiming in to say that I'll take both science and religion and don't feel that I need to choose between them. I don't have any desire to disprove the Big Bang, and I'll take all the cures for desieses that science can give me. There are places where the Science and faith don't quite meet, it's true, and I'm OK with that. I don't know everything, and somtimes we humans get things wrong. Through research and/or enlightment I'm sure we'll get it right some day- and if we don't in my lifetime I'll understand in heaven. As I've said before, the central idea of Christianty is salvation by grace through faith, not to combat science.


I've said it before and I'll say it again: you are not the standard Christian in this country, Jeff. Thankfully.

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While I"m posting, though, I do have an observation. I understand that a bunch of you look at Christiaty like a common myth- given that you aren't believers this makes complete sense- I don't see why Christiantiy would be treated any differently than any other belief system in your eyes. At least you're level headed not to try and hedge your bets the way most people do. That being said, I do get the sense that some of the language being chosen in recent posts is a deliberate attempt to shock myself or John (while other statements and posts are clearly intended to simply lighten the discussion). Honestly this doesn't bother me (disbelief is the same whether it is attempting to be shocking or not), and I might be misunderstanding the intent, but if some of these words are being choicen for the purpose of tweaking those who are Christians to get a rise out of us, I think other language might serve the discussion better.


I'm gonna guess that you're referring to my using the term "all-powerful sky faerie" to talk about your diety. I mean no offense by it, honestly, and I certainly don't use it to shock you. I use the term for two reasons: (1) I don't believe in your diety at all, and to me it seems no more believable than faeries. And in your belief system, the diety is omnipotent. Hence, to me, the diety represents an all-powerful faerie in the sky. (2) I refuse to use thee term "god" for a specific individual. That usage is nothing more, historically, than an attempt to disempower the dieties of other belief systems (also known as "gods").

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I honstly do hope and pray that some of you will come around to trust in Jesus for salvation, and if it ever happens I'll know this for certain: it won't be a wishy-washy, "I'm trying Christiantiy because everyone else is doing it" kind of faith. Though if some of you became believers it might shake the faith up quite a bit!


Thank you for the vote of confidence Jeff. Sadly though, you're wrong: if we became believers, we wouldn't shake up anything, because the process of becoming believers would entail giving up that part of ourselves which questions, which requires tangible, testable evidence. You won't find your diety in a petri dish unless you decided you would before even looking.

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At any rate, I'm fairly convinced that I'm not going to say or do anything on this BBS that will ever make any of you change your minds, but I can still hope that God works in your lives elsewhere to bring you to Him.


You're right Jeff, at least as far as I'm concerned. Nothing you say will change my mind, because I've heard the arguments. I've weighed the evidence and found it wanting. So you see, it isn't something you can do, making me change my mind. The evidence would have to. And there is NO evidence for your diety that can't also be attributed to any all-powerful sky faerie I choose to imagine.

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I remain happy that this board allows such an honest and open exchange of ideas from such diverse belief systems, usually in the most respectful way possible. There are very few places that I've experienced this.


I couldn't agree more. I think the fact that we can have pretty heated debates about such a loaded topic and still remain friends speaks volumes about the community here.
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Dave